Smoking - Great Britain
May 25th, 2006, 04:31 AM
#42
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That logic is fuzzy.
"Look, if you don't like smoke don't go anywhere that allows it. " No, that means that the rights of non-smokers to breathe clean air are pre-empted. A very inequitable situation.
"Think we should ban obese people from all public places, effecive immediately." Not a parallel example. Obese people do not pose a threat to the health of others, as smokers do. They also don't make one's clothes stink, nor do they dull one's ability to taste food.
"Macdonalds should be advertising themselves as 'for the wanting heart disease only.'" Eating at McDonald's in moderation has not been shown to cause illness. Inhaling carbon monoxide, formaldehyde, and combustion products has. Think about it: people are frequently treated for smoke inhalation, but not for hamburger ingestion.
"Look, if you don't like smoke don't go anywhere that allows it. " No, that means that the rights of non-smokers to breathe clean air are pre-empted. A very inequitable situation.
"Think we should ban obese people from all public places, effecive immediately." Not a parallel example. Obese people do not pose a threat to the health of others, as smokers do. They also don't make one's clothes stink, nor do they dull one's ability to taste food.
"Macdonalds should be advertising themselves as 'for the wanting heart disease only.'" Eating at McDonald's in moderation has not been shown to cause illness. Inhaling carbon monoxide, formaldehyde, and combustion products has. Think about it: people are frequently treated for smoke inhalation, but not for hamburger ingestion.
May 25th, 2006, 04:40 AM
#43
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Sorry Fuzzylogic,
Didn't realise yours was a question.
Could be why no one answered.
Obesity is a big problem in the world, your right especially is USA and also here in UK.
The title of this thread is Smoking-Great Britain.
Please feel free to begin a thread about killing off anyone over 6 stone.
;-)
Muck
Didn't realise yours was a question.
Could be why no one answered.
Obesity is a big problem in the world, your right especially is USA and also here in UK.
The title of this thread is Smoking-Great Britain.
Please feel free to begin a thread about killing off anyone over 6 stone.
;-)
Muck
May 25th, 2006, 05:26 AM
#45
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robespierre- while there are smoke eaters and ionic devices that mask the smell of smoke, there is no "ventilation system" that exists that takes the carcinogens from the air. Find me one and I'll print this page and eat it.
May 25th, 2006, 05:40 AM
#47
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My husband is an engineer and sells those to power plants. I'm getting back to you. The EPAs statement says that QUOTE "no air cleaning system has been proven effective to remove the harmful chemicals in smoke from air"
HERE is a link:http://www.townsendletter.com/May200...leaner0506.htm
HERE is a link:http://www.townsendletter.com/May200...leaner0506.htm
May 25th, 2006, 05:42 AM
#48
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The article is titled <u>Portable Air Cleaners: To Buy or Not to Buy</u>. It is not about commercial air purification systems.
The EPA statement refers to portable air cleaners for domestic use, which is not the topic. Obviously, clean-room environments with vanishingly small amounts of pollutants are routinely achieved in myriad manufacturing plants.
A well-engineered commercial system for hospitality service gets much of its air supply from outdoors (which is intrinsically cleaner than used indoor air), and, after heating or cooling it, filters and precipitates it. Polluted exhaust air is vented to the atmosphere. Heat exchangers are used to salvage the temperature of the exhausted air and transfer it to the freshly-introduced air.
The EPA statement refers to portable air cleaners for domestic use, which is not the topic. Obviously, clean-room environments with vanishingly small amounts of pollutants are routinely achieved in myriad manufacturing plants.
A well-engineered commercial system for hospitality service gets much of its air supply from outdoors (which is intrinsically cleaner than used indoor air), and, after heating or cooling it, filters and precipitates it. Polluted exhaust air is vented to the atmosphere. Heat exchangers are used to salvage the temperature of the exhausted air and transfer it to the freshly-introduced air.
May 25th, 2006, 06:12 AM
#49
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David, I am indeed available.
This sadly has been done before several years ago, much to Mrs Mucks dismay, however the victim sat smoking in a non-smoking area in a restaurant despite repeated requests to stop.
So when we finished our meal, I 'breezed' out of the restaurant,
passing within inches of the smoker. I think that was evens...
Muck
This sadly has been done before several years ago, much to Mrs Mucks dismay, however the victim sat smoking in a non-smoking area in a restaurant despite repeated requests to stop.
So when we finished our meal, I 'breezed' out of the restaurant,
passing within inches of the smoker. I think that was evens...
Muck
May 25th, 2006, 07:21 AM
#51
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Re the air ventilation systems...I wonder if you ever can go out into the streets. If you sit inhaling car exhaust fumes for a matter of minutes they will actually kill you there and then, yet we all walk along pavements quite happily while car after car rushes by.
If you want "recycled" air to be absolutely carcinogen free, then perhaps you should live at one of the poles, and even then the wildlife probably light up every so often.
If you want "recycled" air to be absolutely carcinogen free, then perhaps you should live at one of the poles, and even then the wildlife probably light up every so often.
May 25th, 2006, 07:43 AM
#52
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While Obesity is definately on the rise and there are numerous possible health problems that could derive from it, the effects of obesity are not as apparent as the effects of smoking or second hand smoke.
It is still basically a roll of the dice with obesity...it also depends of the severity of the obesity. Some obese people will have severe health problems, and others will not (that always baffles my doctor why I have such good cholesterol, low blood pressure, no diabetes, etc.).
But with smoking, 1st or 2nd hand, it seems like the odds greatly increase that you will get some form of cancer.
Those commercials that were true and totally made me cry were the ones where the people who were the spouses of smokers died from cancer.
"My wife was my life. Second hand smoke killed my wife."---that guy still makes me cry.
As for mcdonald's, while I try to avoid that place, their salads with grilled chicken are actually quite good. The tomatoes seem good and fresh!
It is still basically a roll of the dice with obesity...it also depends of the severity of the obesity. Some obese people will have severe health problems, and others will not (that always baffles my doctor why I have such good cholesterol, low blood pressure, no diabetes, etc.).
But with smoking, 1st or 2nd hand, it seems like the odds greatly increase that you will get some form of cancer.
Those commercials that were true and totally made me cry were the ones where the people who were the spouses of smokers died from cancer.
"My wife was my life. Second hand smoke killed my wife."---that guy still makes me cry.
As for mcdonald's, while I try to avoid that place, their salads with grilled chicken are actually quite good. The tomatoes seem good and fresh!
May 25th, 2006, 07:45 AM
#53
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Ps...I realized that my post sounded a bit too pro-obesity.
let me make it clear that I do feel that obesity is at epidemic levels and increases a person's risk of all sorts of diseases overall.
I only differ in that the effects of inhaling imbalming fluid, arsenic, tar are far more proven at being detrimental.
let me make it clear that I do feel that obesity is at epidemic levels and increases a person's risk of all sorts of diseases overall.
I only differ in that the effects of inhaling imbalming fluid, arsenic, tar are far more proven at being detrimental.
May 25th, 2006, 08:12 AM
#54
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Obesity is far uglier than someone smoking a cigarette. However, an obese person in a fast food place and smoking is utterly vile.
Another piece of paraphrasing from Hockney..."People are too concerned about the length of life, but not the quality of it".
Another piece of paraphrasing from Hockney..."People are too concerned about the length of life, but not the quality of it".
May 25th, 2006, 08:19 AM
#55
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I think that how we view obesity makes it appear uglier than smoking.
Which is why so many women and men end up dying from lung cancer because they fear that quitting cigarettes will cause them to gain weight.
I also feel that with obesity, people automatically assume gluttony, sloth, greed, and lack of restraint. Which is sometimes the case, but definately not always.
I wonder if people actually witnessed the ravages of lung or throat cancer and how horrible it is to see a person waste away if they would still make such a comparisson.
Which is why so many women and men end up dying from lung cancer because they fear that quitting cigarettes will cause them to gain weight.
I also feel that with obesity, people automatically assume gluttony, sloth, greed, and lack of restraint. Which is sometimes the case, but definately not always.
I wonder if people actually witnessed the ravages of lung or throat cancer and how horrible it is to see a person waste away if they would still make such a comparisson.
May 25th, 2006, 08:52 AM
#56
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I TOTALLY agree with Fuzzy! Such a great deal about smoking and never seen so much junk greasy food and obesity like I saw in the 3 weeks I was in the USA. Is that healthy????? Or is only smoke that kills?
May 25th, 2006, 10:24 AM
#57
The "junk greasy food" (whch is also found in large quantities in the UK) won't kill me if I don't eat it. The smoke from someone else's cigarette may, although I have never smoked. You has the right to do whatever you want to your own body, but keep your smoke away from mine.
May 25th, 2006, 10:54 AM
#58
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MK We agree on something !!
"Another piece of paraphrasing from Hockney..."People are too concerned about the length of life, but not the quality of it".
Wow that is so true, and another reason why smoking should be banned in public places. To improve the quality of life for us all.
Muck
"Another piece of paraphrasing from Hockney..."People are too concerned about the length of life, but not the quality of it".
Wow that is so true, and another reason why smoking should be banned in public places. To improve the quality of life for us all.
Muck
May 26th, 2006, 12:04 AM
#59
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Strange goings on. They've evidently removed some postings (particularly the f*arting references) but we seem to have ended up with some misattributions, which should thoroughly confuse anyone who wasn't following this !
Excellent badinage, David & Muck
Excellent badinage, David & Muck
May 26th, 2006, 12:10 AM
#60
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Let me lower the tone again, then. I can remember when there were signs everywhere reminding people not to spit in public - I think as a health measure against the spread of TB, but it's also a filthy habit (and that seems to be not irrelevant). Where's the difference between that and banning smoking in public?
