Spanish Monarch to abdicate

Old Jun 3rd, 2014, 06:55 AM
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I thought a horse joke was coming.
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Old Jun 3rd, 2014, 08:54 PM
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Lateday, the Valley of the Fallen is fully open to the public, no changes since your visit.

As per the healed wounds...well...it´s the traditional controversy between left and right in Spain, probably as everywhere else. But I guess most Spaniards are on the center, a bit to the left or a bit to the right. What makes it to the news is the extremes, though.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 12:35 AM
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Living here now for over 40 years it is worrisome that organized massive protests are really taking force. Civil war? not exactly but definitely a different approach to getting what you want than other democratic countries. I think there is opposition to monarchies in many western democratic countries but are any as visibly organized and demanding as the Spanish one is proving to be?

Be prepared for more protests of all types. Barcelona is a hot bed now. The destruction of private and public property by these protesters who, BTW, come from other parts of Spain and EUROPE to support the movement, is the ugly side of the new system they have of forcefully getting what they want. I find this VERY worrisome.

Fortunately, both major political parties seem to be trying to have common ground lately to help create a buffer in Spanish society, as these protesters and destroyers are definitely NOT the majority, but are making a LOT of noise and damage in a very violent, undemocratic way.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 05:06 AM
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Lincasanova...a 25% unemployment rate, 55% for those under 30, approx same for over 45...higher taxes and less rights every year...I don´t know, but there´s probably ground for massive protests against those ruling this formerly rich country...
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 05:50 AM
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Of course it is dire now.. but the king does not govern this country and many of the other protests are about independence.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 05:59 AM
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Since the two major political parties in Spain took a serious blow in the recent EU elections (first time the center-right PP and center-left PSOE together got under 50% in any elections), the abdication of the ever more unpopular king (closely linked to the traditional PP and PSOE establishment), might make more likely some much needed political reforms in the wake of economic crisis, housing crisis, sky high unemployment, corruption scandals etc. etc. Juan Carlos also suggested in his speech that a new generation was now needed to face the challenges.

As this commentator in El Pais said, the abdication might then prove to be Juan Carlos last service to the Spanish Democracy:
http://politica.elpais.com/politica/...45_221676.html
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 06:12 AM
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" in most major cities people are demonstrating asking for the return of the Republic"

Where's the evidence for that?

Demonstrations with banners saying ""España, mañana, será republicana" (note spelling) absolutely isn't "the return of the Republic"

Calling for the abdication of the monarch is an understandable, if politically illiterate, reaction to Spain's economic mismanagement by its politicians. In its political illiteracy, perfectly compatible with most other posturing self-indulgences by Spain's voters.

Calling for the return of the Republic (which has a very precise and chilling meaning in Spain) means something completely different. Does the poster really think there's pressure for that? Because if there is, someone's been very skilled in keeping it out of the media.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 06:34 AM
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Well...if demonstrating with republican flags is not asking for the return of the Republic, I don´t know what it is then...Monarchy was reinstored in 1978, but previous to the dictatorship of Franco we had a Republic, the 2nd...so I guess that it´s correct, people were demonstrating in favor of a 3rd Republic.

Or maybe should I have said, "the return of -A- Republican regime?" I´m sorry, but I´m not a native English speaker.

Do I think there´s pressure for that? Certainly, but not enough yet.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 07:13 AM
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I see no shadows of the Civil War in this protest ( although, those shadows have not left
Spain by a long shot).
Several friends we have in Madrid ( well off professionals) expressed very little love for the Monarchy
when we approached the subject last year.

What would be wrong with the 3rd Republic anyway?
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 07:27 AM
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(in fact, I know no one supporting the Monarchy...but that may mean little too)
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 08:17 AM
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<Calling for the abdication of the monarch is an understandable, if politically illiterate, reaction to Spain's economic mismanagement by its politicians>

Very few, if any, Spanish have called for the abdication of Juan Carlos as a reaction to Spain's economic mismanagement by its politicians. The often quite massive protests over the three past years have been directed towards the politicians, but Juan Carlos has been a strong symbol of the political establishment since the transition in the late 70's.

Now, many are calling for a "transición real, sin rey", meaning a real transition from the dictatorship, and this time without king. Note that "transición real", real transition also can mean "kingly transition". Nobody beats the Spanish when it comes to making political - and other - posters and slogans.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 09:10 AM
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... royal transition would of course be a much better English translation of the double meaning of "transicion real"/real transition. Not much political illiteracy here...
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 11:33 AM
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kimhe,
thanks for explaining the nuances of Spanish to the rest of us (who are not fluent). Very clever!
What purpose serves the Monarchy these days eludes me.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 11:58 AM
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One friend in Spain has changed her profile image on FB to the flag of the Republic. Juan Carlos is embroiled in a financial scandal. He also killed an elephant on safari a couple of years ago which re-affirmed his sensibility to a different era.

As Kimhe noted, anger has being brewing for years due primarily to high unemployment. The unemployment is a new psychological situation where there a great part of a new generation of university educated people but without work.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 01:39 PM
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"As Kimhe noted, anger has being brewing for years due primarily to high unemployment. The unemployment is a new psychological situation where there a great part of a new generation of university educated people but without work."

Which has absolutely nothing to do with the King and everything to do with numpty individuals borrowing silly amounts of money from greedy banks who queued up to lend it to them. Throw in property developers building enough property to house all of China and local governments like Valencia acting as if they were some sort of Middle East oil rich state and you see why there is no capital left to invest for the future.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 01:53 PM
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<Which has absolutely nothing to do with the King and everything to do with numpty individuals borrowing silly amounts of money from greedy banks who queued up to lend it to them>

An important part of the story and the name of the game not only here.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 02:25 PM
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King Juan Carlos has gotten a bad name indeed because of the financial scandal and the elephant 'adventure'.
Prince Felipe has the benefit of the doubt and may bring a breathe of fresh air to the Spanish monarchy. Just as in Belgium, and in the Netherlands. It's time for a younger generation.
I wonder whether there will be any festivities on the 18th.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 05:43 PM
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Mikelg,

"Lateday, the Valley of the Fallen is fully open to the public, no changes since your visit."

Sorry, I was misinformed. Thank you for the clarification. Is it still a popular site for foreign travelers?

I was in Spain in 2000 and again in 2006. On my latter visit I could not get over how well the country appeared to be doing economically - especially the roads in northern Spain and construction sites and cranes everywhere. Then the crash - with resultant unemployment particularly for the young. Sad...
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 06:20 PM
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Yes, there were greedy developers, bankers and politicians who contributed to the
present economic situation.
In all of that, I cannot but marvel at the excellent public transit, roads, airports and other infrastructure
one often finds in Spain.
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Old Jun 4th, 2014, 07:35 PM
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Right, all that was paid for by Northern Europe. If the Basque country and Catalunya were to sepate from Spain, there would be nothing left but flamenco and great highways .
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