I've noticed such great help with the comments given to iteneraries, that I thought I'd put mine up. As this is our (I'm going with my boyfriend) first time in Europe, we're not sure what sort of sights take long and which ones don't. <BR> <BR>Comments will be much appreciated. Here goes.. <BR> <BR>Paris (2.5 days) <BR>0.5 Day - Arc De triumph, Eiffel Tower, Notre Dame <BR>Day 2 - Louvre, Latin Quarter, Orsay Museum <BR>Day 3 - Versailles <BR> <BR>Bruge (1 day - one the way from Paris to Amsterdam, not staying the night) <BR>Basilica of the holy blood, groenich museum, chocolate shops, windmills <BR> <BR>Amsterday (2 days) <BR>Day 1 - Ann Frank House, Rijks Museum <BR>Day 2 - Marijuana Museum, Van Gogh Museum <BR> <BR>Cologne (1 day) <BR>DOM Cathedral, museums, bridge, chocolate museum <BR> <BR>Rhine Cruise (1 day) <BR>Depart from Cologne early morning, taking train to Koblenz and then cruising down to Bacharac. Spending night at Bacharac. <BR> <BR>Berlin (3 days) <BR>Day 1 - Museumsinsel, Potsdamer Platz <BR>Day 2 - Kulturforum, national gallery, german historical museum <BR>Day 3 - Gemaldegalerie (1/2 day) <BR> <BR>Prague (3 days) <BR>Day 1 - Churches/Museums Hradcany, Staramesto <BR>Day 2 - Prague Castle and surroundings <BR>Day 3 - Wolenstein Palace (malastrana) <BR>Possibility of Going to a crystal factory and Mucha <BR> <BR>Vienna (2 days) <BR>Day 1 - Schloss Schonbrunn, Kurshistoriches museum <BR>Day 2 - Ringstrasse tour (bus tour from Rick Steve's book) St.Stephens Cathedral, Coffee houses and wind houses on kartner strasse <BR>Hoffberg Palace <BR>Possible mozart concert at night <BR> <BR>Salzburg (2 days) <BR>Day 1 - Day trip to Halstatt <BR>Day 2 - Festung Hohensalsburg (fortress), mozart walking tour <BR> <BR>Munich (3 days) <BR>Day 1- Deutch Museum and general city sights <BR>Day 2 - Neucweinstien and other castles (not sure of spelling) <BR>Day 3 - Dachau <BR> <BR>Zurich (0.5 days) <BR>Quick sightsee while changing trains from munich-lucerne <BR>Courtyards, Fountains, Barnhoff Strass, Lindt&sprugi Chocolate factories <BR> <BR>Lucerne (1 day) <BR>Glacier grande, kapelbruck and spreuerbruck bridges, scenic cuirse on lake lucerne and possibly going via cog railways to have dinner on the moutnains. <BR> <BR>Lauterbrunnen (3 days) <BR>Day 1 - Jungfrau <BR>Day 2 - Schilthorn <BR>Day 3 - Boat trip on either lake thun or brienz. Trummmelbach falls <BR> <BR>Montreaux (1 day) <BR>Chateau de Chillon <BR> <BR>Venice (3 days) <BR>Day 1 - Grand Canal Tour (from rick steve), St. Marks Square, glassblowing, St. Mark's bascilica. <BR>Day 2 - Doge's Palace, Galleria dell' Academia. Possible Vivaldi concert at night. <BR>Day 3 - Peggy guggenheim collection, Cheisa dei Frani <BR> <BR>Florence (4 days) <BR>Day 1 - Renaissance Walk (from Rich steve's book), Baptistry, Bargello <BR>day 2 - Uffize <BR>Day 3 - Pitti Palace <BR>Day 4 - Science Museum, Accademia Gallery <BR> <BR>Sienna (1 day) <BR>visit Pisa on the way to Sienna <BR>Il Campo, The Duomo <BR> <BR>Naples (2 days) <BR>Day 1 - Baia <BR>Day 2 - Pompeii <BR> <BR>Rome (3 days) <BR>Day 1 - Colloseum and Roman Forum. Floodlit walk as per Rick Steve's book <BR>Day 2 - Vatican and surroundings. Dolce Vita Stroll (walk as per RS) <BR>Day 3 - Pantheon & Central Rome. Capuccin Crypt. <BR> <BR>----- <BR> <BR>The trip is 6.5 weeks.. and that's what we've come up with. Please comment esp. on the duration which we've set aside. <BR> <BR>Thanks heaps. <BR> <BR>Amanda. <BR> <BR>

Amanda, <BR>My initial reaction was to hope that you had set aside 8 to 10 days in Luzerne because you'll need a hospital stay of that duration to recover from total exhaustion! I realize you're young and being Australian a far piece down the road from Europe. Don't think of this trip as a once in a life time experience. It took Hitler, Napoleon and the Caesars years to cover as much ground as you envision. Scale this trip down on the premise that you'll do it again and catch what you missed this trip. There are a number of things you should take in to consideration. For example: with only two and a half days in Paris it's uneconomical to pay 60 Australian dollars for a museum pass. Have you considered the time you'll lose standing in line at the Louvre, or Florence's Uffizi? Are train schedules going to allow you enough time for a full day in Brugges or simply time to visit its train station for lunch? Your query will prompt a lot of responses I'm sure and I'm equally sure each will tell you that your itinerary is too ambitious and cheats yourself of the opportunity to really indulge in the delights of Paris or Florence or Vienna or wherever. Pare it down and plan to come back again!

Gosh, are you organized! I would recommend modifying Paris as follows: on the first day start at the rooftop of La Samaritaine for a glorious panoramic view of the city, then the Louvre, then Place de la Concorde, then Arc de Triomphe. A ride to the top of the Tour Eiffel is best at dusk when the light is the most beautiful, staying until after dark when the lights are turned on all over the city. I would recommend a boat ride on the Seine either before or after going to the Tour Eiffel (glorious late afternoon or after dark). On the second day, you may want to start at Musee Rodin (not to be missed in my opinion - the gardens, mansion, and scupltures are outstanding), perhaps preceded by a visit to Napoleon's Tomb at the Eglise du Dome, then the Musee d'Orsay, then St. Chapelle (have you been to Notre Dame previously - for most folks this is a must see), then to the Latin Quarter. Actually, I would recommend winding up the day in the St. Germaine area, rather than the Latin Quarter for an excellent dinner and terrific nightlife. As for Lucerne, don't miss the Lion Monument. In Zurich, you can walk Banhoffstrauss in 20 minutes (unless you plan to do some serious shopping, which I would discourage since virtually everything can be purchased for substantially less elsewhere), and the old section of the city is wonderful. Full of fabulous restaurants and gorgeous buildings. A walk to the lake is nice. This is quite the ambitious itinerary and I congratulate you on your planning!

Thanks for your comments Wes and Donna. <BR> <BR>By getting the museum pass, won't you be avoiding the queues at museums in Paris? Or did you mean queues to actually enter the museums? <BR> <BR>We did check out the train timetables - the above itenary does take that into account. We get to Bruges around 10am and leave there to go to Amsterdam around 6pm. <BR> <BR>I am aware that it does have a fair amount of travelling. We thought that for this trip we'll have a sample of what is there.. enough to know where to return to. <BR> <BR>Is it really that rushed though? <BR> <BR>We did originally set aside a whole day for the Louvre as we have for Uffizi. <BR> <BR>*confused* <BR>

Anyone whose itinerary includes chocolate is thinking along the right lines, I'd say. <BR>I think one of the big advantages of the musuem pass is that it allows you to see the Louvre in three-hour chunks over several days, rather than entering the equivalent of Biosphere II for an entire day. <BR>I hate to sound pedestrian, but it seems to me that at some point you're going to need to do a load of laundry and might also want to spend a day cafe-sitting, writing postcards, etc. Where does that fit in? <BR>Also, while your schedule accommodates train schedules, what about museum closings? Have you plotted this out on a calendar to see where they fall? What about national holidays? <BR>If your goal is getting a general feeling for Europe, I'd suggest bagging some of the smaller towns for which you've planned one-day stays. Add the time to the major cities, from which you can plan day trips if you feel so inclined, lesser sights of the big cities if something interests you, laundry if you need it, or soup and a nap if you get sick (one of the big hazards of high-speed travel, in my experience).

<BR>Amanda- <BR>You certainly hit on a lot of good sights, but you are definitely too rushed. Not so much because you didn't allow enough time for each thing, but because you didn't factor in mental exhaustion and time to absorb what you've seen. For example, you just might not have room in your mind to register anything you see at the D'Orsay after spending all morning at the Louvre. Some of these things take some time to sink in, and you will soon find that you're not appreciating any of the sights if you are concentrating more on where you're going next than on just absorbing where you are at that moment. I hope your trip is fantastic for you! Enjoy it...

WHOA, And I thought my husband and I planned alot. I do agree with some of the posters in that, with the itinerary you've designed, places will start to run together. When you see some of these sights, it can be quite moving. You will not be able to appreciate these places, sights, etc. at your rate of speed. After a while, they will all run together, and although you will be able to say you were there, you will not be able to apprecaite the beauty and the experience at this rate. To start you will need more time in Paris. We waited 3 hours in line for the Eiffel Tour. The Eiffel and Notre Dame will take one day, maybe with an hour at a side walk cafe. Louvre and Orsay in one day, I say impossible. Versailles in one day is fine. I will only comment on the areas I know about. Venice and Florence are about right, but you have not figured in any down time. Also, something to consider, rain, late trains, train strikes, museum closings, etc. Honestly, I done this and it was not fun. Missed many things, and never relaxed. The only way to see it all is to condense and make plans to go back. I would start by concentrating on less countries. What are your favorite places?

Hi Amanda - <BR> <BR>Let me preface my comments by saying you're a woman after my own heart. I usually like fitting in lots of sites too but yours, I think, is even too much for me. <BR> <BR>1st, two major museums in one day is just not good IMO. The Louvre is a daunting task in its own right. Unless you are a major museum hoping fan (and you might be, I don't know) you will have had your fill for the day at the Louvre. <BR> <BR>Also, only 2.5 days in Paris? Are you crazy? I've taken two trips to Paris for 6 days each and I'm still making lists about what I want to see next time we go. PLEASE allow at least 4-5 days for Paris. I don't think you'll regret it. What about the Catacombs, St. Chapelle, Rodin Museum, etc. and just wandering around for no good reason? You will miss much if you only stay 2.5 days. <BR> <BR>I would stay over night in Brugges. I haven't been but from what I've read on this forum, it's really neat and requires more than 8 hours. <BR> <BR>As for other locations, I would recommend, as I have seen other posters recommend in the past, to stay in one strategic location for 6-7 days and then do day trips from there. You will be amazed at what a pain in the butt packing and repacking is. <BR> <BR>Which leads me to luggage. I hope you're only planning on one bag each and perhaps a tote. Believe me, you don't want to be running around with luggage in tow. Also, it's terrible trying to get around on the Metro with all the stairs and whatnot with luggage. <BR> <BR>Good luck with whatever you plan! <BR> <BR <BR>

Amanda--a few thoughts. First, I have twice done a whirlwind tour like yours and while hectic, I wouldn't have traded it for ld. You need to take into account your age, health and tude. While everyone says you have to figure you will return, you also have to figure how much it's costing you to go, so you might as well do as much as you can. I think you are going a little heavy on the Rick Steves. While his suggestions for seeing the sights are usually right on, his suggestions for lodging were, in my family's opinion, a little too bottom-of-the barrel. So many European hotels are noisy because of traffic, so you have to figure on little sleep. Almost every hotel he recommended that we chose had uncomfortable mattresses and no air conditioning. That was very hard on my husband who doesn't sleep well away from home, so he turned into a grouch and got sick. Also, I can't for the life of me understand what Rick Steves sees in Bacharach. There is absolutely nothing there. And, it is impossible to sleep because of the trains that go right under the hotels' windows. Go on to Heidelberg. Don't stay in Bacharach. In Salzburg you will find several laundries that will wash your clothes so you can see the sights or just rest and enjoy. I say go for it. Eat well. Give each other space. Keep a journal. Buy earplugs. Spend a little extra on a quieter hotel if you can. Have a great trip. <BR>

Versailles? skip it if you only have 2.5 days in Paris - really not worth a trip - spend more time in Paris!!! <BR>Versailles...maybe on sunday when they have the fountain "show" which is really no big deal.

Amanda, <BR>It's me again with some more thoughts. Firstly, I'm surprised that there haven't been more respondents to date strongly suggesting that you curtail your itinerary. A second thought crossed my mind. Obviously, you've planned for the sights you wish to see most meticulously. Have you done the same for accommodation reservations? Will you be staying in hostels or hotels? If the latter, have or will you make reservations in advance so that you aren't losing precious time hunting for a bed at night? What happens if you've reserved in a town or city and your schedule goes askew? Will credit card deposits or other deposits and reservations be lost? Now, for some analogies. Think of yourself in a fine restaurant presented with a menu; a menu comprised of all the sights you wish to see in Europe. You tell the waiter you'll have a sample of each item on the menu. What will you accomplish, besides throwing the kitchen staff into turmoil? Assuredly you'll desensitize your palate and be bloated by taste after taste that by their sheer number leave no pleasant, meaningful, lasting memories of the individual dishes that comprised the meal. Take another analogy. Same restaurant but now the menu is comprised of page after page of all the wonders of Paris. You order the Louvre and the Tour Eiffel. Can you say you've experienced Paris? Do two museums, an arch and a tower comprise Paris? <BR>I think not. What of the leisurely stroll through the Jardin du Luxembourg, the stained glass windows of Ste. Chapelle, the hours idly spent in a sidewalk café? What of the street entertainers on Pl. Georges Pompideau or the restful silence of the Place de Vosges? Miss these and so many other experiences like them and you miss Paris. So, too, with Amsterdam, Berlin, Florence, Prague and many other places on your itinerary. <BR>

Amanda, <BR>It's me again with some more thoughts. Firstly, I'm surprised that there haven't been more respondents to date strongly suggesting that you curtail your itinerary. A second thought crossed my mind. Obviously, you've planned for the sights you wish to see most meticulously. Have you done the same for accommodation reservations? Will you be staying in hostels or hotels? If the latter, have or will you make reservations in advance so that you aren't losing precious time hunting for a bed at night? What happens if you've reserved in a town or city and your schedule goes askew? Will credit card deposits or other deposits and reservations be lost? Now, for some analogies. Think of yourself in a fine restaurant presented with a menu; a menu comprised of all the sights you wish to see in Europe. You tell the waiter you'll have a sample of each item on the menu. What will you accomplish, besides throwing the kitchen staff into turmoil? Assuredly you'll desensitize your palate and be bloated by taste after taste that by their sheer number leave no pleasant, meaningful, lasting memories of the individual dishes that comprised the meal. Take another analogy. Same restaurant but now the menu is comprised of page after page of all the wonders of Paris. You order the Louvre and the Tour Eiffel. Can you say you've experienced Paris? Do two museums, an arch and a tower comprise Paris? <BR>I think not. What of the leisurely stroll through the Jardin du Luxembourg, the stained glass windows of Ste. Chapelle, the hours idly spent in a sidewalk café? What of the street entertainers on Pl. Georges Pompideau or the restful silence of the Place de Vosges? Miss these and so many other experiences like them and you miss Paris. So, too, with Amsterdam, Berlin, Florence, Prague and many other places on your itinerary. <BR>

WOW! I am already tired just reading that schedule! If it's Tuesday..... My recommendation concurs with above. Bacharach on the Rhine is a short trip and not an overnight destination. Heidelberg much better. Overall, I too would eliminate a few things, slow down and enjoy what you see. My wife and I still talk about the couple we ran into on a cable car ride when we lived in Germany. They were on a "See all of Europe" tour. I asked them where they had been and they disagreed on where they had been the day before. They were not really sure of the last week and the wife could not remember one of the stops the husband was telling us about. Take a video and talk into it so you can remember when you arrive home exhausted and needing a vacation. WOW!

Hi Amanda, <BR> <BR>I'd like to offer the same suggestion I've made before to anyone spending more than 3 or 4 weeks in Europe. I think its great to pick someplace to settle for an entire week and take daytrips from. It gives you a chance to relax, and to really immerse yourself in the European lifestyle more. If it were me I would pick the countryside in either France or Italy. Maybe rent a villa in Tuscany for a week. Or a villa in Provence. If cities are really more your speed than stay a whole week in Florence or Paris, where you rent an apartment and go to the market and buy food and such. It almost forces you to slow down and enjoy. Not to mention doing laundry, and sleeping late, and NOT going to museums. Maybe go to the beach somewhere and spend an entire day NOT sightseeing. I know I couldn't keep up the pace you've set.

Amanda- I think you can rearrange/eliminate some things on your Italy leg (slight pun-boot. Venice: Is the RS's Grand Canal Tour, a canal trip on the water-bus? If so I wouldn't plan it just do it when the opportunity/time arises. I would combine St. Mark's Sq., Bascilla, and the Doge's Palace (same area/same day). Glassblowing (Murano?) If so why not do the Accademia in the AM and go to the island for lunch and the glassblowing (haven't been there). Florence: I'd skip the Renaissance walk (to save time), and see these sights in bits and pieces while walking between sites the next 4 days. Don't let the maps deceive you all the major sites are within 800m of the Duomo (Pitti P. ~1500m). With reservations I'd give the Uffizi 1/2 day and with reservations the Accademia an hr and just see Michelangelo's "David" and "The four Slaves/Prisoners". I would combine the Science Museum and Pitti Palace walking via the Ponte Vecchio. Rome: Depending on the queues/crowds I would combine Colosseum, Roman Forum, Palatine, Pantheon, and end your long day at Piazza Navona. The Capuccin Crypt is easy to visit it's within 100m of the Barberini metro stop. Naples: It makes for a long day but you can visit both Herculaneum and Pompeii in 1 day. In closing I must add that my visits to Italy where off-season (feb) so bear in mind I wasn't dealing with long queues and crowds but I still think you can combine some of the sights. HTH Regards, Walter p.s. More time in Paris <BR>

Amanda -- Yes, you do have a lot on your itinerary -- but at least you've gone to the trouble of figuring out the 3 or 4 things in each place that you want to see. If you're going to spend so little time in each place, that's the way to do it: you have to prioritize. I haven't been to all the places listed but I've been to some so I will share what I can: <BR>1. Paris. Yes, you need 5 days to see Paris. If you only have 2.5 days, you may even want to skip the Louvre because there is just WAY too much there -- or at least limit yourself to one of the museum's short tours (around 2 hours I think) that will give you an introduction to their collection without overwhelming you too much. As someone else pointed out, just getting there can take a while and then you still have to stand in line, etc. It takes longer than you'd think. Whatever you do, don't do that thing people do where they run in, scramble to find the Mona Lisa, squint at it from across the room because they can't get anywhere near it because there are too many people in the room, and then leave -- argh. Of the things on your list, the Musee d'Orsay was my favorite. Versailles is spectacular; at least you set aside a whole day for it. My favorite museum in Paris is the Picasso museum in the Marais. The Arc de Triomphe is no great shakes in my opinion; go see Sacre Coeur/Montmartre instead! But please, please, please, think about eliminating a couple of your other destinations and adding 2-3 days on to your time in Paris. <BR>2. Amsterdam. I think what you have planned sounds about perfect for the amount of time you're there. My favorites were the Anne Frank House and the Van Gogh museum, which was fantastic. Frankly, the Rijksmuseum is overwhelming in the same way the Louvre is (only less so) -- there's just too much there and unless you have a ton of time I'm not sure I'd even bother; your time might be better spent sitting at a cafe and soaking up the atmosphere of the city and peoplewatching. <BR>3. Rhine cruise -- this will be great -- make sure you have lots of film. <BR>4. Venice, Florence, & Rome -- Considering the amount of time you have to spend overall, I think you've allotted just enough time here (or almost, anyway) and have a pretty good plan. <BR>5. In general: I really think it's better to spend at LEAST 2 nights/3 days in each place you plan to stop (3 nights is better). Otherwise you can't even appreciate what you're seeing. I would recommend that you eliminate at least 2 or 3 destinations and add that time to some of the others (especially Paris). I know this is hard to imagine, but it's actually not even fun to go to one of the nicest cities in the world for only 1 day, especially after you've already been travelling for weeks on end. By the end of the six weeks, it starts to feel more like an obligation than anything that you actually want to do. Better to add those one-day segments on somewhere else (Paris!). <BR>Good luck and have a great trip.

Hi everyone <BR> <BR>Thank you thank you thank you soo much. <BR> <BR>One thing which came up was that more time is needed in Paris. I had a chat with my boyfriend last night, and we both sat down and had a talked about what we really watned to do in Paris. <BR> <BR>Paris was the last place we added on the list because my boyfriend insisted that he wants to go to the Louvre. I didn't think it was worth it going all the way there just for a day in the Louve, so we added another day and the day we land in PAris. (2.5 days, we land around 6am). We will definitely go back to Paris. On this trip we haven't added France and Spain as such. We will go back to do these.. so we've finally figured out taht while in PAris, we will not rush to see all the sights, but to firstly concentrate on the Louvre and Versailles. The rest of the stuff, we'll fit in around it. <BR> <BR>Does that sound reasonable? I know we're not going to experience Paris - but we will be returning and at least we will know then to set aside a week or so for it. <BR> <BR>For the rest of the trip, we've decided that we'll go through our list again, and prioritize what we want to see. And if we don't make the rest, we will return one day. <BR> <BR>Please don't get me (us) wrong. We have no intentions of rushing through at headlong speed (though the itenerary might give a different impression). It's our first time and we have no idea how long things take and how big the various places are. Advice obtain from this posts ahve been invaluable. <BR> <BR>We have taken into consideration the closing times for the various museums and have checked the trains. I will go through my maps to figure out wher Heidelberg is. One plus I felt about Bacharac is that the youth hostel used ot be a castle.. I'd love to spend a night in a castle and I can't really afford the other ones. <BR> <BR>From the above posts, it seems that time allocated for most other things is about right(?) and it's just Paris that was rushed?? <BR> <BR>I do thank you all for your help. And as we reshape our itenerary, will keep referring to posts.

Regarding your plan to visit Italy, though it's quite well balanced, I think you'll regret not having an extra day in Rome. If you're able to cut a day (or a city) from your itinerary before getting to Venice, I would add it to the Rome stay. This would enable you to visit the Museo Borghese and Tivoli, if you wish. I agree with Walter on whgat regards changes on your city visiting plans. I'll save my comments for later, when you've established the number of days in each. Right now I want to comment only on Naples. Here I don't agree with Walter 100%. Although a visit to both, Pompei and Ercolano may be fit in a single day, I think this is a mistake ... IMO, nobody should visit both and miss the Archaelogical Museum in Naples. I would visit the Museum first and then go about visiting Pompei, returning in the evening. You won't have time fitting all three in a single day. Also to consider, in Naples, is the Capodimonte Museu ... Most probably, considering you'll have visited quite a number of museums before you get there, it's ok giving priority to a boat trip in the bay. <BR>Paulo <BR> <BR>

I keep reading and re-reading posts and though it puts things in a jumble, I'm so glad to have several experienced opinions. <BR> <BR>A few more questions have have been raised.. <BR> <BR>Is it worth stopping in Montreaux for Chateau Chillon? <BR> <BR>Someone's just told me that you'll only spend 2 hours there.. if that's the case we probably might either skip it or get off the train so ahve a look at it and resume our journey on that day itself, instead of spending the night in Montreaux. <BR> <BR>Another question we found ourselves asking is.. would it be worth it to spend the night in Bruges? We're hoping to do most of our travelling at night or late evening, so taht's why we figured, we'd take the train to Amsterdam and spend the night there. We would also get one less travel day on euro. But what goes on in Bruges after dark? If it's a small town, won't it go to sleep? <BR> <BR>Please comment. <BR> <BR>Thanks.

Montreaux is a beautiful city to visit and the Chateau does only take about two hours to visit. I would see Heidleberg, instead.