jsmith

Please forgive me, NorthShore, for intruding on your post.

Rex, have you read "The Coming Generational Storm" by Laurence Kotlikoff, professor of economics at Boston University? His "generational accounting" should be required study for politicians on both sides of the aisle.

http://econ.bu.edu/kotlikoff/

4totravel

Off topic from visas and the like - but if you plan to rent a car on occassion - you might find it cheaper to lease a car for the year and travel with it....a lot of people have mentioned overseas leasing for stays fo 17 days or more - and it might make a lot of sense for you as you travel around (saving on rail costs) and allows you deeper exploration of the areas you travel in...something to check out anyway...and now back to our program....

Patrick

On that same vein, the lease idea works best if you put major cities at each end of the trip -- places you'll stay the longest and not need a car. And also don't be trapped into looking at a map and trying to do your trip is what looks like a logical progression. In these days of cheap flights, we never worry about what would look like backtracking. What does make sense is to put places together when you'll be using the car and not be afraid to fly off a couple hours (that's a long way in Europe) to visit others at ends of the trip.

For example, next summer among other places we'll be re-visiting Venice, Bellagio, Nice, Paris, and London. Now logically you'd think we'd do them in that order. But after studying transporation, we're actually doing Venice, Bellagio, then fly to London from Milan, fly to Nice, and then fly to Paris. All three flights are quicker and cheaper than any combination of train tickets we could figure out that would take longer even in the more logical order of visits.

degas

Here are some daytrips to consider. Given you will have 30 days in Paris, you could do easily do 4-6. You might consider doing an overnight or two and maybe string a couple together.

Chartres

Versailles

Troyes

Fontainebleau

Chateau Malmaison

Chantilly & Senlis

Monet's Garden at Giverny

St-Germain-en-Laye

Vaux-le-Vicomte

Provins

Chateau de Versailles

Chateau de St. Germaine-en-Laye

Auvers-sur-Oise

Loire Valley (long day or overnite)

Reims (long day or overnite)

Rouen (long day or overnite)

See http://www.voyages-sncf.com/

starrsville

I am sooooo with Patrick on this one.

Northshore, it sounds as if you have and are thinking out all the possibilities. What you and your spouse are doing is a dream for many - and something that many of the same would be too timid to try.

Do it. Enjoy it. But, be sure to give us updates now and then.

There's a small cottage in a lavender field in Provence that I want to rent one summer. It's 800 euros a week in the summer - and 800 euros a month in the winter. Your budget seems more than ample. I would rent a few places long-term as previously suggested and use them as bases for shorter trips via train.

Go for it!

SusanP

NorthShore, You don't need to justify your decision to do this. It never ceases to amaze me the amount of personal financial information that people give here. I think most of us would LOVE to do what you are planning. It's really none of anyone's business what your financial status is or how you use your money. Anyway, it's clear that you have all that under control. I hope you have a wonderful experience (you are sure to with the time you have at your disposal).

As others have mentioned, do it while you can. My husband always tells the story about a man he worked with who was extremely good and knowledgeable about his job. He and his wife had plans to move to Florida (we live in upstate NY) when he retired to "enjoy life." Halfway to Florida, he died of a heart attack.

suze

NorthShore, I hope you'll post now and then as your plans develop. I'm especially interested to know how staying 8 months works out as far as gov't paperwork needed to do this.

I'm guessing a combination of longer term apartment/home rentals with a few 1 week hotel stays in between would give you the most flexibility. And I think your budget is more than adequate for what you describe.

All the best, s.

Kristina

Northshore-

I just want to chime in from the "younger" generation here. I think your plan sounds fantastic!
The year we turned 30 (we're now 36) my husband and I quit our jobs and took a year off to travel the world. It turned out to be 9 months of the best time of our lives before the money ran out. BTW, we never had to "check in" in the US, but that was 1998-9, so maybe things have changed.
Friends, family and aquaintences, all said "are you crazy? Why don't you buy a house/ have a family/ save for retirement?"
Well, we came home, got our jobs back and within a year bought a house. We have absolutely no regrets and would do it again in a heartbeat. It was the best $36,000 ever spent in my opinion. We hope to do it again someday. We're glad we din't wait for retirement otherwise we might never have trekked in Nepal, gone diving on the Great Barrier Reef, or spent 6 weeks in Thailand.
As for your plan, I vote for the apartment rentals. They will turn out to be substantially cheaper and more comfortable. We just did a 1 week rental in Paris and it was still cheaper to leave the apartment vacant for 2 days while we traveled to Lyon, than to rent a hotel room only for the days were were there. Check out www.vrbo.com for apartment rentals. Many give discounts for a month's stay. Maybe another option is to do the month rentals and then spend 1-2 weeks traveling between your "main" destinations, staying in hotels along the way.
I also think your money is ample for your needs.
The car leasing option is a good idea. We did this through Peugeot for 3 months in Europe and it was fantastic. Yes, rail can be cheap, but it adds up for two people and having a car gives an amazing amount of freedom.
Whatever you decide, it will be right for you. Have a fantastic trip!

NorthShore

Thank you all for the continued feedback.

We have a huge planning task ahead of us. I will post more questions as we narrow down our city choices.

walkinaround

it's already been corrected that the US does not require a periodic "check in". however, i find it fascinating that so many people here accepted this premise without much thought. i'm not an expert on immigration/visa/travel issues but any thought that a free, western democracy (or any country for that matter) would require it's travelling citizens to periodically "check in" would send shivers up my spine. talk about an infringement on personal freedoms!

why did so many accept this as likely? have liberties eroded so much in the US that people actually find that it would be plausable that the US government would restrict its citizens in such a major way? i'm not trying to start trouble but just an observation of something that i thought was a little strange.

Pausanias

Sounds like a wonderful plan to me. We hope to do something similar, but basing ourselves in one city (probably Rome).

As far as the visa issue, generally you will be able to obtain permission for a longer stay by proving you have the financial resources to support yourself without working. You can do that.

There is no "check-in" requirement for American citizens. They may be thinking of legal permanent residents (Green Card holders).

The only advice I have is to consider the attractions of each locale carefully. A month in Heidleburg would be way too long for me, same with Amsterdam -- but perhaps you have special interests in those places.

Spending the winter in Mexico or Central America -- to me these are a vastly under-rated destinations. Lately I've been more interested in traveling there than to Europe.

Patrick

walkinaround, what an interesting post. First let me say that I had never heard of, nor did I accept the idea that a citizen might need to "check in" as you say.

But I think the bottom line to this is that there are two ways to think of this. A mother may require a teenager to check in mid way through an evening date. Some regard this as a total act of aggression on her part and resent her interfering with their fun. Others may actually feel it shows she cares.

While I didn't think a citizen would have to check in with his government from time to time, let me say that if this were true, I'd think "how nice. They care about me and want to know I'm safe." I wouldn't find it a horrible violation of my personal freedoms. Of course, I realize others would be quick to call it a violation of their rights -- just not me.

But then I'm the type who doesn't find having to be searched at the airport is a violation of my personal freedom either. I'm a firm believer that if it makes things safer overall,then why worry about a little inconvenience?

NorthShore

Good advice about picking the cities wisely. I guess one method is to have "hub" cities with lots of daytrip options and alternate the one month and one/two week stays.

I like Amsterdam, but view it as a two week stay as a means see it again and also explore the region.

obxgirl

walkinaround, I think you're reaching a little bit here.

The person who raised (and then self corrected) the possibility of a US citizen check-in requirement posted late at night on a holiday weekend. Not exactly fodor rush hour. Most people were either asleep or with their families/friends over the long weekend. The others posting at the time seemed heavily engaged in another aspect of NorthShore's post.

suze

walkinaround- i think your post is WAY over the top. i did not "accept this premise"... but since i had no facts at hand about length of allowable stays, visa, or anything related, nor was it in any way information i needed myself, i didn't pay attention to that single reply that i figured was in error in the first place. sheez.

jsmith

Passports are a wonderful source of information though I suspect most of us don't get past our own photo.

The US passport reads:

Register with the US Embassy: when traveling to remote or volatile areas, visiting a foreign country for a prolonged stay, or residing abroad - register with the US embassy or consulate by telephone, fax or in person.

A UK passport reads:

Registration Overseas British Nationals resident overseas who are entitled to the protection of the UK authorities should contact the nearest British High Commission, Embassy or Consulate to enquire about any arrangements for registration of their names and addresses. Failure to do so may in an emergency result in difficulty or delay in according them assistance and protection.

I would expect passports from any country would have similiar language.

Questions for NorthShore to resolve:

Does the sale of your home, etc. and moving out of the US for an extended period make you an overseas resident?

You make note of your 20 year military service, would any of the benefits be negated by overseas residency?

rialtogrl

NorthShore - you might enjoy reading this blog written by a woman who is traveling around Europe with her husband and daughter for 18 months:

http://www.slowtrav.com/blog/kaydee/

Absolutely rent apartments - not hotels. You will get sick of eating out! At least I did during my year in Europe (especially in Germany where even a bowl of soup seemed to contain eight sausages.) Sometimes it's nice to wake up and eat some cereal.

Try to live in Amsterdam during the summer when there are free concerts almost every day in the Vondelpark.

You might take a month and rent a car just to be "on the road." I did this and drove from Venice to Amsterdam, on up to Copenhagen, and back down to Venice with no plan. The only rule was, drive for four hours then stop. (Sometimes this rule was broken, but not by much.) I saw some towns I never, ever would have considered visiting and hung out with some locals that rarely saw tourists. It was really great to have no plan. Don't try this in August though!

Patrick

obxgirl and suze, now I'm curious. Since you two have responded to walkinaround's post, do you agree that IF the US government required its citizens to check in with them that you'd consider that a horrible violation of your personal rights? Or like me, would you consider it a good thing -- as protecting me as a citizen and watching out for my welfare?

This is a sort of glass half empty vs. glass half full thing.

Queenie

Patrick,
I am curious. Would you really consider it a good thing to spend well over $1000 in airfare and lodging to fly back to the US for at least one night (as the poster indicated) to ‘check in’. What is the purpose of that? Seems like a major waste of time and money.

If you do have a problem in Europe, there are US Embassies and consulates all over the place.

I feel that filing my US tax form annually is enough of a ‘check in’

BTilke

As an expat who's resided in Europe for 6 years and counting, I have never "checked in" with the U.S. Embassy. It's a request, not a legal requirement.
Patrick, checking in with the U.S. Embassy doesn't really add to your safety. During the first Gulf War, when my in-laws were living in Kuwait, they did indeed check in with the U.S. Embassy. And frankly, the embassy staff were next to useless. They screwed things up in dozens of small and big ways (example: my father-in-law spent a few weeks as a hostage in Kuwait City and then Baghdad. The State Department used to call us every few days ostensibly to update us on his status. But they couldn't even keep straight who he WAS. They'd call us with info about my husband's "brother" one day, his "uncle" the next. And they never told us anything we hadn't already heard [more accurately] from other sources). As my in-laws are dual citizens (Canada) they also were in touch with the Canadian Embassy, who were light years ahead of the U.S. Embassy in dealing with civilians caught up in the crisis.