lilaki

hello fodorites,

i have a very specific question directed at fellow canadians who are also bank of montreal customers.

i have read through several threads about withdrawing cash in paris/europe instead of carrying euros from home.

i called BMO today and they told me that if i withdraw money from a foreign bank machine, i will be charged BMO's exchange rate. i compared BMO's exchange rate against XE.com and found that BMO's is about 5-7% higher than the 'real' rate.

if what the rep is telling me is true, then it doesn't seem like there would be any financial advantage in waiting until i got to paris to make any cash withdrawals from local ATMs.

can anyone help me suss this one out? i'm not sure if i spoke with a misinformed agent.

thanks!!

adrienne

The currency exchange web sites are usually showing the inter bank rate which is not the rate that private people get so you will be withdrawing money at a higher rate than you see on xe.com. Did you ask BOM if they have an affiliate in France?

Try getting an account at another bank that does not charge as high a commission.

WillTravel

I really don't think the clerk told you correctly. I have not used BoM, but have researched most major Canadian banks. From what I can tell, BoM does this:

For most ATMs in Europe, for each transaction:
$3 fee (may have changed by now) for each transaction
exchange rate is the interbank rate (similar to the xe.com rate) + 2.5%

The rate that Bank of Montreal charges you to buy Euros at your local branch is not their general exchange rate.

lilaki

hi adrienne,

BMO does NOT have an affiliate in europe.

hi willtravel,

BMO charges $5 per withdrawal outside of Canada/US. do you know how i can verify the interbank rate + 2.5%??

i called a second time tonight and i got a totally different response from the agent ... he advised me that overseas ATM rates are always higher than BMO branch rates. which does not make any sense to me. so i guess i'll have to call again tomorrow and see if i get another answer!

wondering if anyone out there has used their BMO ATM card overseas and can share their experiences re: exchange charges??

thanks!!

Apres_Londee

I'm not with bank of montreal, but this is interesting because my ex did and when we went to paris a few years ago I remember his bank was trying to disuade him from using his bank card for atm withdrawls, and tried to convince him to buy travellers cheques instead.

I'm with CBIC and they've never brought this sort of thing up with me. Must be a BMO thing.

CIBC charges $5 a withdrawl as well. With Canadian banks you can't around it. They aren't regulated anywhere near to the extent that they are in Europe, where the government tells them not to charge fees and gouge customers.

But at the same time, they still get to enjoy the benefits of protection against a truly competative market, so there is no incentive for them to offer better deals or lower rates to their customers like American banks often do.

Bottom line is, as a Canadian you will get hit whatever way you slice it. Banks (and telecommunications companies too, for that matter) can have their cake and eat it too in this country.

What I've done is exchange maybe $100 worth of cash before the trip to have on hand just in case. Then I'll make withdrawls of maybe €400 at a time. Don't make too many little withdrawls because you get that $5 charge no matter the amount you're taking. But don't take out so much money at one time that you would be in real trouble if your wallet got lost or stolen.

I just figure the bank fees are part of the cost of travel and try not to stress too much about it. Just look to make sure the bank machine has a Plus or Cirus symbol, whichever BMO is on (CIBC is on the Plus system, and I haven't had any trouble finding a compatible machine in Paris or other places)

Michel_Paris

I'm with CIBC and have used my card all over Europe. Even with fees, it is cheaper and more convenient to use an ATM machine to get your cash while travelling.

You may/may not want to get a few euros before going, to get you from the airport to your accomodations, but I would never buy all of my euros at home before going. Not financially a good idea.

knickerbocker

lilaki,

There are going to be disadvantages to any method of arranging cash. I'm in Apres_Londee's court in that a fiver is part of the cost of travel and as long as you're not doing it repeatedly for small withdrawals, it isn't really that big a deal. I preferred the convenience of being able to get cash easily and was prepared to pay for that convenience. The other thing I did was put everything I could on plastic to get the advantage of putting-off payment until we got back

cdly

Scotiabank doesn't charge any access fee when using their global alliance ATMs including BNP Parisbas, Deutsche Bank, Barclays, etc.

I accessed through BNP and Deutche Bank many times in the past.

cdly

Sarvowinner

Any reason you can't set up a ScotiaBank account just for travelling - as the previous poster says - it saves you the $5.00 fee if you use Barclays, Deutsche and BNP Paribas in Europe. As well as Bank of America, Westpac (Australia)and possible ABSA in South Africa - although this may be just for Westpac customers.

bozama

Just a note to misinformed.. it is easy enough to not pay a foriegn withdrawal fee with your ATM card, on a Canadian bank..

I pay no fee. I have both a Toronto Dominion and a Royal Bank account, and I pay no fees for foriegn withdrawel for either. They must have a maintained balance of $5,000. in them for this, otherwise the fee is 24.95 a month service charge plus the 5 dollar withdrawal fee.
I keep the balances maintained.
I have used both cards overseas for years now, and I pay no transaction fee.
Talk to your banker( not tellers, they are not always aware of all the benefits with all the accounts) and see if your bank has a similar set up( bet they do), you could then close account after you return if you don't want to keep that account open.

lilaki

hi all,

thanks for all the responses and information.

i don't have a problem with the $5 withdrawal fee ... that's just a cost of doing business. i don't think we'll be withdrawing all that much -- maybe 4 times over the course of 2.5 weeks.

however, i am trying to figure out what the exchange charges will be ...

my first call to BMO had me believe that there was NO advantage to withdrawing money overseas vs. at home at a branch (the exchange rates are the same). this is contrary to what i've read on the forums here so i called them back a few hours later.

my second call had me believe that the exchange rate charged on cash withdrawn overseas is actually HIGHER than what i would pay at a branch. again, this is contrary to what has been posted on fodors.

so, i'm planning to make a third call today and see if i can get to the bottom of this!!!

and if you're wondering why i'm trying to figure this all out ... we have to pay the apartment owner 800 euros when we arrive. and then we also need to pay the gite owners in cash a week later. so, the exchange rate difference could add up to a nice meal!

thanks again...

Micheline

That's very interesting Bozama. I just printed your post and will be taking it to my TD bank. I'm leaving in 1 1/2 weeks for France and will also have to make a lot of cash payments.

tropicalkerry

well, and i'll say this very quietly...
when we went to Europe last year, the VERY nice man we dealt with at TD bumped us up to the service package that included the fee for withdrawals in Europe, for the month we were there, and waived the monthly service charge.
We have been good customers for 25 years, and that was the first perk we ever got, but it was a lovely one!
maybe you desrve it too!

robjame

I have researched this extensively as well. I empathize with you as the information changes depending whom you speak to.

As tropical says, it is easy to get the ATM charge waived. A conversation with your account manager (who has probably also changed 5 times over the past year) will do that.

The exchange rate (2.5%) seems to be universal and even Capital One who have a beneficial rate in the States are the same with their Canadian customers.

The 2.5% rate is constant (don't know if it is possibly pegged under a consumer protection thingy) whether you get the money (Euros) from the bank before you leave, whether you withdraw it from an ATM in Europe (forgetting about the ATM fee) or whether you use Visa or Master Card or AmEx. This is different than the States.

The only way around it seems to be buying Travellers Cheques where AmEx will back off one point but <b>this is not recommended </b> due to the difficulty cashing them. The exception would be if you had a huge amount you wanted to transfer and it was worth your time to go to a AmEx depot.

Some have suggested a money exchange (not the little kiosk at the airport) but I know nothing about that.

Canada - Grin and bare it.

robjame

A couple of othe3r thoughts:

Change to RBC to an account which
(1) waives the fees,
(2) gives you a free EEE laptop computer which is perfect size for travelling
(3)gives you a (Avion) Visa with cashback or travel rewards including travel benefits and insurances.

bozama

Micheline, I believe my account at the TD is called a &quot; Select Service&quot; and the one at the Royal is a &quot;VIP&quot; account.
You must get the brochures, at the Royal, a few years ago when I first had this account, I asked the teller about the no fee foriegn withdrawal with my account, she looked confused and &quot;wasn't sure about it&quot; ,, I showed her on the paperwork I had from when I opened my account that outlined all the fees and privilges,, she had to call her manager over to confirm it as she'd &quot; never really heard about it&quot;????

Like most of us, it seems you have to ask serveral times to get a consensus from banks( how dumb are they?) LOL about what they have or don't have, or what they do or don't do..

Micheline

I did ask about something like that before but the clerk knew nothing about it. I made an appointment with one of the managers for early next week so I'll let you know.

robjame

Micheline - the only way I was able to cut through the BS was to ask for written verification of what they were telling me.

lilaki

hello again,

i decided to email BMO and ask them whether the exchange rate at foreign ATMs. this is what they came back with:

&quot;...I can confirm that when you make a withdrawal at an Automated Banking Machine outside of Canada, the exchange that is charged is the BMO Bank of Montreal rate that is posted at the time of withdrawal.&quot;

so, from that statement, it doesn't sound like there is any exchange-rate-advantage between withdrawing at home or overseas.

interestingly, the online rep also stated that overseas withdrawals cost $3 ... not $5 that i was quoted over the phone. good thing i have this in writing so i can go back to them later on if they charge me $5.

looks like we'll be making our withdrawal at home to pay for our apartment in paris and then withdrawing as necessary during our trip.

thanks all for your help.

Christina

It sounds like that is true for you. In the US, I would not accept those statements as complete knowledge, because my bank charges 3 pct over the interbank rate, but they don't call that what the &quot;exchange rate&quot; is. It's an extra fee labelled as a foreign transaction fee charge. So right on my statements, there would be that foreign transaction fee as a percentage of the withdrawal, but it wouldn't be labelled as part of the &quot;exchange rate&quot;.

I wouldn't ever just ask about exchange rates, but ask if there are any other kinds of fees whatsoever, like a percentage charge, etc. I think someone above said it was 2.5% at your bank, plus the $3 ATM fee. That's about like my bank in the US, only they have $0 ATM fee (but a 3 pct other fee). Luckily, it isn't what my bank charges if you got foreign currency at the bank, as that is about 7 pct.