Robespierre

You can do all that with a computerized map. Imagine carrying michelin.com with you AND having it show "You Are Here" everywhere you go.

With the added advantage that if you change your mind, you can erase the route mark - impossible with a paper map.

Luddites, I stand by my statement.

StCirq

I do many of the same things Patrick mentions. I also tack maps up on the bulletin-board-like walls of my office and put color-coded pins in them. Even if it's possible to do similar things with a laptop, it wouldn't be a tenth as much fun.

Paper maps are the comfort food of travel.

toni

We live in Australia and alas, the 300 series of maps are not available here. St Cirq Lapopie will be our first stop in the Lot/Dordogne area, coming up from San Sebastian in Spain, will I be able to purchase the maps once I reach there?

StCirq

toni: Yes, as I posted earlier on this thread you can get them at any bookstore, most supermarkets, and a lot of rest stops along the autoroutes.

cmt

Why would anyone want to take a big, heavy, expensive, fragile, frequently stolen laptop computer to get driving directions, when there are soft, light, foldable, cheap, rarely stolen, unobtrusive, easily replaced paper maps that do the job?

toni

St. Cirq, thanks for the reply. I missed that part of your post.

StuDudley

>>>We live in Australia and alas, the 300 series of maps are not available here.<<

Try

http://www.maptown.com/
Stu Dudley

StuDudley

>>Why would anyone want to take a big, heavy, expensive, fragile, frequently stolen laptop computer to get driving directions, when there are soft, light, foldable, cheap, rarely stolen, unobtrusive, easily replaced paper maps that do the job?<<

In addition, one of the pleasures of vacations in Europe is getting away from PCs, television, newspapers, and phones.

Stu Dudley

ira

In addition, if you bring your Ipod along, you can put on your earphones while watching your computer screen and avoid the local distractions entirely.

Robespierre

In addition, you can listen to your iPos while looking at a map while trying to figure out where the hell you are when the road signs don't match your dead-reckoning and the magic marker line on the paper stopped making sense 45 minutes ago.

"Why would anyone want to take a big, heavy, expensive, fragile, frequently stolen laptop computer to get driving directions, when there are soft, light, foldable, cheap, rarely stolen, unobtrusive, easily replaced paper maps that do the job?"

It doesn't have to be a laptop, although in a car you don't really care. I use an iPAQ Pocket PC myself. But the answer to your question is: because software does everything that maps do, plus shows your location from moment to moment as well as how to get from where you are to where you want to go.

twoflower

And if your whole holiday plan is based around never never going on a motorway(for obvious reasons) no matter how many countries you traverse in one itinerary, the michelin route planners won't do it for you. Paper maps are here to stay (thank goodness). They are better for pre-planning, and as someone said - who wants to cram a big plastic box of technology around (no doubt to be stolen) when folded-up maps can be slipped unobtrusively into the glove-box?

Robespierre

I don't know what the sentence containing "motorway" means - my program uses every mode and route you allow it to. You can test drive MS&T for a month at

<b>https://streaming.endeavors.com/microsoft/streets</b>

Your entire diatribe sounds like something spoken by someone who has never used it. (By the way, the Pocket PC fits in your <i>pocket</i>, obviating the need for leaving it in the glove compartment like a map. Or do you stuff all your maps in your pants? That must look funny.)

The other thing is that you don't need road maps of various scales plus city maps, because the database contains the entire continent in street-level resolution.

Sue4

I love studying my Michelin maps while planning my trips - I can't imagine doing without paper maps! To order maps online, try www.languagequest.com. I've bought many from them during the last year. They always come within few days. They also sell guidebooks.

Robespierre

I love studying my Pocket Streets maps while planning my trips - I can't imagine doing it with paper maps! To order maps online, try

<b>http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/downloads/pocketstreets/2004/business/pocket/mapdownload/psmapsearch.aspx</b>

I've downloaded many from them during the last year (they're free). They always come within a few seconds. The (also free) software is at

<b>http://www.pocketpccity.com/software/pocketpc/Pocket-Streets-for-free-2003-11-21-ce-pocketpc.html</b>

hopingtotravel

Ohmigosh, I really started something. In my case, it's moot. I refer to myself as 'the last of the war babies' so computer literacy on my Dell at home is about all I can handle. Actually, I do use the yellow marker on the map. I also take along a magnifying glass.
St. Cirq, I'm glad to hear the grocery stores carry the maps. I'm sure I'll need one for the Dordogne. Maybe after a few days on the road, I can tell if I'll need one for the Loire Valley.
I actually do pretty well with maps, computer print-out directions, and road signs but I'm married to someone who will continue down the wrong road so far that by the time we do turn around--well you get the picture!

Robespierre

I was born in July, 1942, a month after the battle of Midway. Either one adapts to change, or one doesn't.

StCirq

If there's no reason to adapt to change, one needn't. And I don't see any good reason to run around Europe with more gadgets in my pocket just to &quot;adapt to change.&quot; I have a cell phone, I have a laptop (which I use exclusively for work and never pull out for travel purposes and never will). I'm not a Luddite. I just don't get why EVERYTHING has to be automated. What's the harm in an old-fashioned map? I love the look and feel of them. They get me excited about trips and are lovely souvenirs of bygone travels. No Ipac is ever going to be a great souvenir.

There's one good reason not to adapt to this sort of change, in my opinion. That's because such adaptation deprives me of the positive sensory input that I find valuable. I love the &quot;feel&quot; of a paper map. I hate the coldness of a screen. When I'm on vacation I'm there in part to heighten my senses, which may have been dulled in previous months by virtue of my job, which requires day-long viewing of computer screens. On a trip I relish the &quot;hands-on&quot; feeling of handling a map, reading a guidebook, talking to people, squeezing vegetables, etc. I don't want some cold metal thing spouting off trip info to me.
Oh, and call me a snob, but I think my navigational skills are better than most computers' - witness the ridiculous Norway itinerary. I've rarely found a computer map that was as good as the detailed Michelin ones. I use Mapquest a lot, for example, to get directions to locations around the DC area, and about half the time I can find an alternate route that's the same amount of time and doesn't involve using the Beltway, which Mapquest loves and I happen to hate. It's like translation - there's too much subjectivity in travel for some computer program to be able to guide me around a foreign country.
No one can convince me that any recent technology can enhance a trip of mine to Europe any better than my enormous library of books and maps. And that's my final answer.

StCirq

Actually, it's not my final answer. I just had another thought, Robespierre, and that is: if your software is so flippin' fantastic and fast,how come you never chime in on any of the complicated itinerary questions that arise on this board?

Why make me and Stu Dudley and Rex and Bobthenavigator and Maribel and others go to such lengths to define detailed itineraries when your software could do it in the blink of an eye? Surely there's a way to input people's proposed itineraries and get an INSTANT map and detailed plan for ANYTHING a traveler might want? You should be the itinerary planner for Fodors, since you've got those incredible tools right at your fingertips! Just a thought....

Are you even beginning to &quot;get&quot; the notion that software ain't the answer to everything? Human contact and contact with tangible things like books and maps actually count for something, Robes.

Robespierre

To use or not to use a computer is strictly a matter of personal preference. My only purpose here has been to answer some of the uninformed excuses that people give for not using a PC. Unless one is informed on a subject, one is not in a position to make a valid choice.

If you prefer having &quot;positive sensory input&quot; to knowing exactly where you are every second, then by all means stick with the 14th-century technology.

If you don't want to carry a PC because your job requires you to sit in front of a screen, you're different from me, because I chose my work <u>because</u> it involves sitting in front of a screen. Not wrong, just different.

I don't use the software's automatic routing function either, because I can often find a more desirable path by myself.

I don't carry a bunch of gadgets with me, because besides containing maps for every square meter of Europe, the PC is also the cell phone and music box, reading material, notebook, e-mail terminal, and itinerary.

Human contact is very important to me, as is contact with tangible things - like my computer.

Go in peace - with your maps.

ira

Hi Robe,

Not quite sure how your map system works. Is it software that you have installed that gives you a zoomable map of the whole of Europe or do you have to download from the net?