I would love any suggestions for our upcoming trip to England & Wales. My husband & I will be in the UK for only 8 days in October. This is truly a big deal for us and the likely hood of us being able to do a second trip is very small. So, that being said, everything looks like a must see and we're having a hard time narrowing it down. We don't mind staying insanely busy but also want some flexibility in the trip to enjoy the country. Here's our basic itinerary- would love to hear if you think this is too ambitious. Thanks!

1- London:

We're not big city people- we prefer the country side and smaller towns- so we're only planning on 2 (weekdays) in London- We'd like to see a lot but limit our tours to must sees for us. We're very active and enjoy walking so would you recommend walking/ tube from different destinations or a bus tour. With only time for 1 cathedral, which would you recommend- St Pauls or Westminister. We'll be getting into The British Museum & The National Gallery for a bit too. Is the Tower a must see or ok to just walk past? We'd like to walk some of the parks too- Regents/ Kensington/ Hyde- which is the best one or two? Lastly, being there on a weekday- would you skip Notting Hill area or is it worth going to?

2- Lakes & Peaks

After London we're heading up through the Peaks to see friends. They are one of the main reasons for coming so we can't skip this part. They live outside of Manchester so we're going hiking in the Lakes with them one day and then seeing Chatsworth in the Peaks one day. Also, we've thought about maybe stopping to spend a few hours at Burghley House in Stamford on the drive up there.

3- Wales & Bath

After leaving our friends we're going to drive down through Wales and stop off for a few small hikes on our way to Bath. This is the part we're wondering if we should skip if it's getting too busy. We'd love to see Bath though- especially the Pump Room & Roman Baths. Is the good part of the day enough time for that?

4- Dover

We're ending our trip in Dover area. We'd like to see the 7 sisters & Dover Castle. Some people have said Canterbury is better than Dover Castle so should we switch it up?

So, are be being too ambitious? I have the feeling that the answer is Yes! If so, what would you say would be most worth skipping? Or are there things that I'm absolutely missing and what would you skip in their place? Thanks so much for your input!

"<i>if you think this is too ambitious.</i>"

Unfortunately - yes - much.

I am literally dashing out the door so can't go into details now -- will come back later.

But - you are essentially traveling from London to Manchester to the Lakes to (optional Wales) to Bath and then all the way across the country to Dover/Canterbury. That is waaay too far in too little time.

More later . . . .

First - are your eight days including your travel days, or no? Even if they don't, I think your itinerary is a bit ambitious, and I would drop at least one thing, probably two.

Have you thought about travel time between destinations? For example, it could take half a day or more to pick up your rental car and drive to the Peak District. So your itinerary, if I'm interpreting correctly, looks like this (with Dover and Bath removed):

[Day 0 - leave US; since this seems to be a very big trip for you I assume you're from North America]
Day 1: arrive in London in the morning, check into hotel, some afternoon sightseeing
Day 2: London
Day 3: pick up car, drive to your friends'
Day 4: hiking in Lakes
Day 5: Chatsworth
Day 6: drive to Wales (somewhere)
Day 7: wherever you pick in Wales
Day 8: back to London to fly home
[Day 9: fly home]

Another option would be to stay an extra day at your London hotel and do Bath as a day trip from London, skipping both Wales and Dover. If your eight days do not include your travel days, I think you really only have time for London and the Lakes/Peaks with your friends.

As far as London,

<i>Would you recommend walking/ tube from different destinations or a bus tour.</i>
I almost never recommend the bus tour - they're expensive and just drive by everything. However, with only a day and a half (potentially), it could be a good way for to get a good overview without having to worry about getting around. If you just want to see places rather than visit, a hop-on-hop-off might be a good way to do it. However, if you have a few places you really want to visit, I'd go directly there via public transit rather than spending time on the tour bus.

<i>With only time for 1 cathedral, which would you recommend- St Pauls or Westminister.</i>
Depends - if you're after history, I'd probably Westminster Abbey (technically it's not a cathedral). And I would take a tour, either the verger tour or with London Walks, to get the most out of it. But as buildings, I prefer St Paul myself. Totally different "vibes" in each. Westminster does have the added bonus of being nearer other points of interest (Big Ben, Parliament, Trafalgar Square/National Gallery, Buckingham Palace) than St Paul's.

<i>Is the Tower a must see or ok to just walk past?</i>
Again, it depends on your interests. If you're into history, I'd say it's a must-see. If your aim is to see as much of London as possible in a day and a half, I would skip it, because a good visit can take several hours, and it's not very near many other points of interest for first-timers.

<i>We'd like to walk some of the parks too- Regents/ Kensington/ Hyde- which is the best one or two?</i>
Regent's is my favorite, particularly Queen Mary's rose garden. However, any of the parks are great, and with such a short time I'd pick the closest one to whatever you're doing the rest of the time.

<i>Would you skip Notting Hill area or is it worth going to?</i>
Definitely skip. There's not that much there unless you're going to the Saturday market, and even that I wouldn't bother with for a day and a half visit.

Just wanted to clarify what I meant about the bus tour: Of course you *can* get off and visit the places along the route. But if you're looking to just use it for public transport, it's an expensive way to get around, and the buses and Tube are inexpensive and really quite easy. Personally, the only reason I'd recommend it is if you had a very limited time and only wanted to be able to say "We saw Big Ben and the Tower!" rather than going into those places. (Well, you can't go in Big Ben. But you get the idea.)

We are from the US- we'll be gone 10 days- arriving at 7am on Day 2 so we'll get a good bit of time in on that day- and leaving on day 10. I think we're more leaning towards St Pauls than Westminister so that helps- We like history so the Tower sounds good especially as it's closer to the Tower. Happy to skip Notting Hill. Would you recommend Bath over Dover area then? Thanks so much for your thoughts!

Oops- I meant St Pauls is closer to the Tower than Westminister!

Oh, good. The Tower and St Paul's would make a good day; you couldn't fit too much else in on that day, though, other than wandering around and seeing things (which is one of my favorite things to do!). I would carefully check museum opening and closing times. Some stay open later on certain days of the week (the British Museum, for example, is open till 11pm on Thursdays and Fridays), but most close around 5-6pm most days. Also in October, it will be starting to get dark earlier, so your park time is somewhat limited. You'll just have to plan ahead.

I enjoyed Bath and would love to go back and see more of the town. I haven't been to Dover, but I would definitely recommend Bath. Bath is very easy to do as a day trip from London, should you go that route. I'm not sure about Dover.

Dover Castle is one of the very 'best-est' 100% impressive sites in all of the UK -- however it does not fit w/ anything else in your itinerary. One possibility:

Day 1 (your arrival day) likely a jet lag fog.
Day 2 Your only full day in London
Days 3-5 Peaks/Lakes/friends
Days 6-8 A bit of north Wales, Bath, maybe drive through some of the Cotswolds.
Day 9 fly home

However - - Because of the jet lag, I'd definitely add one day to London. Even not being "city people", just to see a <u>teensy</u> bit of the major sites, you'd want at least 2 full days. You may not feel like doing any major sites on day 1.

And your 3 days up north really isn't 3 days since you have to deal w/ collecting the car and drive up to Manchester.

So what I'd do is:

days 1-4 In London including a day trip to Bath by train.

days 5-8 Up north. Return to London the evening of day 8

day 9 fly home

This gives you time to see a bit, have time w/ your friends, see Bath -- and not have to rush all over the country.

Without wishing to be rude have you looked at a map?

You are zigzagging backwards and forwards. I would suggest that you might be better to take a train from London to Manchester, just over 2 hours rather than longer by road, plus the tiredness. Then pick up a car when you need it. Will your friends drive you about?

If you want to drive from London I would go to Chatsworth and then across to Manchester. I would even be tempted to train to Sheffield and hire a car there for Chatsworth and on to Manchester.

Yes - Helen's suggestion to take a train up to Manchester makes more sense if your friends are driving you around while up there. But I's still divide it up days 1-4 in London and days 5-8 up north.

jent103 as given you some good advice but just one thing there is a Westminster Cathedral, but you probably mean Westminster Abbey. I just wouldn't want you to go to the wrong one.

Agree - get a train to Manchester.

October you will probably be fine hiking BUT the weather can be unpredictable so be prepared to change plans. And don't forget the light, the days can be quite short. You might be spending 1.5-2hours driving fro Manchester to the lakes (or Peak district) and the same back. Be prepared that one way at least will be in darkness.

For your Northern part of the trip I'd suggest taking a train to Sheffield (on the east coast line) or Stockport, south of Manchester (whichever is nearest your friends) where your friends could collect you by car and take you to Chatsworth that day (that would save a dreary drive up the motorway and lots of time). Hire a car in Manchester area if you need to when you go to the Lakes -it's 1.5 hours to drive to mid-Lakes area from Manchester).
Would definitely recommend Bath over Dover in spite of the splendid Castle.