WASA THE SWEDE

1. Dress as you want, we don't care. <BR>2. Be as fat as you want, we dont care. <BR>3. But PLEASE try not to speak so loud <BR> <BR>Thomas <BR> <BR>

Konstantin

First of all, I'm not an American, I'm a Russian (the nation which traditionally takes worst opinions from foreigners - communists, evil empire and so on). I don't want to offend anybody, but I think that each nation contains a pretty big part (up to 50% may be) of stupid people. They usually don't care what the others will think about them because they don't respect the others. They know nothing about other people (nations, cultures) and don't even try to understand anything. They have no tact, no taste and so on. Of course, all of us are not ideal, but smart people at least could understand they bad features and try not to show them to the others. <BR> <BR>The only difference between stupid people of different nations is their abilities (financial first of all). When our (Russian) stupid people can earn money only to buy a bottle of vodka and some food, American stupids are rich enough to be able to go everywhere they want and show their stupidity all around the world. Germans, for example also could speak pretty loud and almost all their females (even old grannies far after 60) do not hesitate to be topless at public beaches. So, folks - relax! I don't know which nation is the best, but Americans are certainly far not the worst. <BR> <BR>I only think, there will be no use of this discussion, because stupid people will not even try to improve themselves (I actually doubt if they will read our messages at all). <BR> <BR>Konstantin

WASA THE SWEDE

NEAL SANDERS, That's why it is so much better to be an independent traveller, Do as you want, can blend more with the locals etc etc. <BR>Wasa

Pierrette

<BR>to Debra <BR>My daughter has lived in London for ten years and she says nobody is louder and draws more attention to himself than the Aussie tourist. As a French Canadian wintering in Florida I must admit that my fellow female French Canadians frequently make me cringe.

Jim

I'm from West (by God!) Virginia and proud to be American. We have saved the world from Communism, Fascism, Naziism and even probly Baptism. WE WON and we'll act accordingly. <BR>

Lee

Too bad we can't save the world from us. <BR> <BR>The world owes us no debt of gratitude. We're talking about visiting, not foreign policy. <BR> <BR>I, too have been "tacky". In 1983, I moved to Frankfurt, Germany to work for a US defense contractor. My first visit anywhere was a tour to Paris after just one month in Europe. I expected to be treated well, after all, I was a guest. On my first day, I asked a policeman under the Eiffel Tower for Metro directions and he gave me the finger. The same day, I was pushed out of line when asking for an English menu. I had a couple of other events that I didn't like and when I returned to work, I mentioned this to a coworker who had lived in Europe for 20 years. I asked him what was wrong with those people. He asked what was wrong with ME. Did I think that my American passport entitled me to some red carpet treatment? If I did, he said, then I was in the wrong place and that I shouldn't unpack. I did unpack and I stayed three years. I have visted at least six countries in Europe, several times each and my wife and I went back to Germany last summer and Paris this year and every single time I had a great trip. We're doing Bavaria and Austria next spring with her parents (my idea). The only thing I don't pack when I go is an attitude. I treat the country and the people the way I would like to be treated and guess what? They treat me good. Being loud and demanding and inconsiderate doesn't work ANYWHERE. Travel well, have fun!

Arizona

For what it's worth, we have developed a theory about why persons of our own nationality come across as loud-sounding as they do. It's this: we understand what they are saying, so our ears naturally tune in on what they say. We recently returned from Turkey. We understand only a few words and phrases of that oh-so-different language. But it was so nice just to pass the day not understanding all the hubbub going on around us. Loudspeakers, hawkers, radios, street vendors -- it all was a kind of "music" -- until we would hear someone say, "Arthur, I'm over here" or "Dolores, where the hell are you?" Then we would tune in on the loudest and most inane conversations possible because we knew what these nerds were mouthing. We, too, Neal, had a couple of loudmouths in our group. <BR>No comment was too stupid to remain unsaid, no complaint was allowed to be stifled, no limits were placed on crude conduct. What did we do? Just ignored them, knowing that in 10-9-8-7-6-5-4..days we would never see (or hear) these fellow-citizens again. But, Poor Arthur, he would have to come at the beck and call of Dolores for the rest of his life! Poor man!

sase

I would like to say that I just returned from england and I tried to blend. But I never saw so many people with earings sticking out of the strangest places. One girl hand six nose rings pluse earrings, belly rings and who knows what else. Everyone had the strange colors of hair and everyone wore black. i did noticed only the Americans were overweight. Most English are thin pierced and SMOKED constantly. The shoes were always 6 inch platforms, I prefer my sneakers to back problems any day! It was a fun experience to people watch but I bet when they get older the will have back and knee trouble. And please I wish they would wear deoderant!!

Joanna

Regarding the cringe-worthy tourists in the above posts, I have also come across Australians in groups who act in much the same way - and I hate to say it but they are mostly in the over 50 age group. <BR>I must say though that when I have been on tours I find the American contingent generally to be very friendly and good mixers. The English, however, did not want to mix with others. <BR>

Larry

<BR>I want to agree with what several people here said; the Aussies are the loudest and rudest tourists of all. I've travelled all over Asia and Europe and never saw people as loud, rude and drunken as those from Oz. I've travelled with many an Aussie and never once have I heard one of them utter a word in any language but English. Over and over I have seen then go up to a ticket seller, clerk or whatever worldwide and immediately blabber on in English saying what they wanted. Never ask if the person speaks English, just assume everyone does. And drinking! They drink everyone under the table. The beer never stops! (these are blokes I'm talking of). They also talk loud, shout across rooms in public at each other and always seem to have a glum face. And I have repeatedly seen them mistaken FOR American's by people of other countries who can't tell the English accents apart. I really think that quite a bit of the anti_American stereotyping is really Australians who people mistake for American's.

C.C.

I'd like to add a few things. <BR> <BR>One: I've been on several cruises and on one, passengers were offered the opportunity to, if they wanted to, go to a clothing optional beach on one of the islands. Later, on deck, I overhead the following conversation. <BR> <BR>First man (with his wife next to him, mind you): I could not believe the hooters on them girls on the beach. <BR> <BR>Second man: I know (laughter), I just couldn't stop staring. <BR> <BR>And the conversation got WORSE from there!! <BR> <BR>Now I am sure that when these guys were on that clothing optional beach, that they DID just stare and stare and probably made rude comments which others on the beach heard. As far as I can tell, it seems to be almost exclusively Americans that simply CAN NOT get over the fact that there are two sexes and yes, they are made differently! Why does nudity always have to be a sexual thing? I was on the sundeck at that time and didn't hear anyone else make comments like those; maybe they did, but it was in the privacy of their cabins. I just cringed when I heard that little conversation. No wonder Americans have a reputation for being hicks. <BR> <BR>Secondly, if you're going to a country where English is not the primary language spoken (say, France or Spain), PLEASE do not just assume that everyone there will know how to speak English, and speak it well--and then, when someone doesn't, go back home and complain to everyone that "the French are so rude" or whatever, because they dared to speak their own language in their own country. At least attempt to learn a few phrases beforehand. <BR> <BR>I'm not saying all Americans are rude or xenophobic, by the way. I'm just saying I think that these are some of the reasons they occasionally get perceived that way.

Raeona

The point made in the preceding post really needs to be made...and made...and made. I "lived" in these SO-helpful Fodor's pages for weeks this spring, prior to our first-ever visit to Paris. And the piece of advice I heard the most turned out to be THE most important. That was: learn the basic words of politneness -- Good day, Please, Thank you. We heeded that advice...and really found it made a difference. What a small investment of effort (whatever the language) to help guarantee a friendly response (most of the time) and a great trip/memory. <BR> <BR>Have so enjoyed reading this page (at least twice now!)

tom

I've read all of these responses and would ask that you please consider these points:1. When you leave America regardless of your weight or how you dress,the cultures will be diffferent...it is not going to be the same...IT IS ONE OF THE REASONS THAT YOU GO! 2.Remember...the bed may not be too short, you may just be too tall!...ACCEPT and ADAPT! 3.Believe it or not, the entire world does not evolve around the good old USA...TRY TO LEARN AND APPRECIATE SOMETHING DIFFERENT, AFTER ALL SOME OF THESE FOLKS HAVE BEEN DOING THIS FOR A LONG TIME! 4.People are people, they want to be treated with respect...SO RESPECT THEM AND THEIR CULTURE 5. Try what you might consider different foods, after all McDonalds will always be there when you get home.6.Don't be so loud. Everybody has an opinion, not everybody shares them to the world. 7. Above all,do try to learn some of the language such as please and thank you. The folks in those countries will be pleased that you tried and your Mom will be proud fo you for using good manners! We have traveled in 17 European countires and I can honestly say that we have never been treated rudely. In fact, many of the nice people have actually gone out of their way to not only tell us but show us how to get some where in their wonderful countires. The Golden Rule really does work!

Maira

Tom, from the previous post, said it perfectly. Every potential traveller should print his response and memorize it before going anywhere....The Golden rule is truly the key....Respect for others is what we lack oftentimes. My parents showed me that at home. The best lesson I ever learned from them.... <BR>

Teri

Time to weigh in, I guess. Just returned from 2 wks. w/17 yr old daughter to France & Venice. I followed the clothes debates in this forum, and stressed about what to pack. Yes, comfortable shoes are paramount but try to blend with the French? I think not! Throughout Provence the girls and young women, and ladies of 40 yrs. or more were wearing shoes from outer space. Or the sixties? Actually, they reminded me of kathurnai (sp?), those platform shoes strapped on by the ancient Greeks when performing the old tragedies - the ones that went with the masks and added HEIGHT. In the streets, at the markets, and in rather good restaurants, we saw them everywhere. These blockbusters were discarded at the beach, however, along with the bathing suit top. Older French women who weren't wearing 2-piece's simply rolled down their suits. Culture shock, indeed. In Venice, there were Italians, French, Germans, Aussies, Brazilians, Brits, Japanese, and Americans. And yes, the loud ones were invariably the Americans. Sure hope I didn't laugh too loudly or react too exuberantly...

Sarah

In today's newspaper I saw an article where it said that 55 percent of American's are overweight or obese. I think that figure is way too low. Reality around here is that it's like 80 percent or more. These fat people wear short shorts, tiny tank tops with no sleeves and tight polyester polo shirts. And that's how they dress when in Europe too. No wonder European's get such a bad impression. One man in France asked me once if American women TRY and gain weight. He thought it must be something American man found desirable as so many American women are obese. <BR>Not only does it look bad but it is very unhealthy. And that does affect other Americans, like it or not. WE have to look in secret disgust at all these fat slobby people all the time. And WE have to pay more for health insurance because of all the extra health costs to the obese (for their diabetes, heart disease etc). It's not politically correct to say so, so people don't say it publically but privately many people are fed up with the obese (no pun intended). <BR>

Jen

If you can't even tolerate certain people in the U.S., I wonder how you even enjoy travel, since it involves taking in different customs, cultures, the way people LOOK, etc. <BR>It's amazing how some personalties even come through on the internet!

Gigi

First of all this is a travel forum. Discussing manner of dress while traveling is one thing. Using it to spew forth nasty comments about fat people (or any other particular body shape or physical characteristic you do not personally find appealing or necessary) reflects less on ones "political correctness" than on the matter of simply being rude.

Iris

are leggings (tights) with long tops "tacky" in germany and france? help! - would sure help the packing problem and if they are appropriate.

Cheryl Z.

<BR>Iris, In all the trips we've taken to Germany and France, have really never seen women, even younger ones, wearing leggings. While it might help with packing, you probably wouldn't be comfortable in most places. You can still pack light with appropriate dresses, skirts or pants.