swandav2000

Hi again,

Well, if it were me, I would spend more time in the Jungfrau region than in Luzern -- that way, you'll have a better chance at decent weather to see the peaks.

But actually neither town will give you that "nightlife" and "popping in & out of shops" that you mention. Lauterbrunnen is a very small village, one street long, and I personally don't like it because of the cliffs that overhang the town (disclaimer -- I've never gotten off the train to stroll the town because the cliffs cast the town into shadow, and I'm always discouraged by that). Wengen is another very small town, but at least it sits up on a ridge on the mountain, so it's sunny. But all of the shops are concentrated in a few blocks right around the train station. So you may actually be happier staying in Interlaken or even in Thun (Thun is a very sweet town that sits right on Lake Thun, gorgeous situation). Just know that you won't be IN the mountains but rather 20 or 30 minutes away, and that you'll be looking UP at the mountains from town.

No, you don't have time for the Bernina Express nor the Glacier Express. The Glacier Express itself takes 8 hours; it runs between Zermatt in the west and St. Moritz in the east. So, you'd need at least two extra nights -- one night in Zermatt or St. Moritz before boarding the train in the morning, and one night at the other end before continuing your trip.

Similarly, the Bernina Express is on the other side of the country, and it'll take you 6-8 hours of travel to reach the start point. It runs from Chur to Pontresina and onward to Poschiavo. It will also require about two nights since it takes so long to get there and then to get back.

Oh, ok, I stand corrected. Yes, you **could** do both the GE and the BE, but it would have to be instead of doing the Jungfrau region. You simply don't have the time to do both.

Yes, Montreux is very much a strolling, popping-into-stores, and nightlife kind of place. An extra night there would never be wasted imo; there's plenty to do. What is your preferred price range for a hotel in Montreux/Vevey, and what are your priorities (service, location, views, charm, etc).

Have fun as you plan!

s

Ingo

I second what swandav wrote. None of the small towns (villages) in the Jungfrau except Interlaken fits your criteria for nightlife/strolling etc. Thun would be best in that regard, but it's a bit too far from the mountains IMO (with that little time in this region). Interlaken would be the best compromise.

Yes, the trip up to Jungfraujoch is very weather dependent. If you're out of luck and it's too cloudy, go hiking somewhere at lower elevation (Männlichen - Kleine Scheidegg e.g.), if it's raining see the Trümmelbach water falls, maybe the Beatus caves near Interlaken or a castle by Lake Thun (Oberhofen, Spiez e.g.)

tonygabe

Thanks, both. Very helpful. My hesitation is that since we only have two days in the Jungfrau region and the main attraction is dependent on weather, it may be too much of a risk. Especially given the fact that it seems you are otherwise without much to do? My thought now is to skip that area altogether, do a day trip from Lucerne using the BE (possible? Too much for a trip down to the Italian region and back? Don't know much about the BE) and then spend an extra night in Montreux. Perhaps the Jungrau region and BO generally is best saved for its own trip where there is more flexibility in timing and travel. Thoughts?

As for Montreux and the other cities as well, we would love a charming chic hotel with a nice view, if possible. price range for all hotels ranges in the $200 a night range.

swandav2000

Hi again,

I'm afraid I really don't think it's possible to do the Bernina Express as a day-trip. As I said above, it is on the other side of the country, and it will take a day of transit. Here's what it would look like:

08.35 depart Luzern arrive Chur 10.43
Depart Chur 10.58, arrive Poschiavo 14.22 (this is the route of the BE)
Depart Poschiavo 15.09, arrive Montreux 22.40 (returning to Luzern would have you arriving there at 20.49).

I've never thought that a scenic train is worth it -- you would be sitting passively inside a train for 12 hours or more, just for the chance to see some nice scenery for 3 or 4 hours. It is much, MUCH more rewarding to see the scenery while outside, on a mountaintop or on a mountain trail somewhere with the sun on your face and the wind in your hair. I would never, never substitute time on a mountain for time inside a train.

You can easily find out about the BE just by googling it -- Or use the Swiss rail site to get all the schedules:

www.sbb.ch

Here are some ideas for hotels:

I just did a dummy booking at booking.com for a room from 24-27 Sep for 2 people, and these hotels came up as available:

Golf Hotel Rene Capt (4-star), $539 for 3 nights. I like this hotel, though I've never stayed there. It is charming, I think, and it sits right on the lake. It is a little outside of town in a quiet area, but the bus will bring you into town quickly. You can also walk back and forth to town along the lake in about 15 minutes, and there are lots of cafes along the way.

The Royal Plaza, a 5-star, is showing at $545 for 3 nights. I stayed there many years ago and enjoy its location, in a quiet spot almost in Clarens. It's modern rather than charming, and it also sits right on the lake.

The Eden Palace au Lac, 4 star, is showing at $594 for 3 nights. I've stayed at this hotel 3 times, and I love its location right across the street from the casino and right on the lake. You could not be more central.

There were some other hotels showing availability, but either they were too expensive, or I don't care for the hotels.

Have fun!

s

tonygabe

Swandav- Thank you so much! I'm always uplifted by the lengths people in the Fodors community go to to help. Duly noted on the BE info. While I am sad to be missing it, I think it may make sense to skip Jungfrau this trip and concentrate my time in the other areas.

suze

Montreux IS gorgeous and yes I would add another night if you can figure out how.

PalenQ

If you've never been to the Jungfrau Region I'd put that at the top of any list for first-time Swiss travelers who want to see the high Alps at their most majestic.

Montreux is nice but not nearly as awe-inspiring as the Jungfrau Region.

Just my opinion based on being all over Switzerland and many others agree-

tonygabe

Thanks, suze! PalenQ, do you see a feasible way to incorporate it in the itinerary I have?

suze

<not nearly as awe-inspiring>

All well and good. But they only have 7 days and are flying out of Geneva. Lausanne, Vevey, Montreux make more sense. And in my humble opinion are pretty darn spectacular!!

tonygabe

Thanks, all. I've really benefited a lot from your suggestions. I felt very bad not visiting the BO after hearing all the suggestions but realized I have to make a cut somewhere. I'm posting the hopefully final itinerary here. Someone tell me I finally got it right!

Day 1 - Zurich/Lucerne - Arrive in Zurich at 8:30 PM and transfer directly to Lucerne.

Day 2 - Lucerne - Spend the day in Lucerne to see the town and tour the lake. Leisurely day.

Day 3 - Lucerne - Spend the day in the town and go up Pilatus. Zurich for dinner?

Day 4 - Jungfrau - Leave Lucerne and head to Jungfrau region. Seems like Interlaken or Thun are the best options for us given our preferences for a mix of a lively area with beautiful views. Also would like the option to do other activities if too cloudy to go up Jungfraujoch.

Day 5 - Another day in Jungfrau region. Please feel free to share backup options if the weather is bad and tips for accommodations.

Day 6 - Leave to Montreux. Tour the town. Possible trips to Vevey and Chillon castle. Night in Montreux.

Day 7 - Full day in Montreux. Possibly the chocolate train! Would love more tips!

Day 8 - Leave from Montreux to Geneva airport for our flight at 3 PM.

kja

If I may say so, I think you would really benefit from doing a bit more research. The Jungfrau <u><b>is</u></b> in the Bernese Oberland.

tonygabe

Yes, I know that I felt bad cutting out the BO, meaning specifically the Jungfrau region. To put it back in I had to make a cut somewhere - namely the day in Zurich and the trip down to Lugano. Thx.

drchris

We stayed at the Grand Hotel Suisse Majestic in Montreux and it was the perfect location. We had a beautiful view over the lake, and the dock for the boats that travel around the lake was directly in front of the hotel. We caught those to Chillon our first evening and to Vevy and Lausanne the next day, passing the beautiful hillside vineyards along the way. The train also ran behind the hotel so we had only a short walk when we arrived from the BO.

While in the BO, we stayed in Lauterbrunnen and found it convenient to get to all for the surrounding towns. We found Interlaken to be too big and less charming. The Hotel Staubach in Lauterbrunnen had a view of the waterfall and served a wonderful breakfast.

We were in Switzerland for 10 days and we flew into Zurich, took the train directly to Lucerne, where we stayed at the Hotel des Alpes, directly in front of the Chapel Bridge. We toured Lucerne that day and went up Mt Pilatus the next, then headed to Lauterbrunnen and toured several of the towns in the area plus took the boats on Lake Thun and Brienz. Next stop was Montreux, which we loved. Then we were off to Zermatt (we stayed at the Hotel Daniela) which we enjoyed even though it was too cloudy to see the Matterhorn. From there we took the Glacier Express for part of its journey east, then transferred to a train that took us back to Zurich. We were there on a Sunday and there was some sort of family-oriented street fair, so we found the city delightful. We also took a half-day trip to the charming town of Stein am Rhein. It was a whirlwind but we loved every minute. All of our travel was by train.

Whatever you are able to see you will love and it will leave you wishing for a return trip to see more of Switzerland. have fun!

swandav2000

Hi again,

Your itinerary looks ok, but if it were me, I would tweak it a bit more.

I would take a day from Luzern and add it to the Jungfrau region, yes, even though it might not give you the cafe-society, strolling & shopping nightlife you were looking for. I simply think that you would be disappointed to have only one full day for this part of Switzerland.

And man oh man, you really do love the marketed train tours! Again, I have to say that I wouldn't do the Chocolate Train; I haven't ever done it despite something like a dozen or more stays in Montreux. It simply eats up too much time; it leaves Montreux just before 09.00, and it doesn't get back until 17.30. Your entire day is gone. In addition, in September, it only runs on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Thursdays, so it might not fit in with your schedule.

I'll also add that it might not be such a thrill just to see a factory, even a chocolate factory. There are some artisan chocolate-makers throughout Switzerland, and visiting and sampling their stuff might be more rewarding than just seeing a factory.

http://www.schuh-interlaken.ch/en/co...hokoladen-show

If you feel you have to do this, you can do the parts of it actually on your own. Gruyeres & Broc are a quick detour from the route of the Golden Pass train route, so you could even conceivably do it while enroute from Interlaken to Montreux.

For your time in Montreux, I would do this:

Arrival day: stroll the lakeside promenade to Chillon, tour the castle (about 2h), walk UP to the old town maybe to see the sunset over the lake, have dinner along the lake somewhere.

Full day: ferry to Lutry, then explore the town's signposted medieval buildings and its old town and its lakefront. Then walk through the vineyards to Cully or Rivaz. If you want, take a wine tasting at the Lavaux-Vinorama in Rivaz. Take the train to Vevey and explore the old town and its winding streets next to the lake. Then the ferry, bus, or train back to Montreux.

The vineyards should be pretty gorgeous in September. I would really rather do that than (again . . .!) sit inside a train for some factory tour.

Have fun!

s

swandav2000

PS,

Here is a page with a bit more information on Lutry & the Lavaux:

http://www.montreuxriviera.com/en/Y5...ursions/lavaux

And here is a pdf with information on walks in the area (second page has info on walks in the Lavaux):

http://static.montreuxriviera.com/ra...679.1466572907

s

kja

@ swandav: You have, IMO, gone far above and beyond the call of duty (particularly since the "call" is strictly voluntary and on one's own time)! To quote another regular Fodorite, "IMD."

muizon

Got a ton of info here and from my original post, also planning on Switzerland. I have to say a big thanks to swandav2000 & all the Fodor community!

swandav2000

lol, kja, you are, as always, too kind.

Thank you, muizon.

My dirty little secret is that I adore Montreux and would probably pay you to let me chat about it . . .

s

kja

@ swandav: I'm on board with that! How much should I ask you to pay for chatting about Monttreux?

swandav2000

Uh , . . . how about a nice glass of wine along the promenade in Montreux? I'll be there in a few weeks. Your glass will be waiting!!

s