jamal6008

Got an idea! Go from Barcelona to Rome (flight) and than travel up to rest of italy, switzerland and than to paris in trains. That will reduce travel times significantlyyyyyy

jamal6008

£335 for this flight for 5 people. good or bad price?

bvlenci

You still have seven days with very long train trips out of a seventeen-day holiday. If Spain and Italy are the two main places you want to visit, then I would also suggest dropping Zurich, and maybe even Bern.

You don't have to pass through Zurich to get to Bern, by the way. Almost all (maybe even all?) trains between Switzerland and Italy start from Milan, and there are direct trains to Bern from Milan, which take an hour less than the trains to Zurich, so you'd save almost two hours by just going directly to Bern.

I think it takes at the very least about ten hours to get to Madrid from Paris by train, with one or more changes of train. You'd have to leave very early to get there by a reasonable time, and the changes of train can be stressful with a tired and cranky family. I would suggest flying to Madrid from Paris. Then you could take the train to Barcelona.

From Barcelona to Italy, you could fly, take the train (also a very long trip) or take an overnight ferry as far as Genova. From Genova, you could take the train to Rome, and then another train to Venice.

You could also take a train from Venice to Bern, and from there to Paris.

This would give you six places to visit and five longish travel days, plus a few shorter trips. You could spend three nights in Madrid, two nights in Barcelona, three nights in Rome, two nights in Venice, two nights in Bern, and three nights in Paris. I don't know if that leaves you another night to

The Interrail tickets would not give you much of a savings in Italy. Almost all long-distance trains require a reservation, which costs €10 per person per train. If you buy your tickets online well in advance, you can often get them for not much more than that, including the reservation. If you're traveling in August, it's already a bit late to get the cheapest fares, as they go on sale 120 days in advance, and the best bargains sell out quickly. They have some discounts that don't sell out so quickly, such as two-for-one on Saturdays, or the Family fare, with a 20% discount for the adults along with the usual 50% discount for kids under age 15. (There has to be at least one kid in the group.)

The Interrail tickets are also of no use for urban travel in Italy, although they could be of some use in Paris. I don't know about Spain or Switzerland, but I wouldn't count on saving any money with it in Italy.

Here is the site for Italian train tickets:

http://www.trenitalia.com/cms/v/inde...005817f90aRCRD

You can find bargain air fares on www.skyscanner.net .

jamal6008

Please tell me this is better.

Travel:

London to Paris (train)

Paris to Barcelona (train)

Barcelona to Rome (flight)

Rome to Milan (train)

Milan to Venice (train or cancel this and not go to Venice at all)

Venice/Milan to Zurich (train)

Zurich to Bern (train)

Bern to Paris (train)

Paris to London (train)

bvlenci

While I was writing that message, a lot of other stuff came in between.

jamal6008

@bvlenci Thanks for your very helpful reply. That will certainly help me plan things.

jamal6008

@bvlenci haha what do you think of my latest plan by the way?

jamal6008

Quater-final version

Travel:

London to Paris (train)

Paris to Barcelona (train)

Barcelona to Rome (flight)

Rome to Venice (train)

Venice to Zurich (train)

Zurich to Bern (train)

Bern to Paris (train)

Paris to London (train)

I would spend (in order) one night in Paris, three nights in Barcelona, three nights in Rome, two nights in Venice, two nights in Zurich, two nights in Bern, and three nights in Paris.

If you have any suggestions for alternative cities that you might believe are better to visit with family please do let me know.

kybourbon

You should not go to Paris twice. Since you already booked the Eurostar ticket, you need to eat the return on it and forget wasting time backtracking through Paris. It's a false value to think you are saving a few bucks on a Eurostar ticket when it causes you an extra day wasted in travel/backtracking.

Train to Paris - VISIT Paris (3 days)

Train to Bern, Zurich (why Zurich at all?). Name one thing you want to see in Zurich.

Train to Milan/Venice

Train to Rome

Fly to either Barcelona or Madrid

Fly home to London from either Barcelona or Madrid

janisj

jamal6008: You are certainly one stubborn fellow - meant kindly - not to be mean.

No, your new plan a little better but is still not good. None of your plans have been good. But it sounds like your mind is set and NOTHING we say will convince you.

>>I don't necessarily want to see every single attraction in that city but just the main one's. <<

You will NOT see almost any attractions, let alone the main ones, in most of those cities. You WILL see the insides of many train stations, train cars, city buses getting from the train stations to wherever you are staying, and the front desks of those hotels. (You will be checking in/out and taking trains more than SEEING anything. So this is a MASSIVE waste of time and money to see a lot of train stations.

>>. . . one night in Paris, three nights in Barcelona, three nights in Rome, two nights in Venice, two nights in Zurich, two nights in Bern, and three nights in Paris.<<

One night nets you about 1/2 a day. Two Nights = 1 to 1.5 days depending on train times. And three nights gets you 2-ish days. But it is your trip and - like I said - you are very stubborn. (Your kids will absolutely HATE you about half way through this trek)

jamal6008

Well Paris return ticket is already booked so it would be a waste of approx £225 (5 people) if I don't return from paris.

Now there is a reason why I did it this way. If I have 15 days continuous pass, I can actually end up in Paris towards the end after the pass has expired and spend extra 2-3 days there because the return ticket has been bought separately. Also the return journey from paris is just over 2 hours.

kybourbon

You are also only looking at actual train transit time. You have to factor in how long it takes your family to get ready in the mornings (will there be 5 people sharing one bathroom?), check out of hotel, have breakfast out (many places don't include breakfast), get transportation to train station from hotel. Then you arrive in a new, unfamiliar city with a different language and you need to figure out the reverse (transport to hotels, etc). You are underestimating the logistics of such travel with 5 people (especially since 3 are children).

jamal6008

@janisj lol and I was starting to think that this is a really good plan. I have pretty much gone from 9 cities to 6 cities when I first started. I got rid of all the long traveling routes and have now minimised traveling times. Also to clarify the youngest person is this trip is 16 years old.

From my side I think have compromised a lot to get to this stage but I guess you think that the plan has hardly changed. I don't know what else would you want me to do as these places are a must-see for me and I don't know what else to get rid of.

jamal6008

@janisj @kybourbon

Right, I don't disagree with any of you and your comments about how difficult this can be. But can you please look at the latest plan and tell me what should I change/get rid of that will make it better because I just simply can not make that choice.

You know the places I want to go and you know that I have purchased the return ticket to Paris. Dates are 31st July (arrive at 10.30am) to 17th August (leave at 9pm).

janisj

You want my honest opinion? I'd forget about trying to maximize the Interrail - in fact forget about Interrail completely UNTIL you have made other decisions . . .

Decide which 3 or 4 cities you and your family REALLY wants to see. Then decide the best way to travel between them. It might be interrail - it might be just booking point to point tickets - or i might be a combo of cheap flights and trains.

Plan your trip around places you really want to visit - not about how to get the most out of a rail pass.

In your 2+ weeks and having 5 people -- 4 cities MAXIMUM. (It might be different if you were traveling solo and could sleep any old place and weren't herding 4 others family members)

janisj

Oh - and I have no problem w/ your having booked London/Paris RT. You can do a nice loop starting/ending in Paris.

jamal6008

Can we keep it at 5 cities at least. It's 17 days! I would say Paris, Barcelona, Rome, Venice & Bern. The plan that I had shouldn't change much to accommodate for this.

jamal6008

We are talking about travel in-between cities/country but what about local travel? If I decide not to buy the pass, I would surely have to get other passes individually to allow me to travel from hotel to points of interest within the city.

Sassafrass

With current plan, you do not need to go through Milan to get from Rome to Venice.

Your plan is getting better, but IMHO, something still has to be cut for this to be good. I know you say you just want to see a bit, but it seems like an enormous amount of money just to walk around a bit and not actually tour anything at all. It is, however, your trip and your money. Just think about how much the trip is costing and how little of the great sights you will see. Seriously think about how much time is actually necessary for each place to be appreciated even minimally.

Is the RT London - Paris - London set in stone or is it changeable? If it is changeable, you might consider saving those tickets for a second trip just to Paris and surrounds, or Paris and Switzerland, and skipping Paris or Paris and Switzerland on this trip.

If you could do that, You could then fly directly to
Barcelona,
do a RT by fast train to Madrid,
cheap flight to Venice (there are some cheap direct)
Train to Rome
Fly home
Or train/fly to one more city/area, then home.

You might start laying the trip out and include all travel time, getting from and to hotels or airports as well as train times. This is just a way to pin things down with changes to suit your interests. It brings it down to 4 & 1/2 days of travel and about 12 days of sightseeing time from 6 bases with no one night stops. Still too fast for me personally, but doable, depending on your family.

Day 1, London to Barcelona via Paris by train, to hotel (all day)
Day 2, Barcelona
Day 3, Barcelona
Day 4, fly to Venice, get to hotel, etc (1/2 day), afternoon Venice
Day 5, Venice
Day 6, train to Rome (check out of Venice and into Rome - 1/2 day)
Day 7, Rome
Day 8, Rome
Day 9, train to Zurich via Milan (all day?)
Day 10, Zurich
Day 11, train to Bern (1/2 day with hotel check ins, etc.)
Day 12, Bern
Day 13, train to Paris, (1/2 day or more)
Day 14, Paris
Day 15, Paris
Day 16, add to one of your base cities (Rome, Barcelona or Paris - no new places, but could do a day trip from one of those, depending on your interests.
Day 17, train home (1/2 day)

Add the extra day to:
Barcelona, go to the beach.
Rome, go to Ostia Antica or Orvieto, or stop for the day in Florence on the way from Venice to Rome, but spend the extra night in Rome.
Paris, go to Versailles, rent a boat for the kids to row and visit the town as well as the chateau.

jamal6008

Hi Sassafrass

Thanks for your detailed and informative reply.

Unfortunately the London to Paris is indeed set in stone. Although everyone here has managed to change my stubborn mind (as they say). I have now decided to only visit Paris, Barcelona, Rome, Venice & Bern.

I have not planned exactly in terms of days but I am somewhat thinking in the order of:


London to Paris (train)

Paris to Barcelona (train)

Barcelona to Rome (flight)

Rome to Venice (train)

Venice to Bern (train)

Bern to Paris (train)

Paris to London (train)

I have 18 days (17 nights) to come up with a plan to visit these. I have not purchased any passes etc. other than the return paris ticket.