Suggestions for December trip - Switzerland, Germany, Austria?
Aug 30th, 2018, 06:03 AM
#61
Thank you swandav. I'm familiar with outdooractive.com, but not komoot.com - I'll take a look.
fourfortravel - received a response from the cable car company that the Zwölferhorn won't be open (although their website indicates otherwise so now I'm really confused). Guess we'll have to play that one by ear.
fourfortravel - received a response from the cable car company that the Zwölferhorn won't be open (although their website indicates otherwise so now I'm really confused). Guess we'll have to play that one by ear.
Sep 1st, 2018, 01:35 PM
#62
I think I've decided where to go - well...maybe. I need to just get on with it and make a decision.
Five nights Adelboden or Leukerbad, 5-7 nights Upper Engadine, five nights Seefeld, five nights St Gilgen (or maybe St Wolfgang, but leaning towards quieter), three nights Munich.
Five nights Adelboden or Leukerbad, 5-7 nights Upper Engadine, five nights Seefeld, five nights St Gilgen (or maybe St Wolfgang, but leaning towards quieter), three nights Munich.
Sep 1st, 2018, 11:32 PM
#63
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Sounds like a good plan to me. I have fond memories of Adelboden and it's also sunnier than Leukerbad in December (given that it's not cloudy!) so that would be my choice ... and I'd lean towards St. Wolfgang for the "sunny" reason also.
Sep 2nd, 2018, 12:38 AM
#64
Crikey, Mel, you haven't booked your December trip yet! Where are you staying in the upper Engadin?
I confess to having already booked my June trip, LOL, got myself a great apartment in Scuol
used e-domizil for the first time, thanks for that tip. We are going back to Sils Maria as well.
I confess to having already booked my June trip, LOL, got myself a great apartment in Scuol
used e-domizil for the first time, thanks for that tip. We are going back to Sils Maria as well.
Sep 2nd, 2018, 06:55 AM
#65
Melnq8, I wouldn't worry about St. Wolfgang being a party capital versus Sankt Gilgen, should you find fab lodging in the former.
With five nights in Seefeld you can explore Innsbruck, Hall in Tirol, Igls and more. Locally, look at the Wildmoos Alm Rundwanderweg and the Reitherjoch Alm wander; the latter was especially enjoyable with the quiet amidst the pine trees and the snow all around. Do check the Hütte opening days, though! There is little worse than hoping to sit with the sun on one's face and a skillet of Käsespaetzle on the table only to discover the Hütte is on Ruhetag ("Rest" Day).
With five nights in Seefeld you can explore Innsbruck, Hall in Tirol, Igls and more. Locally, look at the Wildmoos Alm Rundwanderweg and the Reitherjoch Alm wander; the latter was especially enjoyable with the quiet amidst the pine trees and the snow all around. Do check the Hütte opening days, though! There is little worse than hoping to sit with the sun on one's face and a skillet of Käsespaetzle on the table only to discover the Hütte is on Ruhetag ("Rest" Day).
Sep 2nd, 2018, 07:12 AM
#66
Ingo -
I'm glad to hear Adelboden might be a good option for sunshine! I can't seem to raise anyone at the Adelboden tourist office - my emails have gone unanswered - I'm trying to determine if there will be any open walking tracks above Elsigen-Metsch and Gondola Stand-Xpress Metsch–Lenk / Bühlberg - both of these look like they'll be open during our stay.
I've also been making myself crazy looking for apartments in Adelboden - most that I've found are in Boden or nearby areas that don't seem sensible options for those of us traveling by train/bus. So, it's been a bit of challenge getting that one sorted out. I seem to remember that Adelboden has at least one grocery store? And a lot of hills! I suspect most hotels and restaurants might be closed too (it was pretty sleepy when we visited in early June one year). We'll arrive Nov 28.
Interesting about St Wolfgang and sunshine - I'm leaning towards St Gilgen - found a nice apartment there and it seems less bustling than St Wolfgang - I hadn't considered the sunshine issue there though.
Adelaidean - yes, we were late booking this year and the time has really gotten away from me. Not sure exactly where we might stay in the Engadine - leaning towards Zuoz, Zernez or maybe even La Punt Chamues, heck who knows, I can't seem to make a decision. I'd considered Sils Maria, but it just doesn't seem the best option in winter - lack of sunshine (due to surrounding mountains), reduced bus schedule, etc. There's a lot to consider when traveling in the winter.
Glad to hear you're sorted and that you'll be fitting in Scuol this year. I hope you like it as much as we do.
I'm glad to hear Adelboden might be a good option for sunshine! I can't seem to raise anyone at the Adelboden tourist office - my emails have gone unanswered - I'm trying to determine if there will be any open walking tracks above Elsigen-Metsch and Gondola Stand-Xpress Metsch–Lenk / Bühlberg - both of these look like they'll be open during our stay.
I've also been making myself crazy looking for apartments in Adelboden - most that I've found are in Boden or nearby areas that don't seem sensible options for those of us traveling by train/bus. So, it's been a bit of challenge getting that one sorted out. I seem to remember that Adelboden has at least one grocery store? And a lot of hills! I suspect most hotels and restaurants might be closed too (it was pretty sleepy when we visited in early June one year). We'll arrive Nov 28.
Interesting about St Wolfgang and sunshine - I'm leaning towards St Gilgen - found a nice apartment there and it seems less bustling than St Wolfgang - I hadn't considered the sunshine issue there though.
Adelaidean - yes, we were late booking this year and the time has really gotten away from me. Not sure exactly where we might stay in the Engadine - leaning towards Zuoz, Zernez or maybe even La Punt Chamues, heck who knows, I can't seem to make a decision. I'd considered Sils Maria, but it just doesn't seem the best option in winter - lack of sunshine (due to surrounding mountains), reduced bus schedule, etc. There's a lot to consider when traveling in the winter.
Glad to hear you're sorted and that you'll be fitting in Scuol this year. I hope you like it as much as we do.
Last edited by Melnq8; Sep 2nd, 2018 at 07:15 AM.
Sep 2nd, 2018, 08:24 AM
#67
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Mel,
Elsigen-Metsch opens 24 Nov, Gondola Stand-Xpress Metsch–Lenk / Bühlberg and gondola Silleren start 1 Dec. There is one winter hiking trail from the top station of Elsigen cable car to Brandsee (a loop of 2 km) and another one from the parking at Höchst (7 km) - both should be open. The skibus runs to that parking at Höchst, too. Higher up only with snowshoes (which you could easily rent - it's fun!)
Elsigen - Metsch
A very nice winter hike is from Sillerenbühl down to Aebi and via Schermtanne restaurant back to Adelboden. Or hike in the other direction to Geils, take the bus back to Adelboden. As far as I know there is no hiking trail that takes you over Hahnenmoospass to the Lenk side of the skiing area. To get to Lenk you'd have to take bus/train and make the detour via Spiez
Adelboden-Lenk
(check "hiking trails" under "Sonstiges")
Yes, there are a COOP and also a small grocery in Adelboden. Plus bakeries etc. See this link:
https://www.adelboden.ch/en/w/lebensmittel
Did you search for apartments through adelboden.ch? I found Thürlerhaus, ground floor right for 608 CHF (a bit steep, I know, but good location 2 min walk above the main street and looks really good). Or Monte Grappa for 418 CHF (a bit below the village). And Haldematt, right in the centre for 423 CHF. Juwel 2 is above the village, probably a walk uphill ... but very nice looking (438 CHF). Selva AP B2 is right in the centre, in a modern apartment house and not exactly charming - but if you like modern, then it's a good choice (477 CHF). Also right in the centre and even nicer is Riseten for 487 CHF (next to the gondola station).
Elsigen-Metsch opens 24 Nov, Gondola Stand-Xpress Metsch–Lenk / Bühlberg and gondola Silleren start 1 Dec. There is one winter hiking trail from the top station of Elsigen cable car to Brandsee (a loop of 2 km) and another one from the parking at Höchst (7 km) - both should be open. The skibus runs to that parking at Höchst, too. Higher up only with snowshoes (which you could easily rent - it's fun!)
Elsigen - Metsch
A very nice winter hike is from Sillerenbühl down to Aebi and via Schermtanne restaurant back to Adelboden. Or hike in the other direction to Geils, take the bus back to Adelboden. As far as I know there is no hiking trail that takes you over Hahnenmoospass to the Lenk side of the skiing area. To get to Lenk you'd have to take bus/train and make the detour via Spiez
Adelboden-Lenk
(check "hiking trails" under "Sonstiges")
Yes, there are a COOP and also a small grocery in Adelboden. Plus bakeries etc. See this link:
https://www.adelboden.ch/en/w/lebensmittel
Did you search for apartments through adelboden.ch? I found Thürlerhaus, ground floor right for 608 CHF (a bit steep, I know, but good location 2 min walk above the main street and looks really good). Or Monte Grappa for 418 CHF (a bit below the village). And Haldematt, right in the centre for 423 CHF. Juwel 2 is above the village, probably a walk uphill ... but very nice looking (438 CHF). Selva AP B2 is right in the centre, in a modern apartment house and not exactly charming - but if you like modern, then it's a good choice (477 CHF). Also right in the centre and even nicer is Riseten for 487 CHF (next to the gondola station).
Sep 11th, 2018, 02:45 PM
#69
Ah, the struggle continues, what a nice problem to have!
I've booked accommodation, in reverse as it happens, in Munich, St Gilgen and Seefeld, but still uncharacteristically struggling with Switzerland.
I've decided on six nights Zuoz as a base for the Upper Engadine, but have run into rather limited apartment options - either too far a walk up those beautiful Swiss mountains (with no bus options) or closed so early in the season. Think I've settled on Allegra, but have yet to book.
Adelboden has presented its own set of issues - notes from apartment owners have warned of closures and a lack of open restaurants as well as walking distance (and terrain) from bus to apartments. We like quiet, we truly do, but a girl must eat! I'm rethinking Adelboden altogether.
Not sure where to go from here. Sometimes one can't see the forest for the trees.
I've booked accommodation, in reverse as it happens, in Munich, St Gilgen and Seefeld, but still uncharacteristically struggling with Switzerland.
I've decided on six nights Zuoz as a base for the Upper Engadine, but have run into rather limited apartment options - either too far a walk up those beautiful Swiss mountains (with no bus options) or closed so early in the season. Think I've settled on Allegra, but have yet to book.
Adelboden has presented its own set of issues - notes from apartment owners have warned of closures and a lack of open restaurants as well as walking distance (and terrain) from bus to apartments. We like quiet, we truly do, but a girl must eat! I'm rethinking Adelboden altogether.
Not sure where to go from here. Sometimes one can't see the forest for the trees.
Sep 11th, 2018, 07:39 PM
#70
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Yeah it seems you'd have to be somewhere near ski resorts or where you can do a lot of hiking?
Otherwise these smaller villages may not draw enough visitors to lead to restaurants and lodging options opening up?
Otherwise these smaller villages may not draw enough visitors to lead to restaurants and lodging options opening up?
Sep 12th, 2018, 07:40 AM
#71
scrb11 -
Yes and no. A few cable cars around Adelboden will be open as mentioned up thread by Ingo. Generally though, if a ski area is closed, so are the winter hiking trails. You can't get to many of them until the mountain transport opens for the season and even if you could, they wouldn't be groomed. Not a deal breaker, but a definite consideration.
Having said that, we've found plenty of hiking outside of ski areas and without using cable cars...but we've learned from experience that in the Swiss winter one must go UP to find the sun - sunlight is hard to come by in villages surrounded by mountains and it can be quite cold in those valleys - thus my attempts to find "a valley in east-west direction and a village on a terrace high up on the south-facing slopes" (quote from Ingo). The Engadine is one such valley, but we've been to the Lower Engadine many times, and would like something new, hence Zuoz in the Upper Engadine.
I looked into Riederalp and Bettmeralp, both sunny high altitude options, but everything is closed until later in December. I've disqualified Appenzell, Saas Fee, Leukerbad and Zermatt as lacking winter sun.
Valais is a possibility as is Val Lumnezia (which we've visited from a base in Ilanz), but more research needed. Lenk im Simmental is an option (we've visited there previously from a base in Blankenburg), but limited openings and possible sun issues down in the valley.
I'm my own worst enemy, making myself crazy with indecisiveness. What's not to love about Switzerland?
Yes and no. A few cable cars around Adelboden will be open as mentioned up thread by Ingo. Generally though, if a ski area is closed, so are the winter hiking trails. You can't get to many of them until the mountain transport opens for the season and even if you could, they wouldn't be groomed. Not a deal breaker, but a definite consideration.
Having said that, we've found plenty of hiking outside of ski areas and without using cable cars...but we've learned from experience that in the Swiss winter one must go UP to find the sun - sunlight is hard to come by in villages surrounded by mountains and it can be quite cold in those valleys - thus my attempts to find "a valley in east-west direction and a village on a terrace high up on the south-facing slopes" (quote from Ingo). The Engadine is one such valley, but we've been to the Lower Engadine many times, and would like something new, hence Zuoz in the Upper Engadine.
I looked into Riederalp and Bettmeralp, both sunny high altitude options, but everything is closed until later in December. I've disqualified Appenzell, Saas Fee, Leukerbad and Zermatt as lacking winter sun.
Valais is a possibility as is Val Lumnezia (which we've visited from a base in Ilanz), but more research needed. Lenk im Simmental is an option (we've visited there previously from a base in Blankenburg), but limited openings and possible sun issues down in the valley.
I'm my own worst enemy, making myself crazy with indecisiveness. What's not to love about Switzerland?
Last edited by Melnq8; Sep 12th, 2018 at 07:44 AM.
Oct 2nd, 2018, 09:38 AM
#75
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We're contemplating a return trip to Europe this December.
Germany, Switzerland and Austria spring to mind as we enjoy Christmas markets, winter hiking, alpine villages, etc. but we're also open to something completely new (we've been to England, Scotland, France, Belgium, Netherlands, a tiny bit of Italy). We prefer small towns and villages.
I seem to recall neckervd posting a list of off-the-beaten path Swiss ski areas that appealed, but I can't locate the thread.
The loose plan at this point is a week in Germany (or Austria) and two in Switzerland.
In Germany we've visited Munich, Berchtesgaden, Garmisch, Regensberg, Bamberg, Dresden, Meissen, Annaberg-Buchholtz, Schneeberg, Freiburg im Breisgau, Nuremburg, Rothenburg ob der Tauber, Fussen, Mittenwald and probably a few more that I can't think of at the moment.
In Switzerland we've visited the BO (extensively), the Upper and Lower Engadine, the Vorderrhein valley in the Surselva district, as well as Lucerne, Zurich, Kandersteg, Adelboden, Zermatt, Engelberg, Arosa-Lenzerheide, Basel, Chur, Montreux.
In Austria we've visited Innsbruck, Vienna and Salzburg, although it's been many years. Kitzbühel has been on our radar for many years, but stays of less than a week in December seem problematic (?)
I realize this is vague, but I'm just stuck, and therefore wondering if we should do something completely out of our comfort zone, but not sure exactly what that might be. Any suggestions, keeping in mind time of year and our low key travel style?
Germany, Switzerland and Austria spring to mind as we enjoy Christmas markets, winter hiking, alpine villages, etc. but we're also open to something completely new (we've been to England, Scotland, France, Belgium, Netherlands, a tiny bit of Italy). We prefer small towns and villages.
I seem to recall neckervd posting a list of off-the-beaten path Swiss ski areas that appealed, but I can't locate the thread.
The loose plan at this point is a week in Germany (or Austria) and two in Switzerland.
In Germany we've visited Munich, Berchtesgaden, Garmisch, Regensberg, Bamberg, Dresden, Meissen, Annaberg-Buchholtz, Schneeberg, Freiburg im Breisgau, Nuremburg, Rothenburg ob der Tauber, Fussen, Mittenwald and probably a few more that I can't think of at the moment.
In Switzerland we've visited the BO (extensively), the Upper and Lower Engadine, the Vorderrhein valley in the Surselva district, as well as Lucerne, Zurich, Kandersteg, Adelboden, Zermatt, Engelberg, Arosa-Lenzerheide, Basel, Chur, Montreux.
In Austria we've visited Innsbruck, Vienna and Salzburg, although it's been many years. Kitzbühel has been on our radar for many years, but stays of less than a week in December seem problematic (?)
I realize this is vague, but I'm just stuck, and therefore wondering if we should do something completely out of our comfort zone, but not sure exactly what that might be. Any suggestions, keeping in mind time of year and our low key travel style?
Oct 2nd, 2018, 09:59 AM
#76
Hi emiliaparker -
Thanks for the input. We've made our bookings - seven nights Flims/Laax, six nights Zuoz (I'd have done it the other way around, but Iceland Air has cancelled our flights twice now and I've had to do some juggling), five nights Seefeld, five nights St Gilgen, two nights Munich.
Thanks for the input. We've made our bookings - seven nights Flims/Laax, six nights Zuoz (I'd have done it the other way around, but Iceland Air has cancelled our flights twice now and I've had to do some juggling), five nights Seefeld, five nights St Gilgen, two nights Munich.
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