We will be vacationing mainly in Italy but first we will see Paris (Our flight lands there) then take the train to Venice.<BR><BR>I think we can take a sleeper and get there in about 11 1/2 hrs.<BR><BR>My question: <BR>Is that a very scenic route? If you have never seen France before, would you take a day train to see the scenery or would you take the night train to "save" a day? <BR><BR>Thanks<BR><BR>Tim

Hi, Tim! My husband &amp; I are going to Paris and then on to Venice &amp; Rome in May. I have done a lot of research on the trains, &amp; here's what I've found from www.raileurope.com... It seems as though there is only one DIRECT trip from Paris to Venice. It leaves daily at 8:06pm and arrives at 8:44am the next morning. This is the one we're taking to save time (with a 1st class sleeper reservation - I hear it's the best way to get a decent night's sleep). If you really want to go during the day, you'd have a layover in Milan. You'd leave Paris at 7:54am, get into Milan at 2:55pm, leave there at 4:05pm &amp; arrive Venice at 6:55pm. The other option (still with a layover in Milan) is: dep Paris 10:54am, arr Milan 5:55pm, dep Milan 6:10pm, arr Venice 9:22pm.

I did the Paris/Venice run 2 years ago, leaving Paris in the morning, with a change in Lyon and again in Milan. The Lyon/Milan stretch was very picturesque. The Milan/Venice stretch is not particularly scenic, except for some distant views of the Alps if it's a very clear day, as you're leaving Milan. All in all, it was a very loooooong day.

My children and I are going to Venice<BR>from Paris and wanted to cut the<BR>trip in half. We are leaving Paris in<BR>the morning and traveling direct to <BR>Annecy and spending the night and the<BR>next day. Then on to Venice, via Milan,<BR>I think we get into Venice at 6pm or so.<BR>Annecy looks wonderful and worth the<BR>stopover if you have the time. This<BR>town was a recommendation by a couple of<BR>gentlemen here on travel talk.<BR>

Another option is to fly from Paris to Venice which is what we decided to do.<BR><BR>The flight is 1 hour and 45 mins and if you buy a rt (and throw away the second half) it is not much more than the tran.<BR><BR>Just another option.<BR><BR>Donna

Tim, when I was planning to travel from Milan to Paris, I found the following two good posts from Ben Haines and Elvira (thank you to both of them for such helpful advice). Hope this helps ...<BR><BR>Author: Ben Haines ( [email protected])<BR>Date: 1/13/2001, 8:03 pm ET<BR>Message: Fodors <BR><BR>The night raiun from Paris to Milan, the Stendhal Express, is particularly good. It has "Excelsior" coaches, brought into service six months ago. These have air conditioning, a reception area with corridor TV, and in compartments they have seats, a private bathroom with shower, toilet, washbasin, drinking water, a welcome drink, and a light breakfast. Passengers have use of Club Eurostar lounges in Italian stations. The train has a restaurant car. A double compartment costs 274 dollars for two adults, 233 dollars for two seniors or young people aged 16 to 24, and 206 dollars for two children. The price for one adult in a private compartment is about 200 dollars. These fares were set in France for December 2000, and may vary a few percent with exchange rate changes. You can book two months ahead of travel with a credit card by phoning or e-mailing Rail Choice, South East London, website http://www.railchoice.com, e-mail [email protected], and phone ++44 20 7939 9915. Your party would need two doubles and a single. The train leaves Paris Gare de Lyon at 2216, runs from 0058 to 0645 without a stop at a station, and reaches Milan at 0845. You'd need something to do in Paris your last evening -- a circus or ballet, perhaps ? <BR>Eurostar standards are high, but seven hours is still long in a day train. <BR><BR><BR><BR>Author: elvira ( [email protected])<BR>Date: 1/15/2001, 6:46 pm ET<BR>Message: To answer your question, yes you are crazy, but in the best kind of way. <BR><BR>If the kids are old enough to not get too restless, why not take a morning train from Paris, go through Switzerland, and finish up in Milan late afternoon? Ben recommended the reverse trip for me, and it was a beautiful trip - stunning scenery. I had about an hour layover in Lausanne, which gave me a chance to get fresh (Swiss) air, stretch my legs and sit in the sun for a bit. <BR><BR>The trains have snack cars where you can buy sandwiches and drinks (gives the kids something to do), and/or you can bring your own lunch food with you. I'm sure there was a restaurant car on one of the trains, but I had my nosed smooshed against the window, looking at the scenery, and didn't want to leave. <BR><BR>I love trains, so an all-day train ride is enjoyable for me; I can sleep on overnight trains, no problem, but some people can't. I'd plan a very easy day after getting off an overnight train, in case not everyone got a good rest. Are you planning to drive from Milan? If so, I'd stay in Milan overnight, then pick up the car the next day. <BR><BR>The other plus of trains is that they leave from the city, and arrive in the city - no getting to/from airports, and no size/quantity limits on luggage (no waiting at the baggage carousel for the last suitcase).<BR>

We opted for the overnight train and were quite pleased. Motivation was to save day time for other things. If you can get jet transport for about the same cost, it's certainly an option, but you then have another hotel night to pay as well.<BR>Enjoy!

Hi Deb, since you have done a lot of research, maybe you can answer this for<BR>me regarding the Eurail SelectPass.<BR><BR>It seems to be a great price.<BR><BR>How does it work on a night train?<BR>Does it cover the cost of a couchette or sleeper.<BR><BR>Or does it give you a disocunt and addition $$ is due?<BR><BR>

Hi again, Tim! The Eurail Select Pass seems to be just a different "brand" of pass. Yes, it is a good price, about $16 cheaper than the Europass Saver or Euro Saverpass. No, it doesn't include sleeper or couchette. For a sleeper (which is a fairly private car for I think 2 or four people or something), it's about $80 extra per person. For a couchette (much less private &amp; very cramped from what I understand), it's only about $10-$25 extra. One last thing, you cannot book a sleeper or couchette until 60 days out from the day/night you want to travel. www.eurorail.com &amp; http://www.raileurope.com/us/rail/pa..._saverpass.htm, and www.europass.com/6b.htm were all helpful. Let me know if I can do anything else to help. If you are going after May, I'll write &amp; let you know what we thought.

Yes Deb I would like to hear all about it. Please email me when you return. <BR> <BR>I curious about how do I find out if the train has a 4 person couchette. I hear most are for 6 but there are some trains that have couchettes for 4. <BR> <BR>Tim

Fodors <BR> <BR>For Heather, of Chicago: It's a pleasure. <BR> <BR>For Tim: Three countries have 4-berth couchettes. One is Germany, on any NachtZug train, that is, any train with a train number that starts "NZ", whether it is domestic or international. Upou pay some three US dollars extra for the advantage of less crowding. A second is France, on domestic night trains, but these are supplements upon first class fares. And a third is the through couchette car from Budapest to Istanbul, where, again, you need a first class ticket. <BR> <BR>I'm afraid I know no all-Europe website or source for this question. Of course, national rail websites cover each their own country. <BR> <BR>Please write if I can help further. Welcome to Europe. <BR> <BR>Ben Haines, London <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> I curious about how do I find out if the train has a 4 <BR> person couchette. I hear most are for 6 but there are <BR> some trains that have couchettes for 4. <BR> <BR> Tim <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR>