Ubermench

I must say that I’m absolutely mystified by (mostly) women’s obsession with how they dress in Paris and with what the French will think of them. <BR><BR>I know that all human beings are deeply affected by what we read and what we see in films and on television, but come on! Paris really is just another city (not a particularly large or diverse one at that); it is not some sort of Holy Grail. I’m not trying to willfully rain on someone’s parade but I was soooo disappointed with my first trip to Paris. I will not deny that there is beautiful architecture and museums there but the same is true in any number of cities all over the world. <BR><BR>Our first impression was that everyone in the city woke up on the wrong side of the bed. I’m an American and my companions were English and none of us were treated very kindly, but then the Parisians don’t treat each other very kindly either. It’s kind of like everyone is vaguely irritated with everyone else. (We talked with a fellow from Montreal, the second largest French speaking city in the world, and he was incensed that some Parisian implied that they could barely understand him because he didn’t speak “real” French!)<BR><BR>The city is absolutely covered in dog crap to a degree that I found scandalous. Almost anywhere there is grass or bare dirt will be covered with dog droppings! Quoting the National Geographic, #176. (Remember that this is one of the most respected, pre-emanate periodicals on the planet.)<BR><BR> “One French home in three shelters a dog and that dog can do no wrong. Not even in Paris, where someone once calculated that pedestrians step in dog droppings every 286th step!”<BR><BR>Now, if that’s your idea of high-class, so be it, but personally I think it’s time to demystify the whole Paris thing as it is more mirage than reality. It’s a nice place but it is a very long way from being Shangri-La. If this “image” of up-scale/high class/romanticism is your thing, go to Monaco and see how the other half REALLY lives.<BR>

Capo

I could do without all the merde du chien, and the smoking, but, c'mon Ubermench, Paris is hardly "just another city."

Jean-Pierre

That guy from "Montreal" must have been some hick from the country side.

Lillian

Ubermench<BR><BR>I agree with you. The people on these boards are so impresed with themselves for being so worldly and nothing makes these people feel more worldly than the fact that they have been to Paris. Did you see the thread about "Is there anything better than Creme Brulee in Paris." Jeez, I thought I ws back in high school. Look at me, I've been to paris and had Creme Brulee...whoop dee do. There's a certain mystique that the French have on these people with marginal self esteem who try to elevate their persona by going to places like Paris and then telling everyone, who will and won't listen, about it. That crowd is attracted to these board like a fly to honey.

jerrybailey

Well Lillian, aren't you the sophisticated world traveler.

xxx

hear hear! It's not like anyone changes when they come to America. It's vacation, not a fashion show! Why should I change my life to travel, I'm happy with who I am and love the way I dress, and don't care what anyone else thinks! If anyone in Paris or where ever else in europe that doesn't like it and thinks 'look at that ugly tourist', screw em', don't look at me and worry about yourself with your snobbish ways!

Lilian

jerrybailey<BR><BR>Well, I've been to Wellington, NZ, Hobart, Tasmania, Sydney, Australia, Oslo, Paris, Germany, Lisbon, Portugal, Venice, Rome, Sicily, Turky, Greece, Canada, Monaco, Alaska, Mexco, South and Central America, Africa and a few others I can't remember. So I believe I am a world traveller. What you won't find is my name attached to a thread like Creme Brulee...oh La la.

Beth

I have to disagree. I spent a week in Paris recently (yes, aren't I important!) and no one - truly no one - was rude to us. We found most of the shop employees to be extremely helpful and even generous. Many of our purchases were supplemented without our asking with samples of other products. I bought a purse and was given a 5% discount because "Madame, it is last year's style, and I can't charge you full price." How would I have known what was last year's style. I believe you get what you give. Respect and politeness is returned. I also believe we were treated kindly because we were two females traveling together. As far as dress is concerned, I feel good about myself if I know I look my best - I don't dress for others, but my own self esteem.

Capo

Lillian, some people may, indeed, attempt to -- as you put it -- "levate their persona by going to places like Paris and then telling everyone, who will and won't listen, about it."<BR><BR>Others, however, simply love Paris. It's not a perfect city by any means, but it's a very interesting and beautiful one.

Elizabeth

Beth; I loved what you had to say. Im going with my best friend to Paris this Sept. Our 1st trip and we are very excited. I know I'll come home with a great experience. Thanks for the positive!

John

Elizabeth<BR><BR>Bring a pooper scooper.

Elena

Paris is a wonderful place - my husband and I visit annually. The streets are steeped in history, the architecture is magnificent, the river is inspirational. In all our visits, we have never stepped in doggy-doo because we look for it. Indeed that is my least favorite part of Paris, but doggy-doo on the sidewalks is not unique to Paris. We are vigilant because we lived in a small British town (will remain unnamed so I don't get flamed for being anti-British, which I am not) which was as bad or worse. I am me in Paris, I do not pretend to be anyone else. Outside of an arrogant waiter (who was rather comical), we have never been treated with other than warmth and pleasantries. The shops we frequent are charming and their owners quite nice - they remember us from year to year. One shop, where I buy shoes, does not participate in detaxe so they give us accessories and other goodies. And, we don't get treated any less in the larger more impersonal department stores. When we visit Paris, as we try to everyday, we try to remember the Golden Rule and it seems to work. If you don't like Paris, I hope you can find a city, town or other place that refreshes your soul and lets you create fond memories. Paris isn't perfect, but then it's all a matter of opinion an priority.

Anie

I never thought the people of Paris to be particularly rude, but certainly cold and aloof. They, like so many American travelers, seem to believe their own press. I agree wholeheartedly with the original post though. Paris is lovely, it is fun, but it’s not the end-all. I really wonder how it came to such a lofty position when you look at cities like Vienna, Naples, Rio, and many, many others.<BR><BR>I will also agree that, though we spoke a smattering of French and ALWAYS said “please and thank-you”, we did get the overall impression that the people we dealt with would have been just as happy if we vanished. I couldn’t believe that the French were so obsessive about their language that they cannot even print warning labels and escape plans in any other language. Out of Paris NONE of the churches and historic sites we visited posted any information except in French. Perhaps if all the Germans, English, Americans, Greeks, Spanish, etc. just stopped going there for a year the French might realize which side of the baguette the butter is on and be a bit more amicable.<BR><BR>And yeah, that dog poop thing is pretty hard to take. This constitutes “romance?” Go figure. I was raised on a ranch and took care of cattle. Of all the descriptive phrases that ran through my head when I had to shovel out a corral or barn, “romantic” was not among them. Then on the other hand, I guess the French don’t bother with shoveling out anything, judging the quantity of crap in Paris. Perhaps that explains the fixation for expensive perfumes?<BR>

thank heavens

Ubermench and Lillian have certainly made me see the light. What should I do now? Any recommendations for places to visit, in addition to Monaco, that you deem sophisticated? Do you have email addresses where I could send my replies or posts for dorkiness and naivete review?

Judson

thank heavens<BR><BR>Try LA, you'll love it there.<BR><BR>Send you e-mail to:<BR><BR>[email protected]

Robdaddy

Ubermensch: "emanate" is not the word you were looking for: I suggest you look it up, both for meaning and pronunciation. The term you should have used is "pre-eminent". Whole different animal. (Just figured it was my day to be Word Police).

elle

I am amazed by the amount of energy some people invest in sharing their hates and disappointments. Why bother? Why not tell us what you love, rather than what you hate?<BR><BR>Don't assume that those of us who dress well in Paris are dressing any differently than we dress at home. In fact, if a visit to any city requires a drastic change in wardrobe or appearance, then perhaps you wouldn't really enjoy that city. And if you don't dress well at home, then perhaps you should rethink leaving the house.<BR><BR>

Beth

We were "interviewed" as we left the Invalides; when asked, my suggestion as how to make it more enjoyable for visitors was to have some labeling in English. The young woman said that was a recurring request; but just the fact that visitors were being polled seems to show that there is thought given to making a tourist stay more informative and pleasant.<BR><BR>Elizabeth - have a wonderful time. It is a beautiful city with some "imperfections". But, then don't we all....

simone

Re: Lilian's comment "What you won't find is my name attached to a thread like Creme Brulee...oh La la."<BR><BR>Which is perhaps what made that thread such an enjoyable read.<BR><BR>Chacun a son gout! If you don't like Paris, don't go there!<BR> <BR>

frank

Lilian<BR><BR>"people with marginal self esteem who try to elevate their persona"<BR><BR>Sounds like you really know what you're talking about.