Pope - what closes if he dies
Mar 31st, 2005, 02:48 PM
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Pope - what closes if he dies
I don't want to be disrespectful, but we'll be in Rome in a week. What closes down if the Pope dies? I understand that the Vatican Museums and Sistine Chapel will close - but what about other museums, churches and historic sites? How crowded will it be around town, in restaurants, etc?
Mar 31st, 2005, 03:03 PM
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halfpint you took the words right out of my mouth. If you are in Rome during the time the Pope passes on you will be witnessing history first hand.
Though a sad time it will be memorable.
I was in Paris during 9/11 and had many worries like when am I going to beable to fly back home, extra days at the hotel, etc. I was able to see just how wonderful the French can be. They were so sympathetic to all Americans. Went out of they way to help us. That is something I will never forget.
Regardless of what happens you will have a wonderful trip.
Though a sad time it will be memorable.
I was in Paris during 9/11 and had many worries like when am I going to beable to fly back home, extra days at the hotel, etc. I was able to see just how wonderful the French can be. They were so sympathetic to all Americans. Went out of they way to help us. That is something I will never forget.
Regardless of what happens you will have a wonderful trip.
Mar 31st, 2005, 03:14 PM
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You might want to keep an eye on this link:
http://www.whatsoninrome.com/strikes.php
it will tell you about upcoming closures and strikes and processions causing closures and unexpected inconveliences in Rome
http://www.whatsoninrome.com/strikes.php
it will tell you about upcoming closures and strikes and processions causing closures and unexpected inconveliences in Rome
Mar 31st, 2005, 03:18 PM
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We are traveling in May to Rome and are worried too that it might not be good timing. It's one thing to say to experience history but I would anticipate there to be additional mob scenes, delays, etc. We've saved a long time for this vacation.....
Mar 31st, 2005, 03:27 PM
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I am just copying this useful information from the other Pope thread becasue I believe that thread will be deleted by Fodors due to some postings by immature, disrespectable people.
Author: Tiggy22
Date: 03/31/2005, 06:21 pm
I don't think that Rome will necessarily be in turmoil. The Vatican (as a country unto itself will be closed - businesses closed in proper mourning), however the government offices, etc of Rome and cities throughout Italy shall continue on - perhaps with shops and restaurants closing on the day of the Pope's official funeral mass. The Vatican Museums and Sistine Chapel will be closed for days during the mourning and conclave. In addition I believe the Scavi will be closed for a short time. St Peters will be having the special services.
Should the Pope pass on, things should happen closely to this scenario (Note that there is a traditional 9 days of mourning after the Pope's death):
15 - 20 days after the death of the Pope, the Sacred College of Cardinals meets for the election. There are currently 123 voting cardinals.
After a Mass of the Holy Spirit in St. Peter's Basilica, the cardinals enter a guarded annex of the Sistine Chapel for the election process, known as a conclave. Each cardinal swears an oath to protect the secrecy of the election. Breaking the oath carries a penalty of immediate excommunication. Literally locked within the walls of the annex, which is screened for bugging devices, the cardinals are sequestered from any contact with the outside world. Entrances are sealed and curtains closed.
The next morning, the cardinals attend mass in the Sistine Chapel and the electoral session begins. According to the reforms of Pope Paul VI, only cardinals under the age of 80 may vote. While for centuries only cardinals have been elected pope, in theory, any adult male Roman Catholic is papabile, or a potential candidate for the papacy.
The election is conducted in secret written ballots counted by the Camerlengo and his three assistants. In the past, a pope needed two thirds of the vote plus one to be elected. In 1996, however, Pope John Paul II changed this rule so that if the votes continue to be unsuccessful for 12 or 13 days, the cardinals may agree by absolute majority (half plus one) to elect
Two ballots are taken each morning and two each afternoon until a successful vote is completed. After each voting session, ballots are burned. If the vote is inconclusive, a chemical substance is added to the paper to produce black smoke. Billowing from the roof of the Vatican Palace, the smoke is a message to the crowds watching in St. Peter's Square that the church is still without a pope.
When the college eventually reaches the final decision, each cardinal lowers a purple canopy over his chair, leaving the elected Pope's canopy folded. The final ballots are burned and their white smoke signals a successful election. The dean of the cardinals asks if the chosen member accepts the papacy. Upon accepting, the new pontiff is made bishop of Rome and is honored by each of the cardinals.
The dean then steps out onto the balcony of the Vatican, shouting "Habemus papam!" ("We have a Pope!") The new pontiff then appears to greet and bless the waiting audience.
Author: Tiggy22
Date: 03/31/2005, 06:21 pm
I don't think that Rome will necessarily be in turmoil. The Vatican (as a country unto itself will be closed - businesses closed in proper mourning), however the government offices, etc of Rome and cities throughout Italy shall continue on - perhaps with shops and restaurants closing on the day of the Pope's official funeral mass. The Vatican Museums and Sistine Chapel will be closed for days during the mourning and conclave. In addition I believe the Scavi will be closed for a short time. St Peters will be having the special services.
Should the Pope pass on, things should happen closely to this scenario (Note that there is a traditional 9 days of mourning after the Pope's death):
15 - 20 days after the death of the Pope, the Sacred College of Cardinals meets for the election. There are currently 123 voting cardinals.
After a Mass of the Holy Spirit in St. Peter's Basilica, the cardinals enter a guarded annex of the Sistine Chapel for the election process, known as a conclave. Each cardinal swears an oath to protect the secrecy of the election. Breaking the oath carries a penalty of immediate excommunication. Literally locked within the walls of the annex, which is screened for bugging devices, the cardinals are sequestered from any contact with the outside world. Entrances are sealed and curtains closed.
The next morning, the cardinals attend mass in the Sistine Chapel and the electoral session begins. According to the reforms of Pope Paul VI, only cardinals under the age of 80 may vote. While for centuries only cardinals have been elected pope, in theory, any adult male Roman Catholic is papabile, or a potential candidate for the papacy.
The election is conducted in secret written ballots counted by the Camerlengo and his three assistants. In the past, a pope needed two thirds of the vote plus one to be elected. In 1996, however, Pope John Paul II changed this rule so that if the votes continue to be unsuccessful for 12 or 13 days, the cardinals may agree by absolute majority (half plus one) to elect
Two ballots are taken each morning and two each afternoon until a successful vote is completed. After each voting session, ballots are burned. If the vote is inconclusive, a chemical substance is added to the paper to produce black smoke. Billowing from the roof of the Vatican Palace, the smoke is a message to the crowds watching in St. Peter's Square that the church is still without a pope.
When the college eventually reaches the final decision, each cardinal lowers a purple canopy over his chair, leaving the elected Pope's canopy folded. The final ballots are burned and their white smoke signals a successful election. The dean of the cardinals asks if the chosen member accepts the papacy. Upon accepting, the new pontiff is made bishop of Rome and is honored by each of the cardinals.
The dean then steps out onto the balcony of the Vatican, shouting "Habemus papam!" ("We have a Pope!") The new pontiff then appears to greet and bless the waiting audience.
Mar 31st, 2005, 04:03 PM
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Hey Motor City Girl, I think he meant someone in another thread, not you. 
Now about your train question - trains will still be running - don't expect any stoppages unless there are strikes. However there may be delays if there are lots of pilgrims entering into the city to pay their respects during periods of mourning or conclave.
Take a look at that link I provided above and it will give you the latest details.
I hope that helps.
Now about your train question - trains will still be running - don't expect any stoppages unless there are strikes. However there may be delays if there are lots of pilgrims entering into the city to pay their respects during periods of mourning or conclave.
Take a look at that link I provided above and it will give you the latest details.
I hope that helps.
Mar 31st, 2005, 04:30 PM
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Motor_City_Girl
I don't think anyone is taking your post as disrepectful - Life does go on and you are merely trying to find out how to make the most of your vacation by not trying to access areas that might be closed.
I'm not at all religious but I agree that the 'troll/idiot' on the other post is being very disrespectful and hateful.
In the early 90's while on a day off on a business trip my DH stumbled across a Mass in St Peter's Sq. Being a good Catholic son he called his Mother in the UK, on his cell phone and let her listen.
Good luck with your trip.
I don't think anyone is taking your post as disrepectful - Life does go on and you are merely trying to find out how to make the most of your vacation by not trying to access areas that might be closed.
I'm not at all religious but I agree that the 'troll/idiot' on the other post is being very disrespectful and hateful.
In the early 90's while on a day off on a business trip my DH stumbled across a Mass in St Peter's Sq. Being a good Catholic son he called his Mother in the UK, on his cell phone and let her listen.
Good luck with your trip.
Apr 1st, 2005, 03:39 AM
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Again, not trying to be one who appears disrespectful, and just seeking clarification as the Vatican tour is the main reason for our trip to Rome this May, could someone please advise as to the likely maximum number of days that the Vatican and Cistine Chapel would be unavailable for tours in the event that the Pope does die in the near future.
Apr 1st, 2005, 05:20 AM
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nevertooold, even if you miss out on the vatican museum, just think, you might witness the white smoke and the elevation of a new pope! i will be there too, and i believe that being amidst such historical significance will outweigh the disruptions and inconvenience.
Apr 1st, 2005, 05:22 AM
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Nevertooold, at this point I think it is too early to tell whether the Sistine Chapel will be open in May.
I'm certainly not an expert on this...just taking the info that Tiggy22 gave (in yoony's post above).
For the sake of discussion, if the Pope were to die today (which may not happen), April 1, the conclave would presumably begin around April 15-20. At that point, there's no telling how long it will take to elect a new pope (by some report I heard today, there's no real frontrunner).
I'm certainly not an expert on this...just taking the info that Tiggy22 gave (in yoony's post above).
For the sake of discussion, if the Pope were to die today (which may not happen), April 1, the conclave would presumably begin around April 15-20. At that point, there's no telling how long it will take to elect a new pope (by some report I heard today, there's no real frontrunner).
Apr 1st, 2005, 06:37 AM
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Motor_City_Girl - I'm sorry if I wasn't too clear in my previous posting. "The other Pope thread" is not the one you started, it was another thread that is now officially deleted, thankfully.
Report back on your visit to Rome.
Report back on your visit to Rome.
Apr 2nd, 2005, 08:38 AM
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The Vatican will close down all buildings to the public except St Peter's basilica, when the Pope expires. The mourning takes place within the basilica between the time he dies until around the time the cnclave start. The body will be displayed in St Peters for all people to pay respects for a few days. The lines to get in will be beyond tremendous.
A good guess on the time the Sistine Chapel and likely the Vatican Museum will be closed is about a month.
This may change but is a good guess. If conclave is short the time may be shorter and if the cardinals can't decide then it may go on longer than 1 month. Who knows?
Rome will be overun the first few days to a week after the Pope dies. Hundreds of thousands of pilgrims and news media will decend on the city to witness the event and pay respects.
A good guess on the time the Sistine Chapel and likely the Vatican Museum will be closed is about a month.
This may change but is a good guess. If conclave is short the time may be shorter and if the cardinals can't decide then it may go on longer than 1 month. Who knows?
Rome will be overun the first few days to a week after the Pope dies. Hundreds of thousands of pilgrims and news media will decend on the city to witness the event and pay respects.
Apr 6th, 2005, 07:39 AM
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For those who will be in Rome in the immediate future, I read the following:
As of 5 April, 2005 the Vatican Museums have indicated that while they will be open and offering tours during the Conclave, the Sistine Chapel will be closed from April 7 until further notice. The Vatican Museums will be closed Friday, April 8, for the Papal Funeral. This general information will be updated as it becomes available to us.
As of 5 April, 2005 the Vatican Museums have indicated that while they will be open and offering tours during the Conclave, the Sistine Chapel will be closed from April 7 until further notice. The Vatican Museums will be closed Friday, April 8, for the Papal Funeral. This general information will be updated as it becomes available to us.
