Pounds or Euros in Ireland
Mar 27th, 2008, 03:06 AM
#42
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 288
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Is a Brit always English and vice-versa?"
No, why would that be the case? English people are all British but not all British people are English. It's just like the 'oranges are fruit but not all fruits are oranges' example.
What the Northern Irish call themselves largely depends on political views. Some use Irish (myself included), some use British, some use Northern Irish.
I think it sounds really stupid when people use Eire in English. It's an Irish word. It would be like calling England Angleterre while speaking English.
No, why would that be the case? English people are all British but not all British people are English. It's just like the 'oranges are fruit but not all fruits are oranges' example.
What the Northern Irish call themselves largely depends on political views. Some use Irish (myself included), some use British, some use Northern Irish.
I think it sounds really stupid when people use Eire in English. It's an Irish word. It would be like calling England Angleterre while speaking English.
Mar 27th, 2008, 03:06 AM
#43
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 339
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The whole thinig is confusing because there is a cross over between geogrpahic and political terms.
The 'British Isles' are a group of islands of the coast of Europe, in Britain* this name is mainly apolitical but some Irish take umbridge as they they see the name as implying British ownership of teh whole thing. Until someone comes up with a better name (which IONA sin't) I don't see this term going away anytime soon.
The smaller island is called Ireland.
The largest country on that island is oficially called 'Ireland' in English, this obviously causes some confusion (not entirely unintentional) as to what exactly you mean when you say 'Ireland.' The Irish govt. recongnises this and 'The Republic of Ireland' has some kind of semi-official status as the name to stop confusion, I'm sure someone else will come along with the exact verbage.
The other county in the British isles is called the 'United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland' and is made up of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland (NI).
Northern Ireland is on the island of Ireland.
The big island is called 'Great Britain' and England, Scotland and Wales are on this island.
So therefore England, Scotland and Wales are 'on' Great Britain but NI isn't.
To add to the confusion 'United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland' is a bit of a mouthfull so it is commonly shortened to 'The United Kingdom' or 'UK' and its citizens are called 'British'. So NI isn't in Great Britain but the people are British.
Simple? But we mustn't forget that the UK has only been popular as a short form for 30 odd years and before that the common short form was... 'Great Britain', so by <i>that</i> useage NI <i>is</i> part of Great Britain even though it isn't <i>on</i> Great Britain.
*What do people mean why they say 'Britain' - the island or the county? IME it entirely depends on context.
The 'British Isles' are a group of islands of the coast of Europe, in Britain* this name is mainly apolitical but some Irish take umbridge as they they see the name as implying British ownership of teh whole thing. Until someone comes up with a better name (which IONA sin't) I don't see this term going away anytime soon.
The smaller island is called Ireland.
The largest country on that island is oficially called 'Ireland' in English, this obviously causes some confusion (not entirely unintentional) as to what exactly you mean when you say 'Ireland.' The Irish govt. recongnises this and 'The Republic of Ireland' has some kind of semi-official status as the name to stop confusion, I'm sure someone else will come along with the exact verbage.
The other county in the British isles is called the 'United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland' and is made up of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland (NI).
Northern Ireland is on the island of Ireland.
The big island is called 'Great Britain' and England, Scotland and Wales are on this island.
So therefore England, Scotland and Wales are 'on' Great Britain but NI isn't.
To add to the confusion 'United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland' is a bit of a mouthfull so it is commonly shortened to 'The United Kingdom' or 'UK' and its citizens are called 'British'. So NI isn't in Great Britain but the people are British.
Simple? But we mustn't forget that the UK has only been popular as a short form for 30 odd years and before that the common short form was... 'Great Britain', so by <i>that</i> useage NI <i>is</i> part of Great Britain even though it isn't <i>on</i> Great Britain.
*What do people mean why they say 'Britain' - the island or the county? IME it entirely depends on context.
Mar 27th, 2008, 03:26 AM
#44
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,126
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
schuler,
Yes I suspect someone calling themselves a "Brit" would feel themselves to have a stronger tribal connection to England than to Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland. A native of the aforesaid would probably call themselves Welsh, Scots or Irish. But they still are legally "British" and if they have a passport it would be a British passport.
I find this problematic myself. I always say when asked, that I am British. I can't say that I am English, Welsh or Scots because I have no tribal loyalty to any of them although my recent antecedents came from all three.
I think it's about self categorisation. If you are brought up in Wales with one parent who is Welsh and one parent who is English, you can chose English, Welsh or British. If you are brought up all over the world with one parent who is English and one who is Scottish you go through life as British.
I expect this is confusing to American readers. But that's the way it is. There is a political entity called the "United Kingdom" (of Great Britain and Northern Ireland) comprising the geographical entities of England Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.
And it works well for us, even if it is grey and woolly. No written constitution as travelingtish will of course know.
And I have to tell you that I love the fact that we can operate that way.
It's subtle. And the result of our history. And the sign of a mature democracy.
If the OP doesn't know the difference between Eire and the UK,
then he/she isn't the first.
What do they teach over there is the US? Have to assume that the weird and wonderful ways of the UK are not on the schedule, despite the, "special relationship" (haha).
Yes I suspect someone calling themselves a "Brit" would feel themselves to have a stronger tribal connection to England than to Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland. A native of the aforesaid would probably call themselves Welsh, Scots or Irish. But they still are legally "British" and if they have a passport it would be a British passport.
I find this problematic myself. I always say when asked, that I am British. I can't say that I am English, Welsh or Scots because I have no tribal loyalty to any of them although my recent antecedents came from all three.
I think it's about self categorisation. If you are brought up in Wales with one parent who is Welsh and one parent who is English, you can chose English, Welsh or British. If you are brought up all over the world with one parent who is English and one who is Scottish you go through life as British.
I expect this is confusing to American readers. But that's the way it is. There is a political entity called the "United Kingdom" (of Great Britain and Northern Ireland) comprising the geographical entities of England Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.
And it works well for us, even if it is grey and woolly. No written constitution as travelingtish will of course know.
And I have to tell you that I love the fact that we can operate that way.
It's subtle. And the result of our history. And the sign of a mature democracy.
If the OP doesn't know the difference between Eire and the UK,
then he/she isn't the first.
What do they teach over there is the US? Have to assume that the weird and wonderful ways of the UK are not on the schedule, despite the, "special relationship" (haha).
Mar 27th, 2008, 03:34 AM
#46
>What do they teach over there is the US? Have to assume that the weird and wonderful ways of the UK are not on the schedule, despite the, "special relationship" (haha).
<
The first time I saw the word "wales" I thought it was a misspelling of whales. Took a while to figure it out (which, as you can see, I'm still trying to.)
<
The first time I saw the word "wales" I thought it was a misspelling of whales. Took a while to figure it out (which, as you can see, I'm still trying to.)
Mar 27th, 2008, 03:42 AM
#48
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,254
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Some friends recently said that the Good Friday agreement in Northern Ireland only started to work after 9/11.
That was when the Americans realised what terrorism was all about, and stopped giving support to the IRA. It was American money that had kept the armed struggle going. Once the Provisional IRA leadership were denied visas to attend St Patrick's Day parades in Boston and elsewhere, progress could only be made by peaceful means.
I think there are other reasons why the current peace process has been successful, but I would be interested to hear other people's views.
That was when the Americans realised what terrorism was all about, and stopped giving support to the IRA. It was American money that had kept the armed struggle going. Once the Provisional IRA leadership were denied visas to attend St Patrick's Day parades in Boston and elsewhere, progress could only be made by peaceful means.
I think there are other reasons why the current peace process has been successful, but I would be interested to hear other people's views.
Mar 27th, 2008, 03:54 AM
#49
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 530
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
>>What do the Northern Irish call themselves? Irish? Northern Irish?>>
I would call myself northern irish, along with pretty much everyone I know (equally catholic as protestant).
For me it isn't a political statement, more of a cultural one, to say northern irish, as any irish or n.irish person here knows, they are 2 pretty distinguishable countries.
when abroad, i stick with irish, it's more geographically correct than connotations that go with being british.
And I don't like being called English
P.S I have met several English people who didn't know that ireland wasn't part of britain.
Mar 27th, 2008, 04:06 AM
#52
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,271
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
About three years ago, I took a coach tour of Ireland...it included a dip into Northern Ireland and although we didn't stay overnight, we did stop in Derry (as the Irish say) or Londonderry (as the Brits say)...throughout the tour, the TD referred to the North as the part of Ireland controlled by the English..not with malice mind you but as a matter of fact.
My first visit to Ireland, in1975, British currency and Irish currency were almost at parity and English and Irish coins were sort of interchangeable (they were the same size and nobody cared...of course if you, in the UK, used an Irish coin it would immediately cause a shreik of pain from the shopkeeper(much as Canadiuan coins do the same in the USA despite the fact the two currencies are nearly at par but US coins do circulate freely in Canada)...
Sometime in the late 70's, the Irish punt was introduced, a separate currency from the British pound which continued to the introduction of the euro in 2002 when Ireland chose to divorce its economy completely from the British economy and decided to join the euro.
My first visit to Ireland, in1975, British currency and Irish currency were almost at parity and English and Irish coins were sort of interchangeable (they were the same size and nobody cared...of course if you, in the UK, used an Irish coin it would immediately cause a shreik of pain from the shopkeeper(much as Canadiuan coins do the same in the USA despite the fact the two currencies are nearly at par but US coins do circulate freely in Canada)...
Sometime in the late 70's, the Irish punt was introduced, a separate currency from the British pound which continued to the introduction of the euro in 2002 when Ireland chose to divorce its economy completely from the British economy and decided to join the euro.
Mar 27th, 2008, 04:27 AM
#55
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,585
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
...and don't forget that Republic of Ireland citizens have always been entitled to vote in UK elections.
I can remember a notice going up sometime (I can't remember exactly when) in buses that Irish money was no longer acceptable.
I can remember a notice going up sometime (I can't remember exactly when) in buses that Irish money was no longer acceptable.
Mar 27th, 2008, 04:29 AM
#56
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,433
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yes, I think Irish pubs outside Ireland are not like Irish pubs in Ireland. In some cases the only way they seem distinct from the local bars is in the name and in having a Guinness tap. But often, the staff do not even know how to draw a pint of the black stuff. I don't drink Guinness, but in one place in France it was so badly dispensed that I stepped in behind the bar and showed the barman how it should be done. That meant that the French people who dragged me in could get a proper pint.
In general, I am not interested in seeking out English-speaking tourists. I often like to encounter English-speaking locals: they can explain a place better for me. I'm not greatly concerned about whether castle X or castle Y is the better visit; I'm more interested in what everyday life can be like.
In general, I am not interested in seeking out English-speaking tourists. I often like to encounter English-speaking locals: they can explain a place better for me. I'm not greatly concerned about whether castle X or castle Y is the better visit; I'm more interested in what everyday life can be like.
Mar 27th, 2008, 04:46 AM
#57
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,271
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This comes up from time to time BTW...
Bank notes in the UK are issued by various banks...and the bank notes issued in Northern Ireland, denominated in pounds sterling, are different than those issued by the Bank of England and various Scottish banks....
In theory, they should all be acceptable throughout the UK (not the Republic of Ireland)...try spending a Northern irish £5 banknote in London sometime.
Bank notes in the UK are issued by various banks...and the bank notes issued in Northern Ireland, denominated in pounds sterling, are different than those issued by the Bank of England and various Scottish banks....
In theory, they should all be acceptable throughout the UK (not the Republic of Ireland)...try spending a Northern irish £5 banknote in London sometime.
Mar 27th, 2008, 04:52 AM
#58
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 760
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There are so many of these little, inconsequential countries in the world that it's difficult to keep them all straight.
Just joking--please don't key my car or TP my house!
By the way, my friends here in the USA (America) are aware that Ireland is a separate country and that Northern Ireland is not a part of that separate country. I imagine it just depends on your particular group of friends.
Just joking--please don't key my car or TP my house!
By the way, my friends here in the USA (America) are aware that Ireland is a separate country and that Northern Ireland is not a part of that separate country. I imagine it just depends on your particular group of friends.
Mar 27th, 2008, 04:55 AM
#59
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 4,433
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Northern Irish and Scottish banknotes are not legal tender even in the countries where they are issued. Their use is sanctioned by custom, not by law.
I live near the border with NI. If I went into a bank here and asked for sterling, there is every likelihood that they would give me NI banknotes on the assumption that I wanted money to use in NI. Correctly speaking, it is not sterling.
If I planned to shop in NI, I wouldn't bother to change money, as Irish money is widely accepted and shops generally (not universally, though) give a good exchange rate in order to attract business.
I live near the border with NI. If I went into a bank here and asked for sterling, there is every likelihood that they would give me NI banknotes on the assumption that I wanted money to use in NI. Correctly speaking, it is not sterling.
If I planned to shop in NI, I wouldn't bother to change money, as Irish money is widely accepted and shops generally (not universally, though) give a good exchange rate in order to attract business.
Mar 27th, 2008, 05:02 AM
#60
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 12,582
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
the Irish only really had their own currency for quite a short time.
From the founding of the republic until the mid 70s it was tied to the pound and as such was in effect british currency. They broke that link and had their own money - the punt - and then they joined the Euro.
And just to confuse things further.....
The British team in the olympics is "Great Britain" and includes N Irish people.
The Irish rugby team is the whole of the island.
And BTW the actual financial input of Americans into the IRA wasn't that great. The IRA got money from Libya, bank robbery, drug dealing and protection rackets mainly.
it was more the political influence that mattered.
From the founding of the republic until the mid 70s it was tied to the pound and as such was in effect british currency. They broke that link and had their own money - the punt - and then they joined the Euro.
And just to confuse things further.....
The British team in the olympics is "Great Britain" and includes N Irish people.
The Irish rugby team is the whole of the island.
And BTW the actual financial input of Americans into the IRA wasn't that great. The IRA got money from Libya, bank robbery, drug dealing and protection rackets mainly.
it was more the political influence that mattered.
