New immigration policies for the Netherlands - will it set a trend?
Mar 16th, 2006, 09:01 AM
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New immigration policies for the Netherlands - will it set a trend?
Here is an interesting article on the new immigration policy in the Netherlands.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11842116/from/RS.1/
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11842116/from/RS.1/
Mar 16th, 2006, 10:08 AM
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I read this in my local paper and was a little confused - are they asked questions about what they see? or do they just have to purchase and presumably watch it? As in many topics covered in the mediia, it seemed incomplete and possibly misleading.
Mar 17th, 2006, 09:11 AM
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Holland is struggling to understand and manage its non EU immigrants. Regardless of what you think of this film, most people do not know that to be a non-EU temporary resident in Holland, one must pay a lot of money up front (about €1500 for a family of four) just to live in the country. And if you are a non-EU spouse applying for permanent residence, you are required to take a Dutch language course and pass it.
Mar 17th, 2006, 10:05 AM
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I heard an interview on this subject yesterday with a Dutch jounalist.He stated that this tape was aimed at immigrants from two specific countries,Turkey,and Morocco.The point was to inform them about the norms of the Netherlands,and the unspoken subtext of dissuading them of coming at all.
I found that humorous.
Mar 17th, 2006, 01:56 PM
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it's one of the stupidest things i heard of. europe is undergoing a serious identity crisis. like the manuals of british life that try to teach people the subtlety of pub behaviour...going into excruciating detail of the interaction with the barman. 9 times out of 10, your barman will be either polish, south african, australian, etc. the feeble attempts to re-establish identity is laughable and sad at the same time.
Mar 17th, 2006, 03:23 PM
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"Given the large birth rates of muslim immigrants..."
My grandmother was always convinced that Roman Catholics were under orders from the Pope to outbreed the rest of us. To her, the arrival of large numbers of Italian and Polish immigrants after WW2, invited by an Irish Catholic-dominated Labor government, showed just how far the Papists were prepared to go to achieve their fiendish aim.
Half a century on, the birth rate among Catholics (even those few still bothering to go to church) is no higher than anyone else's.
Most Muslim girls here are seeking an education, a career and a prosperous lifestyle like anyone else, and are not about to tie themselves down to a house full of kids. Predicting the future by extrapolating from the present is fraught with difficulty.
My grandmother was always convinced that Roman Catholics were under orders from the Pope to outbreed the rest of us. To her, the arrival of large numbers of Italian and Polish immigrants after WW2, invited by an Irish Catholic-dominated Labor government, showed just how far the Papists were prepared to go to achieve their fiendish aim.
Half a century on, the birth rate among Catholics (even those few still bothering to go to church) is no higher than anyone else's.
Most Muslim girls here are seeking an education, a career and a prosperous lifestyle like anyone else, and are not about to tie themselves down to a house full of kids. Predicting the future by extrapolating from the present is fraught with difficulty.
Mar 17th, 2006, 05:18 PM
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The situation in the Netherlands is considerably different than in Oz, or the US.
Holland is one Theo Van Gogh away from really serious measures.
Don't underestimate the impact of that event on the native Dutch.
There has been pressure to tighten immigration in Holland since 2001, the Pym Fortun days. This is a small pushback.
The next batch of governments voted into power in Europe will be dicidedly more right wing.
Expect more immigration restrictions in more EU countries in the near future.
Holland is one Theo Van Gogh away from really serious measures.
Don't underestimate the impact of that event on the native Dutch.
There has been pressure to tighten immigration in Holland since 2001, the Pym Fortun days. This is a small pushback.
The next batch of governments voted into power in Europe will be dicidedly more right wing.
Expect more immigration restrictions in more EU countries in the near future.
Mar 17th, 2006, 06:39 PM
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It won't make them tolerant, but if you can weed out the intolerant from entering the country, for the Dutch, it's essentially the same.
What it will keep out is diversity of opinion. "If you don't think as we do, you're unwelcome. Dissent from our norms is only acceptable...but barely so...only if it's from native born Dutch.". How does that masquerade as tolerance? But it supports my long-held theory that there's no one less tolerant of diversity than a leftist.
What it will keep out is diversity of opinion. "If you don't think as we do, you're unwelcome. Dissent from our norms is only acceptable...but barely so...only if it's from native born Dutch.". How does that masquerade as tolerance? But it supports my long-held theory that there's no one less tolerant of diversity than a leftist.
Mar 17th, 2006, 06:58 PM
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Obviously the intent is to discourage the entry of people unsympathetic to a liberal, tolerant democracy. That would only constitute a throttling of dissent in the worlds imagined by George Orwell and Lewis Carroll. Back to Logic 101, Jeffrey.
Mar 18th, 2006, 06:42 AM
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Obviously the intent is to discourage the entry of people unsympathetic to a liberal, tolerant democracy
Hmmm...in other words, a promotion of the Dutch version of 'goodthinkfulness'?
Back to Logic 101
<grin> 'If only you'd educate yourself on this issue, you'd surely agree with me...'. ..my, how patronizing. One hears that sort of thing from liberals all the time...if one disagrees
with their point of view, one is obviously ignorant, uneducated or evil. How about, simply, a respectful agreement to disagree?
Hmmm...in other words, a promotion of the Dutch version of 'goodthinkfulness'?
Back to Logic 101
<grin> 'If only you'd educate yourself on this issue, you'd surely agree with me...'. ..my, how patronizing. One hears that sort of thing from liberals all the time...if one disagrees
with their point of view, one is obviously ignorant, uneducated or evil. How about, simply, a respectful agreement to disagree?
Mar 18th, 2006, 06:56 AM
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Some things are just plain intolerable.
Agree with you there....but which Taliban, gauleiter, commissar, warden, elder or Christian fundamentalist do we let decide what those 'some things' are?
Look...what would you think of an American government that discouraged the immigration of those unlikely to vote Republican? Not much, I suspect, but then, neither would I.
Agree with you there....but which Taliban, gauleiter, commissar, warden, elder or Christian fundamentalist do we let decide what those 'some things' are?
Look...what would you think of an American government that discouraged the immigration of those unlikely to vote Republican? Not much, I suspect, but then, neither would I.
