Spain itinerary; driving in the Pyrenees
Aug 28th, 2006, 12:28 PM
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Spain itinerary; driving in the Pyrenees
Hi all,
Our Spain itinerary is coming together:
9/29: arrive in Barcelona
9/30: Barcelona
10/1: Barcelona
10/2: drive to Peretallada as base for Costa Brava
10/3: explore Costa Brava, nearby villages
10/4: explore Costa Brava, nearby villages
10/5: drive to Ainsa
10/6: Ainsa/Ordesa National Park
10/7: drive to San Sebastian
10/8: San Sebastian
10/9: drive back to Barcelona (maybe stops in Pamplona or Montserrat?)
10/10: fly home to Chicago
We have all of our lodging booked except for San Sebastian... still working on that.
Now we need to rent a car. My question: do we need something other than a basic economy car for driving in the Pyrenees? From Peretallada to Ainsa, we're thinking of this route: A7 to A2 to N240 to Barbastro, then N123 to A 138 to Ainsa (following Maribel's advice). For Ainsa to SS, we may go through France--this seems like the quickest route, and for this drive we won't be making any leisurely stops to explore.
thanks in advance!
Our Spain itinerary is coming together:
9/29: arrive in Barcelona
9/30: Barcelona
10/1: Barcelona
10/2: drive to Peretallada as base for Costa Brava
10/3: explore Costa Brava, nearby villages
10/4: explore Costa Brava, nearby villages
10/5: drive to Ainsa
10/6: Ainsa/Ordesa National Park
10/7: drive to San Sebastian
10/8: San Sebastian
10/9: drive back to Barcelona (maybe stops in Pamplona or Montserrat?)
10/10: fly home to Chicago
We have all of our lodging booked except for San Sebastian... still working on that.
Now we need to rent a car. My question: do we need something other than a basic economy car for driving in the Pyrenees? From Peretallada to Ainsa, we're thinking of this route: A7 to A2 to N240 to Barbastro, then N123 to A 138 to Ainsa (following Maribel's advice). For Ainsa to SS, we may go through France--this seems like the quickest route, and for this drive we won't be making any leisurely stops to explore.
thanks in advance!
Aug 28th, 2006, 01:00 PM
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Hi strass,
If you decide to take the route through France from Ainsa up the A138 through Ordesa Park and Bielsa, you'll still have plenty mountain driving. It's a good road, but mountain driving nonetheless. And you'll want to explore Ordesa. The drive from Torla to Biescas is spectacular but slow going, if you decide to do it.
With that in mind, I strongly suggest you go above the "basic" economy car. We just returned from time spent there, driving a Peugeot 303 diesel, with a 1.6 liter engine-sufficient power to handle the drive well. We rented through Europcar. It was a category C compact.
Driving west on the A 64 on the French side, through Tarbes, Pau, Bayonne, Biarritz down to San Sebastián is fast and easy.
If you decide to take the route through France from Ainsa up the A138 through Ordesa Park and Bielsa, you'll still have plenty mountain driving. It's a good road, but mountain driving nonetheless. And you'll want to explore Ordesa. The drive from Torla to Biescas is spectacular but slow going, if you decide to do it.
With that in mind, I strongly suggest you go above the "basic" economy car. We just returned from time spent there, driving a Peugeot 303 diesel, with a 1.6 liter engine-sufficient power to handle the drive well. We rented through Europcar. It was a category C compact.
Driving west on the A 64 on the French side, through Tarbes, Pau, Bayonne, Biarritz down to San Sebastián is fast and easy.
Aug 28th, 2006, 01:09 PM
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I agree with Maribel that driving west on the A 64 on the French side is fast and easy -- and if you want to do something really extraordinary, go up to Aix-en-Thermes and take the mountain road through Andorra, then drop down the Pyrenees to Spain and Barcelona. But that means spending the night in Aix-en-Thermes and being willing to drop the plan if locals tell you the weather is too iffy at that time of October.
However, you might also consider dropping of your rental in Bilbao and flying back to Barcelona. You can probably find a very cheap flight, and that would give you more time to play with in the middle, maybe especially an extra night in San Sebastian and an extra night back in Barcelona.
If you want a good aiport hotel for Barcelona, I had a very good stay at the Tryp, with a very good rate through bookings.es.
However, you might also consider dropping of your rental in Bilbao and flying back to Barcelona. You can probably find a very cheap flight, and that would give you more time to play with in the middle, maybe especially an extra night in San Sebastian and an extra night back in Barcelona.
If you want a good aiport hotel for Barcelona, I had a very good stay at the Tryp, with a very good rate through bookings.es.
Aug 28th, 2006, 02:01 PM
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We did think about flying back to Barcelona, but I don't really think it would save us much time... we would still be traveling on that Monday, 10/9 (just by plane, not car), and our flight home leaves Tuesday morning at 9:40 a.m. It would probably only save us an hour or two to fly...
Aug 28th, 2006, 02:28 PM
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strass,
I would avoid Andorra at absolutely all costs, It would be far, far out of your way, over 4 valleys on narrow mountain roads, backtracking far east from Bielsa to Seo.
Yes, you've done your map homework very well.
The route up through Bielsa, across the border to St. Lary Soulan then up to the A 64 and over west on the A 64 will probably be faster and easier for the driver than driving from Ainsa to Sabiñánigo to Jaca to Pamplona to San Sebastian, which we recently did (but not in one day).
The latter route is decidedly more scenic, because you have more mountain scenery, but there are also multiple temptations for sightseeing detours, which would slow you down!
I would avoid Andorra at absolutely all costs, It would be far, far out of your way, over 4 valleys on narrow mountain roads, backtracking far east from Bielsa to Seo.
Yes, you've done your map homework very well.
The route up through Bielsa, across the border to St. Lary Soulan then up to the A 64 and over west on the A 64 will probably be faster and easier for the driver than driving from Ainsa to Sabiñánigo to Jaca to Pamplona to San Sebastian, which we recently did (but not in one day).
The latter route is decidedly more scenic, because you have more mountain scenery, but there are also multiple temptations for sightseeing detours, which would slow you down!
Aug 28th, 2006, 03:42 PM
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Ah, well, who can quarrel with Maribel? The time of year isn't favorable for an Andorran climb anyway.
I interested to recently discover that Mappy clocked the route from Toulouse through Andorra down to Bourg-Madame to Barcelona at four hours.
I interested to recently discover that Mappy clocked the route from Toulouse through Andorra down to Bourg-Madame to Barcelona at four hours.
Aug 28th, 2006, 05:54 PM
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Hi strass,
About flying back to Bcn- your feeling is correct.
The airfares from the San Sebastián airport (in Hondarribia) to Barcelona are not usually cheap or extremely convenient due to lack of competition to date with the low cost carriers. And the plan to enlarge the airport is a major issue at this time.
I forgot to address your return to Barcelona from S.S. by car on Mon. 10/9.
Driving time via the autoroute from San Sebastián through Pamplona, Zaragoza, Lleida will be roughly 6 hrs.
From Pamplona it takes us 5 hrs.
Montserrat would be a somewhat time consuming detour from the NII (you would really need to be compelled to do this), while Pamplona is a quicker detour, right on the A 15.
If I personally needed to make the six hour S.S. -Bcn drive in one day, I would just do the drive straight through and enjoy my last night in Barcelona.
It's a roughly 25 min. max. taxi ride from a downtown hotel to El Prat airport, and cost is approximately 20 euros, including the supplement for suitcases carried in the trunk.
Hope this helps.
About flying back to Bcn- your feeling is correct.
The airfares from the San Sebastián airport (in Hondarribia) to Barcelona are not usually cheap or extremely convenient due to lack of competition to date with the low cost carriers. And the plan to enlarge the airport is a major issue at this time.
I forgot to address your return to Barcelona from S.S. by car on Mon. 10/9.
Driving time via the autoroute from San Sebastián through Pamplona, Zaragoza, Lleida will be roughly 6 hrs.
From Pamplona it takes us 5 hrs.
Montserrat would be a somewhat time consuming detour from the NII (you would really need to be compelled to do this), while Pamplona is a quicker detour, right on the A 15.
If I personally needed to make the six hour S.S. -Bcn drive in one day, I would just do the drive straight through and enjoy my last night in Barcelona.
It's a roughly 25 min. max. taxi ride from a downtown hotel to El Prat airport, and cost is approximately 20 euros, including the supplement for suitcases carried in the trunk.
Hope this helps.
Aug 28th, 2006, 06:33 PM
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Thanks for the info about Montserrat... I know my husband is interested in Pamplona, so if we make any detour, I think it'll be there... it sounds simpler! And we do want to fully enjoy one last night in Barcelona. We'll probably take a cab to the airport the next morning just to be on the safe side, instead of wrangling with public transportation during rush hour.
Aug 29th, 2006, 10:26 AM
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hi strass,
Just in case you make the stop in Pamplona....You'll probably want to focus on the Old Quarter, which is wonderfully walkable.
Just follow signs to El Corte Inglés, and park NOT there (very exp.!) but in the underground garage at the Baluarte Performing Arts Center next door. Parking in the Casco Viejo (Old Quarter) is impossible (we have dear friends who live there), and street parking is blue zone, which is a hassle.
From the Baluarte, it's an easy walk to the epicenter of the old town, the Plaza del Castillo of The Sun Also Rises fame. In the square peek in or have a coffee at the Café Iruña of Hemingway fame, and from there you can walk the encierro (Running of the Bulls) route. It's marked by new red signs. The historic Hotel Perla is now closed for renovation (making it into a 5 star).
Start your "encierro" walk down at the end of Santo Domingo (where the corrals are set up during fiesta), walk up to the pretty town hall square, Plaza Consistorial, where the opening ceremony, the "chupinazo", takes place at noon July 6, turn left on Mercaderes, then right on Estafeta (the most famous stretch of the run), then down Estafeta to the bullring. You'll see the Hemingway statue to the left of the entrance. On Estafeta street you'll pass the Casa del Libro (green facade with red letters) which sells books about the fiesta and about Navarra, then Olentzero, which is a nice store to pick up classic Navarran gifts, gourmet products, figurines of the giants/cabezudos, kilikis/zaldikos of the fiesta or posters. www.olentzeroa.com
Plus two wildly popular Kukusumusu (means "kiss of the flea" in Basque) shops that sell really clever graphic design souvenirs, such as t-shirts, hats, key chains, beach wear, everything under the sun with the Kukusumusu designs. They're the creators of www.sanfermin.com Kids love that stuff.
The famous ZZZ bota (wine skin) bags can be found on Comedias #7.
Pintxos (tapas) in Pamplona can rival the quality of those in San Sebastián if you know where to stop.
My favorites in the Old Quarter are:
Bar Gaucho (very creative-just bought their cookbook) on Espoz y Mina #7, right off the Plaza Castillo
Bar Monasterio, Espoz y Mina #11 at Europa Hotel
And on the street of the thousand bars, there's
Bar Baserri, San Nicolás #32
Bar Iru, San Nicolás #25 (which as a great 3 course menú del día for 15 euros)
There's a "De Pintxos por Pamplona" program, a voucher sold for 20 euros at participating bars (Estafeta, Iru, Gaucho, Baserri) that gives the bearer 4 special creative pintxos and 4 glasses of wine, for doing a pintxos crawl.
The Old Quarter of Pamplona is a walker's delight-very atmospheric. If you'd like to see the statue of San Fermín, he's kept in his Chapel in the church of San Lorenzo, on the way to lovely Taconera Park. There's a cute little Alpine looking tea house in the park behind the Hotel 3 Reyes, El Bosquecillo, which is a nice place to have a drink outside. Pamplona has an impressive amount of park space. The Ciudadela Park is particularly pretty.
The tourist office is located off the Plaza de San Francisco on the corner of Eslava, if you need it, or want to pick up some posters (some are free, other vintage ones they sell).
Have fun!
Just in case you make the stop in Pamplona....You'll probably want to focus on the Old Quarter, which is wonderfully walkable.
Just follow signs to El Corte Inglés, and park NOT there (very exp.!) but in the underground garage at the Baluarte Performing Arts Center next door. Parking in the Casco Viejo (Old Quarter) is impossible (we have dear friends who live there), and street parking is blue zone, which is a hassle.
From the Baluarte, it's an easy walk to the epicenter of the old town, the Plaza del Castillo of The Sun Also Rises fame. In the square peek in or have a coffee at the Café Iruña of Hemingway fame, and from there you can walk the encierro (Running of the Bulls) route. It's marked by new red signs. The historic Hotel Perla is now closed for renovation (making it into a 5 star).
Start your "encierro" walk down at the end of Santo Domingo (where the corrals are set up during fiesta), walk up to the pretty town hall square, Plaza Consistorial, where the opening ceremony, the "chupinazo", takes place at noon July 6, turn left on Mercaderes, then right on Estafeta (the most famous stretch of the run), then down Estafeta to the bullring. You'll see the Hemingway statue to the left of the entrance. On Estafeta street you'll pass the Casa del Libro (green facade with red letters) which sells books about the fiesta and about Navarra, then Olentzero, which is a nice store to pick up classic Navarran gifts, gourmet products, figurines of the giants/cabezudos, kilikis/zaldikos of the fiesta or posters. www.olentzeroa.com
Plus two wildly popular Kukusumusu (means "kiss of the flea" in Basque) shops that sell really clever graphic design souvenirs, such as t-shirts, hats, key chains, beach wear, everything under the sun with the Kukusumusu designs. They're the creators of www.sanfermin.com Kids love that stuff.
The famous ZZZ bota (wine skin) bags can be found on Comedias #7.
Pintxos (tapas) in Pamplona can rival the quality of those in San Sebastián if you know where to stop.
My favorites in the Old Quarter are:
Bar Gaucho (very creative-just bought their cookbook) on Espoz y Mina #7, right off the Plaza Castillo
Bar Monasterio, Espoz y Mina #11 at Europa Hotel
And on the street of the thousand bars, there's
Bar Baserri, San Nicolás #32
Bar Iru, San Nicolás #25 (which as a great 3 course menú del día for 15 euros)
There's a "De Pintxos por Pamplona" program, a voucher sold for 20 euros at participating bars (Estafeta, Iru, Gaucho, Baserri) that gives the bearer 4 special creative pintxos and 4 glasses of wine, for doing a pintxos crawl.
The Old Quarter of Pamplona is a walker's delight-very atmospheric. If you'd like to see the statue of San Fermín, he's kept in his Chapel in the church of San Lorenzo, on the way to lovely Taconera Park. There's a cute little Alpine looking tea house in the park behind the Hotel 3 Reyes, El Bosquecillo, which is a nice place to have a drink outside. Pamplona has an impressive amount of park space. The Ciudadela Park is particularly pretty.
The tourist office is located off the Plaza de San Francisco on the corner of Eslava, if you need it, or want to pick up some posters (some are free, other vintage ones they sell).
Have fun!
Aug 29th, 2006, 11:28 AM
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Thanks so much for this info about Pamplona, Maribel. I was having a hard time finding these kinds of details about the city in the guidebooks I have. My husband will be excited to read it.
Sep 6th, 2006, 09:13 AM
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Another thought came to mind, and I can't seem to find info on it in my Rough Guide Pyrenees... is there anything we should know about crossing the border via car from Spain to France, and then back to Spain? Will we need to show our passports, are there car searches, lines, etc.?
Sep 6th, 2006, 09:49 AM
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No, there are no searches EXCEPT at the border that you do want to avoid at all costs, going from Seu to Andorra, where cars are routinely searched and the short drive can take hours. Spanairds go in droves to the shopping malls of Andorra for cheap tabacco, fuel and electronics.
Where you plan to cross, you won't have to show a passport, as we didn't.
Where you plan to cross, you won't have to show a passport, as we didn't.
Sep 11th, 2006, 12:38 PM
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In case Maribel or anyone else checks back on this thread... is there anyplace especially worth stopping on this route from Peratallada to Ainsa: A7 to A2 to N240 to Barbastro, then N123 to A 138. We don't mind driving it straight through (it's about 5 hours), but we don't want to miss any particularly interesting sites (monasteries, ruins, etc.). Thanks!
Sep 11th, 2006, 01:09 PM
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Hi strass,
To make good time, I would do the A7-A2-N240 straight through and save my detours until Barbastro. Then I would definitely take the A 1232 (white road) for a magnificent detour to Alquézar, another Aragón village as dramatically perched and interesting as Aínsa but far less touristed because it's more remote-about a 20 km. detour from the N240 at Barbastro. Visit the Colegiata de Santa María, a castle-monastery. Open 10:30-1:30, 4-7:30 Mon.-Fri. and Sat. 10:30-1:30 only. If timing is right you could eat lunch at the Mesón del Vero on the square.
You could also access Alquézar south from Aínsa but the drive would be more challenging.
To make good time, I would do the A7-A2-N240 straight through and save my detours until Barbastro. Then I would definitely take the A 1232 (white road) for a magnificent detour to Alquézar, another Aragón village as dramatically perched and interesting as Aínsa but far less touristed because it's more remote-about a 20 km. detour from the N240 at Barbastro. Visit the Colegiata de Santa María, a castle-monastery. Open 10:30-1:30, 4-7:30 Mon.-Fri. and Sat. 10:30-1:30 only. If timing is right you could eat lunch at the Mesón del Vero on the square.
You could also access Alquézar south from Aínsa but the drive would be more challenging.
Sep 12th, 2006, 10:52 AM
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Don't know if you booked a hotel for San Sebastian yet, but I would recommend the Hotel Londres y Inglaterra. There is nothing like walking out the door onto La Concha. Simply spectacular and the staff are very gracious.
Wherever I go, I love to tour the markets. You should definitely make a stop at Mercado del la Brecha. Sobles (Aldamar 1)is a great gourmet food store. Favorite pinxos: spider crab with anchovies, pigeon pie, fish pudding. Just point and eat. Save travels.
Just my two cents, but do not skimp and get an economy car. Those switchback mountain turns can be treacherous. Go with quality, horse power and an automatic if possible. We stalled so many times and thought we were going to roll all the way back to Barcelona! Safe travels.
Wherever I go, I love to tour the markets. You should definitely make a stop at Mercado del la Brecha. Sobles (Aldamar 1)is a great gourmet food store. Favorite pinxos: spider crab with anchovies, pigeon pie, fish pudding. Just point and eat. Save travels.
Just my two cents, but do not skimp and get an economy car. Those switchback mountain turns can be treacherous. Go with quality, horse power and an automatic if possible. We stalled so many times and thought we were going to roll all the way back to Barcelona! Safe travels.
Oct 2nd, 2006, 05:59 PM
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Hello all. I'm hoping someone out there can help me out with some answers. In late March 07 I'm traveling to Bilbao and from there planning on driving to Barcelona, but I'd like to this via the Pyrenees. My question is, does anyone know how dangerous it is driving through the Pyrenees during the last week of March?
Oct 2nd, 2006, 06:58 PM
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When I was planning my trip I found an old New York Times article online that made an early Spring trip sound pretty hairy. The author was surprised by a sudden snow and ice storm that left him and several other cars crawling along at 15 mph on slippery slopes.
I was there in May, and ended up crossing from Spain into France driving on a hairpin-turn road through the most dense cloud of pure white fog I have ever experienced. I hung my head out the car window and kept my front tire generally pointed at the white center line I could barely make out, and kept asking my husband: "What are you seeing out your window -- mountain or sheer drop?" Often he wasn't sure.
I probably wouldn't travel in the Pyrenees before May, and if I did, I wouldn't use the roads as a transit route when I needed to get from one place to the next by a certain time. I'd only go up if I knew it didn't matter if I didn't get down for a day or two.
I was there in May, and ended up crossing from Spain into France driving on a hairpin-turn road through the most dense cloud of pure white fog I have ever experienced. I hung my head out the car window and kept my front tire generally pointed at the white center line I could barely make out, and kept asking my husband: "What are you seeing out your window -- mountain or sheer drop?" Often he wasn't sure.
I probably wouldn't travel in the Pyrenees before May, and if I did, I wouldn't use the roads as a transit route when I needed to get from one place to the next by a certain time. I'd only go up if I knew it didn't matter if I didn't get down for a day or two.
