greg

>>> 12/18 Florence

12/18 is Monday. Uffizi and Accedemina are closed. Many others are open, however
https://www.visitflorence.com/floren...n-mondays.html

BlueHorizon

Bologna looks appealing as well. But yes would subtract from time
in Venice/Rome.

Greg, thanks for the observation re: the museums. Would be a shame not to see David.

BlueHorizon

ok...have all of our accommodations booked in Florence, Venice and Rome.

Couple more questions on trains and attractions.

- PalenQ suggested using trenitalia or italotreno to book train tickets.
Is there any advantage to either? Or do they both book the Frecce trains?
Is it recommended to buy in advance? I'm not concerned about getting
a discount, just want to be sure of available seats. I think the only train it wouldn't make sense to buy in advance is train from Rome to Florence after we first arrive.
If you miss a train can you use premium tickets for the next train?
What is the advantage of business class over premium?

Attractions in Florence in Rome.
I bought tickets for the earliest entrance on 12/19 Tuesday for
the Accademia. Before we train to Venice.
I'll reserve a time to climb the Duomo.

In Rome, other than the Vatican Museum and Borghese, should any sites be reserved? And would it be better advised to visit the vatican Museum first thing
in the morning on Friday the 22nd, or later afternoon on the 21st or 22nd?
Bvlenci suggested going in the afternoon. Anyone recommend the tour?
Lastly has anyone done the Colosseum/Forum/Palatine Hill tour?

Thanks

5alive

Hey I went to Rome at Christmas with kids. It's been over 10 years but the Italians are pretty traditional, so I suspect things haven't changed much. Feel free to click on my name and find my trip report.

A few thoughts:
1. Starting December 24, each year one-half of Rome taxi drivers are on holiday. This is an organized tradition in Rome. Taxi lines were long. And calling a cab was useless. They just didn't come. So use the buses, subway or walk. Also, if you go out to dinner, ask your waiter to order you a cab. And I would tip him for it.

Be sure to visit the annual creche art show, with many artists' interpretation of the Nativity Scene. I believe we saw this at St Maria del Popolo.

Since you are getting an apartment, there are some Christmas treats in the grocery stores you might try. The Christmas cakes are one example. They are in these tall boxes.

Learn ahead of time how to use a Bialetti (Moka pot) to make coffee, if you like coffee.

bvlenci

If I were going to Rome with two teenaged kids, I think I'd skip the Borghese Gallery unless you have a big Bernini fan in your group. There are plenty of other museums in Rome that would probably appeal more to kids, and they don't have to be reserved. I find that when traveling with kids, the fewer appointments cast in stone, the better. Some museums that have appealed to teens in my family: the Doria Pamphilj Gallery; Palazzo Massimo alle Terme; the Barberini Gallery; and the Leonardo da Vinci museum in Piazza del Popolo.

I took my 12-year-old granddaughter to the Vatican Museums for the first time this year. (I deliberately didn't take a tour.) Our first stop was the Egyptian Collection, which she absolutely loved. She said, "Wow, I could spend two weeks in here!" She liked it more than the Sistine Chapel. Some tours don't even visit the Egyptian Collection, and none spend very much time there.

Teens in general don't like regimentation. Just strolling around some of the interesting neighbourhoods, they'll see things they want to stop and explore. On a tour, they have to keep up with the group. If you take them on a tour of a museum or archaeological site, they may resent having to spend five minutes listening to a spiel about something the experts think is important, and not having time to stop and investigate something that intrigues <b> them</b>.

PalenQ

Kids my really like the Catacombs, just south of Rome along the old Via Appia.

5alive

Bvlenchi gives wise advice about teens. I think you said you would be staying in Campo. It might be fun for them to go out exploring without you for a few hours on Christmas or the day after. They will remember that freedom. Send them with both a phone and a small map; the map is in case they decide to get help from an Italian. Circle your apartment.

Or, one thing that appears to be open on Christmas and the day after is the Jewish Musuem. They also have daily tours of the neighborhood in English for a very modest price.

https://www.museoebraico.roma.it/en/opening-hours/

Another option for the day of the closures around Christmas is to climb Aventine Hill for the views. We didn't do it on our Christmas trip because it was raining too hard. But had it been clear and cold like other days of our trip, I think it would have been fun.

Also I would vote for Ostia... It's huge and very cool to explore. Nothing is roped off like Pompeii. You can climb to the top of some of the first buildings to survey the scene. At one point, we were all walking across this board to get to one of the buildings... Bring the Rick Steves Rome guide (the best I found on my two visits). The merchant guilds were something I didn't find on my first trip but did because of his guide.

PalenQ

Sacrilege maybe but American teens may love a sojourn to the fancy McDonalds by the Spanish Steps - has Italian foods too last I knew but a taste of home may be appreciated?

BlueHorizon

5alive...thanks! I'll check out your report.
Like the suggestions for Christmas day.

bvlenci....good advice again. We'll look into those museums.
Booked a Vatican ticket for afternoon of the 21st.

PalenQ...yes definitely will visit the Catacombs!

massimop

Although I am not personally a Bernini (or Michelangelo!) fan, I think teens might find more to relate to in the Borghese Gallery's large collected of Bernini's highly animated action-filled sculptures, filled with human drama and show-off skill with stone, as opposed to 90 percent of the other religious art in Rome. In addition, the Borghese Gallery is compact, in a pleasant setting, and unlike most other Italian museums to that require timed-entry tickets bought in advance, the museum keeps stricter limits on admissions and therefore the museum doesn't pack people in like sardines. It's a much more pleasant experience. The most interesting art is on the 1st floor, so it's possible to visit the museum and leave in 45 minutes.

I really hope your kids can go 9 days without eating in McDonald's and even more so that McDonald's isn't the "taste of home" for them. Even if your kids want hamburgers instead of local fare, hamburgers are now very trendy throughout Italy, but in particular in Florence and Rome, and they are made fresh with quality ingredients.

PalenQ

I really hope your kids can go 9 days without eating in McDonald's and even more so that McDonald's isn't the "taste of home" for them.>

snobbism at its greatest - that McDonalds is very different from those at home - and does not hurt to let kids, if they want, have a taste of home.

massimop

There is nothing snobby about pointing out to a fellow traveler that if they or thier kids want American food in Rome, there are much better choices than junk from McDonalds -- which mass produces unhealthy junk that is bad for kids to eat. "A taste of home" implies that these kids are eating McDonald's on a regular basis. I hope not -- that is hardly snobby to care about good nutrition for kids -- and if they are, 9 days without it and with better food instead would be a beneficial break.

vincenzo32951

>> that is hardly snobby to care about good nutrition for kids<<

Unless one considers you should MYOFB about other people's kids eat.

PalenQ

McDonalds foods are no worse I'd think than most pizzas in Italy I'd think.

Try to put yourself into mind of American teens.

BlueHorizon

5Alive, looked for you trip report but could not find it. Still archived?

massimop

McDonald's "food" is far worse than 99 percent of pizza in Italy. That is a fact, not an opinion or guess. It's almost a tragedy that anyone doesn't know that, especially if they are giving advice about where to take kids to eat in Italy.

I personally know quite a few American teenagers and have traveled with them in Italy. They don't identify McDonald's as a "taste of home". That's a demeaning stereotype to them and their parents.

Americans traveling to Italy with or without teens can probably handle the news that if you eat crap in front of a local or order incorrect combinations of food in a restaurant, the locals will let you know and guide you to something better.

I can just imagine the uproar had BlueHorizons or any American started a thread asking: "Help==Where can I find McDonald's in Europe? Traveling with teens"

Heard there is going to be ignore button. Can't wait. I'll be clicking it for days.

Dayle

Yes, the ignore button will be a very welcome addition massimop, zeppole, sandralist.

5alive

Blue Horizon...here is my report.

https://www.fodors.com/community/eur...-with-kids.cfm

vincenzo32951

>>Americans traveling to Italy with or without teens can probably handle the news that if you eat crap in front of a local or order incorrect combinations of food in a restaurant, the locals will let you know and guide you to something better. <<

I can handle the news. I also can handle telling a local to take a hike when remarking on my eating habits.

PalenQ

especially if they are giving advice about where to take kids to eat in Italy.>

You are spouting nonsense - McDonalds in Italy at least that one has a real Italian look and flare -salad bars - Italian foods and healthy things like frozen yoghurt - why throw baby out with bathwater.

And I was only stating a possibility for yes the weird American teens who may like to see what an Italian McDonalds looks like not recommending five Big Macs.

Your statement about pizza all being more healthy than McDonalds food is hogwash - pizza and its ingrdients are inherently as unhealthy as any Big Mac = lots of fat and cheese and meat - not healthy.

<I can handle the news. I also can handle telling a local to take a hike when remarking on my eating habits.>

Not even a local but an American I believe who thinks they know everything about Italy.