nytraveler

One of the things I have noticed among newbies or those with limited travel experience is that they have a tendency to set up itineraries - either for the entire trip or even within a city - without ever looking at a map.

Now, I know GPS exists - and can be useful when doing a car trip. (Although to tell you the truth I often find them stupid - even here in NYC they get a lot of things wrong - and if you run into a detour due to construction, accident or even bad weather - they are useless in planning a new route - since they don't spread all the options out in front of you. But in planning an itinerary - there is no substitute for a high quality detailed map (either of the region, the country or even the city).

But tIme and time again we see itineraries with the poster bouncing around in all directions, not grouping cities or towns sensibly (which does require some knowledge of train schedules and/or flight options) and not even grouping sights within a city sensibly - going from east to west to back east and then west again in one day - spending hours on public transit versus actually sightseeing.

So - PLEASE, in planning a trip get a good map, figure out the location of places you want to see - and plot them on the map. It will not only avoid a lot of time in transit versus actually seeing sights or doing activities - it will be really good for my blood pressure.

It's easy to get good quality maps at any reasonable bookseller. We use Michelin for provinces and there are many detailed city street maps for sale. If you don't want to spend the money up front you can consult online maps to get the big picture necessary for initial planning - but do need high quality paper maps for help on the ground.

StCirq

Thank You!

Pegontheroad

You are so right!

The question that keeps sloshing around in my mind lately is why so many newbies plan these impossible itineraries. A map might very well cut down the number of posts beginning with "Are we crazy....?

Any time I see that question beginning a post, I know that the answer will always be "Yes."

mamcalice

I've had exactly the same thought, Pegontheroad. They know they're crazy or they wouldn't ask. And, as for maps, how in the world can you plan a trip without a map?!

LSky

Good post nytraveler. Only we will read it though

Andrew

Before I plan a trip at all, the first thing I do is type all of the cities/towns I'm interested in into Google Maps. I stare at it for a while. What's the road travel time between cities (even if I'm taking the train or bus, it helps guestimate)? What's near what? How many days would it be, about? Maybe it makes more sense to fly into this other city instead of that one. Maybe I should add or remove something.

I wish there was a travel tool that could expand this map concept and add the ability to dig up approximate travel times by bus/train, give me average hotel rates per night, give me average airfares (based on dates I've given), etc. What if I add a night - maybe that reduces the airfare and makes it actually cheaper?

I now have to do a lot of this work manually, and it's a pain.

thursdaysd

So true, nytraveler. The next obvious missing link, of course, is a guidebook.

outwest

I use a map that I got from Rick Steves website all the time when planning a trip. It's a time and cost map for European train travel—he has the approximate time via train between most major cities in Europe (and approx. cost in US $ but I'm not so concerned about that).

I've found that sometimes cities that look close together (in my atlas) aren't necessarily conveniently connected by train. Because we always travel from place to place by train and I try to keep train trips to 4 hours or less I find it invaluable in my early planning stages.

janisj

"<i>We're doing the Tower of London, Windsor Castle, and St Paul's on the same day</i>"

GET A BLEEDIN' MAP!

michele_d

That's exactly how we planned our three month trip around Europe. Got out a really big bulletin board, European map and pushpins and let the dreaming/planning begin. Then we added and deleted and added and deleted until we came upon a reasonable itinerary. Then we posted our questions here. It is the only way to really gain perspective on the distances and locations.

That should be a per-requisite Fodor's course before you are even allowed to post a question.

Post: "Am I crazy??? I want to go to 10 countries and 47 cities in 23 days. Will this be a problem?"

Reply: "May we please see your map???"

Post: "Uh, what map...?"

Reply: "Please refer to the Fodor's Rules and return here when you have complied. Good-Bye."

AJPeabody

Just one problem: The people who know how to use a map are not posting those questions. It is not so incredible that there are people who cannot use a map. Those are the ones who want to do impossible itineraries, with 600 mile round trip daytrips and other horrors.

LSky

No one really needs to know how to read a map anymore (we are fortunate if we can but...) They can simply type their 47 cities into google and see if they can visit them on their 4 day weekend.

Google maps breaks down the times too

sundriedpachino

All that mapping, looking at train time tables,and miles on google maps takes effort!

To some people telling them to look at a map is like me suggesting to my husband to read the instructions before assembling that new shelf. Hehe we know the answer to that one! "How hard could it be?"

When I was a kid, I liked to study maps and dream about visiting those places and was especially enthralled with that boot shaped country. This October, I am finally going to get to the tip of the heel.

I can't imagine planning a trip without looking at a map. It's where the dreaming begins.

Libretto

Oh thank you...this is a big peeve of mine.

It isn't only Europe, though. I remember some of my DIL's American relatives seriously asking what the trains were like between New Zealand and Australia!

kja

Well said, nytraveler!

But OMG, what a step onto a slippery slope you propose!
If a map is a good idea, then what about a guide book?
Or (gasp) even more than 1 guidebook?
Or searching this board for relevant topics?
Or searching the internet for critical and easily accessed information?
Or figuring out what one wants to do once one gets to any of those places?
Or....

BTW: I use multiple guidebooks for every trip. One of the things I love about the Rough Guide series is the information it provides about public transportation options for getting from one place to another. The info is, of course, subject to change, but for those seeking to travel by public transportation, it's a great starting point. Pull out a map, add the info one gets from the Rough Guide, and one can begin to identify possible and impossible options. Emphasis on "begin"

To all who respond to questions posted on this board, whether you ignore some questions or not, kudos for sharing your time and knowledge and experience, whether in response to the mapless or others. What a gift!

Rubicund

We're flying into Edinburg and plan to have lunch in Inverness. Our hotel for that night is in Padstow and we'd like to see Tower Bridge. Is this doable?

hetismij2

Having bought the map make sure you understand the scale of it!
No use buying a small scale map and still thinking a day trip to Rome is possible from Paris - they look so close after all.

bobthenavigator

Amen !

Nikki

My children do not look at maps. Nobody they know looks at maps. Is anybody posting on this thread is under forty years old? Fifty?

Preaching to the choir.

MaineGG

>Post: What map?

Sadly, I know people who would probably post: What's a map?

Here in the US, I attribute some of the lack of experience with maps to the almost total absence of traditional geography study in our schools.

>If a map is a good idea, then what about a guide book?

Again, no familiarity for many with the concept. There's a growing reliance on the internet for many who learned that their laptops in the classroom were the source of every bit of information they need.

Just a little rant today from this hopelessly old-fashioned book and map lover.