Too old to go?
Jul 10th, 2005, 04:30 PM
#21
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If you think you are old now, I pity you when you reach 70.
I had two three week driving trips through France and never met a rude Frenchman. On the contrary, many were very helpful.
Skip the barge trip, buy a new rocking chair and sit on the front porch counting cars going by.
I had two three week driving trips through France and never met a rude Frenchman. On the contrary, many were very helpful.
Skip the barge trip, buy a new rocking chair and sit on the front porch counting cars going by.
Jul 10th, 2005, 04:36 PM
#22
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annealex, LOL, I support your comment. We have one family member, about 40 years old, that is the biggest "grump" when it comes to travelling that you could ever meet. He evidently has decided to do the world a favor as last year he announced "I am never travelling anywhere again". We all breathed a sigh of relief for countries everywhere.
Jul 10th, 2005, 04:39 PM
#23
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If you're for real, and not a troll as I suspect, have you considered barge trips in England, Ireland, Scotland, Germany, Holland and Belgium in addition to France? Have a look here:
http://europeforvisitors.com/europe/...ge_cruises.htm
Re: the French attitude -- funny how some automatically translate "attitude" to mean "rude". Where did that come from? I've experienced varying degrees of "attitude" in France (hasn't everyone?) - everything from superiority, aloofness, humor, impatience, helpfulness, disdain and, yes, rudeness. I also experience those attitudes at home but if a visitor here made a comment about "American attitude" I certainly wouldn't jump to conclude that they actually meant <i>rude</i>.
http://europeforvisitors.com/europe/...ge_cruises.htm
Re: the French attitude -- funny how some automatically translate "attitude" to mean "rude". Where did that come from? I've experienced varying degrees of "attitude" in France (hasn't everyone?) - everything from superiority, aloofness, humor, impatience, helpfulness, disdain and, yes, rudeness. I also experience those attitudes at home but if a visitor here made a comment about "American attitude" I certainly wouldn't jump to conclude that they actually meant <i>rude</i>.
Jul 10th, 2005, 04:40 PM
#24
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Check out the river cruises offered all over Europe. We've been very pleased with Viking (see www.vikingrivers.com). Accomodations, meals, tours - all fabulous. Based on the reports of others, our next one may be one that includes the Mosel.
Jul 10th, 2005, 05:22 PM
#26
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My husband is 77 and I am in my seventies (ahem!)...we are going to France for 7 weeks in September. I have no fear whatsoever about the people, the country, or the trip and we are doing it independently.
We are very excited and what is really helping us is reading books about the French and their culture, written by Americans who have moved to France. (C'est La Vie and Almost French are two of the 5 I have purchased).
I think the more you know about a culture the less "threatening" it might seem.
I have gotten a better idea of the differences between the cultures. What is so exciting to us is that the French people love to talk about politics, religion and the like...forbidden topics here.
I do think if you make a list of the good things you can look forward to (there is wonderful food on the French barge trips I hear), you might change your mind about the French "attitude" (whatever that is).
We are very excited and what is really helping us is reading books about the French and their culture, written by Americans who have moved to France. (C'est La Vie and Almost French are two of the 5 I have purchased).
I think the more you know about a culture the less "threatening" it might seem.
I have gotten a better idea of the differences between the cultures. What is so exciting to us is that the French people love to talk about politics, religion and the like...forbidden topics here.
I do think if you make a list of the good things you can look forward to (there is wonderful food on the French barge trips I hear), you might change your mind about the French "attitude" (whatever that is).
Jul 10th, 2005, 05:28 PM
#27
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In 1999 during my first trip to Paris I did consider the French rude. But now I know better. I thought when they slapped my hand when I touched their brochures on counters they were rude. And when I attempted to self-serve myself by taking a wax pastry bag for my croissant and they grabbed it back out of my hand, substituting a smaller one, I thought they were rude. Now I know the truth. I wasn't playing by their rules and their rules should be respected. Last week in Venice, I waited before asking to touch a piece of art. The woman in the shop laughed and said "go ahead" and "I really appreciate your asking... So many don't ask!" I told her I wanted to be respectful and she smiled. Next time I'm in France I won't touch anything in the pastry shop. I will point politely and wait patiently. We Americans are touchy types and used to self service.
Jul 10th, 2005, 05:40 PM
#28
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Cannot help you with the barge issue but I can tell you that my parents travelled well into their 80s. In fact I remember my mother being very upset when she arrived in London - age 82 - and they wouldnt let her rent a car!! She was infuriated about 'age discrimination'!! They were testament to age being a state of mind.
If you can walk up and down a set of stairs you can go anywhere. It seems there are ways 'around' most other health issues.
In defense of the French, I found the German 'attitude' on Lufthansa much worse. It is a matter of understanding another culture and way of thinking. One of the great things about this forum is that it helps us all to understand more than we would otherwise know.
I have since learned that Australians and Germans have an entirely different sense of humour and now look forward to visiting Germany
If you can walk up and down a set of stairs you can go anywhere. It seems there are ways 'around' most other health issues.
In defense of the French, I found the German 'attitude' on Lufthansa much worse. It is a matter of understanding another culture and way of thinking. One of the great things about this forum is that it helps us all to understand more than we would otherwise know.
I have since learned that Australians and Germans have an entirely different sense of humour and now look forward to visiting Germany
Jul 10th, 2005, 05:56 PM
#29
My parents (early 70's) recently took a barge cruise on the Danube w/ a tour featuring Budapest and Vienna (among other places). I believe the company was Grand Circle. They enjoyed it very much. This would get you the barge experience and you wouldn't have to deal with "french attitude" since that appears a problem.
Jul 10th, 2005, 06:06 PM
#30
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Even if you can't walk up and down a set of stairs you can go almost everywhere. I swear it ! 
By the way..what's "attitude" ? If I understand it well, it has nothing to do with nationality....looks like more cultural or just different usages.
By the way..what's "attitude" ? If I understand it well, it has nothing to do with nationality....looks like more cultural or just different usages.
Jul 11th, 2005, 12:46 AM
#31
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Uh, as Annealex mentions....on your first day in France how are you supposed to know you should not touch the brochures, help yourself when it looks like you should help yourself? And, remember, we're told so often "the French can tell an American a mile away". So, why the hand-slapping? That IS rude....there are much nicer ways to get your point across than hitting someone.....
Jul 11th, 2005, 02:51 AM
#32
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I am not French, and I am not American, but I think different about the hand slapping. If somebody slapped my hand and had a facial expression to go with it, I would take it as playful. Like I was a little kid in need of little "correction". I donīt think those "hand slappers" meant to be rude.
Jul 11th, 2005, 03:26 AM
#33
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Hello . . . earth to American travelers . . . :
" I thought when they slapped my hand when I touched their brochures on counters they were rude. And when I attempted to self-serve myself by taking a wax pastry bag for my croissant and they grabbed it back out of my hand, substituting a smaller one, I thought they were rude. Now I know the truth."
The TRUTH is that THOSE people were rude, NOT you. Courtesy is the art and practice of making those around you as comfortable as possible. This was certainly not the intention of the rude shopkeepers who actually touched YOU without permission, as opposed to your touching a croissant or brochure!
Why do we have this mentality of "we're American, we know nothing, we have no manners, and we need to be taught how to act by the superior Europeans"? Yes, manners differ from country to country, but the basic driving force of all manners is to behave courteously toward your fellow man. Not only did those people act outrageously rude to you, but they actually have you apologizing for them!
" I thought when they slapped my hand when I touched their brochures on counters they were rude. And when I attempted to self-serve myself by taking a wax pastry bag for my croissant and they grabbed it back out of my hand, substituting a smaller one, I thought they were rude. Now I know the truth."
The TRUTH is that THOSE people were rude, NOT you. Courtesy is the art and practice of making those around you as comfortable as possible. This was certainly not the intention of the rude shopkeepers who actually touched YOU without permission, as opposed to your touching a croissant or brochure!
Why do we have this mentality of "we're American, we know nothing, we have no manners, and we need to be taught how to act by the superior Europeans"? Yes, manners differ from country to country, but the basic driving force of all manners is to behave courteously toward your fellow man. Not only did those people act outrageously rude to you, but they actually have you apologizing for them!
Jul 11th, 2005, 05:58 AM
#35
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My Mom is 65 and my aunt is not far behind...they're going with us to Paris this fall, and my Mom has said in recent years "you never know how much time you have, so enjoy it to the fullest."
Neither of them have been to Europe, and neither are in the best of health (one has a bad knee and the other just doesn't have the energy to do power sightseeing), so we plan on doing a sightseeing adventure in the morning, give them the afternoon to cool their heels in a Paris cafe, then take them to a nice dinner.
My grandmother went to the Holy Land in the Middle East when she was 73 (I have a precious picture of her riding a camel from that trip), and she talked about that trip for more than 20 years before she passed away at 94.
As for the French, I don't know if you're functioning on old stereotypes or if you've accually encountered "French attitude", but in my recent trips to Paris and New York, I found the reputation of both people(s) to be rude was merely that -- a reputation based on old stereotypes, not current reality. In Manhattan and Paris, people actually stopped to help me with directions when I was obviously lost. Also, simple use of "please" and "thank you" goes a long way in both cities.
Happy travels.
Jules
Neither of them have been to Europe, and neither are in the best of health (one has a bad knee and the other just doesn't have the energy to do power sightseeing), so we plan on doing a sightseeing adventure in the morning, give them the afternoon to cool their heels in a Paris cafe, then take them to a nice dinner.
My grandmother went to the Holy Land in the Middle East when she was 73 (I have a precious picture of her riding a camel from that trip), and she talked about that trip for more than 20 years before she passed away at 94.
As for the French, I don't know if you're functioning on old stereotypes or if you've accually encountered "French attitude", but in my recent trips to Paris and New York, I found the reputation of both people(s) to be rude was merely that -- a reputation based on old stereotypes, not current reality. In Manhattan and Paris, people actually stopped to help me with directions when I was obviously lost. Also, simple use of "please" and "thank you" goes a long way in both cities.
Happy travels.
Jules
Jul 11th, 2005, 06:07 AM
#37
tulsatown, it might be worth you posting again and stick to the question of where might be a good place to take a barge trip? And if people see any problems due to the age of late 60's.
I'm guessing you didn't mean your 'french attitude' comment to get everyone so off-track from the barge trips question.
I'm guessing you didn't mean your 'french attitude' comment to get everyone so off-track from the barge trips question.
Jul 11th, 2005, 06:14 AM
#38
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from tulsatown--WOW--what a firestorm. thanx all who replied, esp. to Nukesafe,Nimrod and djkbooks,will follow up their recommendations. Had not heard about self drive barges, that might be the right cup of tea for another couple and ourselves. Attitude -definition, mine. holier than thou, my way or the hiway, if you don't speak my language or have my u.s. regional accent I may make fun of your shortcomings, if it's too loud your too old, seniors were never teenagers who listened to loud music and drove fast muscle cars et. al. Thanx again to my defenders and boy what an "attitude" the other writers had. tulsatown.
Jul 11th, 2005, 01:27 PM
#40
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author: tulsatown,
yes, I too have an attitude. check it out on my blog, http://epicuristic.blogspot.com/ but I digress, needing help again with the self drive barge concept. Would like to hear from someone that has done it with another couple. Questions. What are the accomodations. Two bedrooms, two baths? Showers? Kitchen? Would tie up at night and visit local restaurants, but would want to have breakfast on board with local baked goods if possible. Lunch, catch as catch can. Insurance?, Security? Clean up at end? How long? Cost for barge and fuel? What shape are they in, how well maintained? Are there self drive barge websites or should you go through a travel agent?If all of this is too long for this venue pls. respond to my email [email protected]. Thanx. tt
yes, I too have an attitude. check it out on my blog, http://epicuristic.blogspot.com/ but I digress, needing help again with the self drive barge concept. Would like to hear from someone that has done it with another couple. Questions. What are the accomodations. Two bedrooms, two baths? Showers? Kitchen? Would tie up at night and visit local restaurants, but would want to have breakfast on board with local baked goods if possible. Lunch, catch as catch can. Insurance?, Security? Clean up at end? How long? Cost for barge and fuel? What shape are they in, how well maintained? Are there self drive barge websites or should you go through a travel agent?If all of this is too long for this venue pls. respond to my email [email protected]. Thanx. tt
