OK. London Tower is in but not on the day of arrival. It seems we need at least 2-3 hours there and we probably won't make to our hotel until 2PM. Too rushed.

Looks like Scotland is probably out.

oh one more thing get a britrail pass. Best investment for getting around.

http://www.britrail.com/?gclid=CIn53...FQyPgwodD1T_Rg

Actually I don't think you need a Britrail pass for this trip. It sounds like the only train trip you'll be taking is to Oxford, and those tickets are not expensive.

.....From Covent Garden you could walk over to Trafalgar, down to Westminster, up and arouind to Buckingham........

It is Trafalgar Square and Buckingham Palace.
In London, you really need to be particular about "Street", "road" "square" etc.
I can't imagine anyone directing you to Trafalgar, but if you asked how to get to Buckingham, they might well advise you to take a train.
There was a cautionary tale on this forum of a poor soul who was told to go to Ipswich from Liverpool Street Station and he actually ended up in Liverpool.

"<i>oh one more thing get a britrail pass. Best investment for getting around.</i>"

That is only true for <i>some</i> folks on lengthy trips around the UK. Not for someone w/ 4 days in London before going on a guided coach tour.

You absolutely, definitely, 100% (is that clear enough ) DO NOT want/need a Britrail Pass. Trust us on that one. . . .

"<i>London Tower is in but not on the day of arrival. It seems we need at least 2-3 hours there and we probably won't make to our hotel until 2PM. Too rushed.</i>"

You are a quick learner! Definitely go to the Tower of London -- but go at opening time on one of your other days in the city

And if you decide to keep Oxford in your plan you might look at taking a coach instead of train; reasonable prices, pay as you board, drops off in middle of town, a little closer to "stuff" than the train station. Google Oxfordtube or OxfordEspress to see this option.

Texasbookworm,

I need to cut things but I'm definitely keeping Oxford. Will look into bus options. How much time should I budget for Oxford? Half a day or a whole day?

All day!

We did the HOHO bus our first day in London; with only 2 1/2 days there, it was a good way for us to get a look at some of the places we wouldn't have time to explore in greater depth. We did get pretty sleepy, though, and had to get off at least once to walk around.

I agree that if you're doing the other bus tour, though, that you don't need to do the HOHO.

Lee Ann

There is so much to see and do in London, you might have a better time if you defer the trip to Edinburgh, and then spend a bit more time in Scotland once you're there. That said, the coach service to Oxford runs like a suburban bus, cheap and frequent, but that's really a full day to do Oxford justice. (And there's always just a risk of something going wrong in inter-city travel: I've been delayed and rerouted on the train to Edinburgh and the coach to Oxford over the years.)

If you're confident about using public transport -- or just asking the station staff what to do -- my cousin and I had a great afternoon taking the Docklands Light Railway (DLR) to Greenwich -- through the East End, by the Hawksmoor church of St. Anne Limehouse, right through the vast new office buildings in Docklands, and under the Thames to Cutty Sark station. That ship is still under conservation, but there's enough to see in Greenwich -- the old naval college with its chapel and painted hall, the Queen's House and Maritime Museum, the Observatory and prime meridian, the covered market (Wed-Sun), another Hawksmoor church. You can then take a river boat from Greenwich Pier back to London -- if you get off at Bankside Pier, you can look in at the Globe Theatre and Tate Modern art gallery (where the spectacular building is half the show), and then walk over the Millennium Bridge to St. Paul's Cathedral. If you time it right, you can attend evensong there -- it's a lovely service, and you won't be charged admission. From there, the No. 15 will take you down Fleet Street to the Law Courts, the Strand, Trafalgar Square, Regent Street, Oxford Circus and Marble Arch. Or you could get off on the Strand and wander north through Covent Garden, perhaps to Chinatown. That would take in a lot of London on a single afternoon for the price of a Travelcard and a boat ticket; the Transport for London Web site has a good journey planner.

If you like food markets, the one around Borough Station at the foot of London Bridge is quite impressive (Thurs to Sat, late morning to late afternoon), with plenty of treats to eat on the spot or make a picnic supper.

Now I'm getting flashbacks from the trip to Edinburgh when the train before ours was cancelled (i.e. two trains' worth of people on one, in high summer, and severe delays all the way), and then there were cows on the line in Northumberland on the way back. Don't risk a daytrip to Scotland when there's so much to do in London.

Agree with NOT taking the Red bus on arrival day. You WILL fall asleep. I know. ( and it was the same schedule) Walk walk walk. I think it's a useful tool to help you become familiar with London, though. But it sounds redundant if you already have a tour planned.

Others have already given great advice on what to see and do. And there is never enough time. I've been several times and still haven't seen it.

I think you would be very disappointed if you went to Edinburgh. You"ll lose time in London, which you need and you will regret having such a short stay in Edinburgh. IMO, Edinburgh is not a day trip destination.

Will echo some things already said here, but why not:

--London is huge with a staggering number of great attractions. I'd definitely save Edinburgh for another occasion (haven't been to Edinburgh, but if you're looking for a day trip, you'll likely be much better off with a destination closer in such as Bath, Oxford, Cambridge, Stratford-on-Avon, Windsor, etc.)

--getting to the Tower of London when it opens is a great idea. First thing, head for the crown jewels, as early on there won't be many people there, but as the day goes on, the waits can be very long. I also very much liked the Yeoman Warders tour offered.

--plan to spend a full day in Oxford. Note that the different colleges have unreliable hours, though. Any of them can close last-minute with no warning. And during certain times of the year, all of them are closed (usually around exams and such). Check online for schedules, consider calling ahead, and cross your fingers even if things look like they're a go. That's pretty much true for Cambridge as well. Taking a bus rather than the train to either city is wise, as in my experience, the terminal for the bus was closer to the city center and the buses ran more often.

--do not count on being "sightseeing ready" until several hours after your flight arrives. Expect a very long line at customs, a lengthy tube or cab ride into London from the airport, at least a little time to drop your bags off and/or check in, and likely some travel time between where you're staying and your first sightseeing destination.

Thank you everyone. Great advice!

I have revised the itinerary

1. Edinburgh is out
2. Oxford trip all day
3. I'll pick two major sights per day in London, and do some walking around/random sightseeing around those sights.

So right now the plan looks this:

Tuesday: day of arrival, 11AM at Heathrow. WALK WALK WALK (need to figure out where - depending on the hotel area of choice)

Wednesday: all day in London. Tower of London. Need to select a 2nd major sight.

Thursday: Evan Evans tour Windsor-Stonehenge-Bath

Friday: Oxford on our own all day. Need to find something to do in the evening once we return to London.

Saturday: organized tour starts - lots of drive-bys. St. Paul is included as a visit not a drive-by. Free time in the PM. Can selecte another major sight.

Does the itinerary look less rushed? One more thing, would like to check out Topshop (not available in CA) so we need to squeeze that in if possible

That's about 1.5 to 2 days in London. Not getting the need to go to Oxford when there is so much you could see that you won't in London.

Wikideity says there's a topshop on Regent Street. There's just about every other kind of retail on Regent Street too.

Your itinerary is less packed, yes. Two sights per day is a good goal, I think.

You could shop on your arrival day - builds in the "walk walk walk" pretty easily! There are lots of branches around, but if you're interested in more shopping, Oxford Street (between Tottenham Court and Marble Arch) and Covent Garden are the most popular areas for high street stores. You'll find Topshop, Next, H&M, Dorothy Perkins, lots of places.

Wednesday: all day in London. Tower of London. Need to select a 2nd major sight.
__________________________________________________ ___________

Much better itinerary.

The one suggestion I have is- on Wednesday, you might enjoy taking the Thames River hop on and off cruise to Greenwich Pier. You can jump off at London Tower first thing in the am, then head to Greenwich Pier afterward. You'll also have a different perspective of London being on the river.

I am sure you will get a lot of wonderful suggestions on how to spend your time in London. You can't go wrong.


http://www.citycruises.com/riverred.htm

One other thought- depending on where you are staying, perhaps on arrival day you might enjoy walking over to the London Eye. The ride will give a nice introduction to London without falling asleep.

Maybe the best plan is to gather the info, and wait till you get there. If tired, if London appeals more to you, you stay in the city.

Something tells me you could fill your days in London

Somtimes less...is more. Trying to fit everything in...lessens the experience.

If you're looking for other ways to fill your London-based days on your latest itinerary, there are several options:

--there are scads of wonderful museums, and several have evening hours on certain days, including (last I knew, anyway) the Victoria and Albert, British Museum, the two Tates, and the National Portrait Gallery. That's usually only true one or two days a week, though -- check museum hours online.

--not all the museums in London are art or artifact based, either -- some are historic or scientific in nature. The Churchill Museum and Cabinet War Rooms are excellent if this sort of thing interests you. Haven't been to the Imperial War Museum or the Natural History Museum, but these are two other possibilities.

--I would definitely consider Westminster Abbey a must, and luckily some of the other attractions in the general vicinity (such as 10 Downing Street and Buckingham Palace) are simply walk-bys. The Parliament Building can also be a simple walk-by -- or if they're in session, the House of Lords and House of Commons are usually open well into the evening, and you can go through security and see one or both (note that the Lords chamber is more ornate but the debating is likely to be duller, while the reverse is true at the Commons chamber).

In short, there are a lot of good options available. Would recommend looking through a good guidebook on the city for ideas.

I have a good idea for your first London - lots of walking and will keep you awake. After you check in to your hotel, take the tube to St Pauls, walk around a bit tour the cathedral and then walk across the Millenium Bridge to The Tate Modern, (skip it since you're not into museums) but turn right across the bridge and walk along the Thames to the London Eye. Lot's of interesting shopping along this walk as well as Buskers and street food. Take a ride on the Eye and get a birds eye view of the city and the sights. Have a nice dinner and then go back to your hotel and get some rest, and start the next day fresh.