musicking

Guys

I have a planned a trip to Italy, i have made my flight arrangements reaching ROME on 25th Dec 2016 and return back to USA 3rd Jan 2017 from Venice.

We are a family of 4 (2 A, 2 Young Kids).

My preferences are ROME, VENICE and Florence (Just for PISA).

Being there in Dec, what are the places i should visit near ROME and VENICE. I am looking for day trips from ROME and VENICE.

Here is my plan:

25 to 29 (ROME)
30 (FLORENCE)
31 TO 3 (VENICE)

Need some help in organizing my trip, i am little confused on possible day trips from Rome and Venice.

Thanks

MK

PalenQ

You are going by train, right? Cars are useless in all those cities - especially Venice!

Rather than stay in Florence why not take the train from Rome direct to Pisa - stay there one night - do the Tower and take a train to Venice. www.trenitalia.com has all the schedules - booking way early - ASAP - maybe NOW will save tons of money but it will give you seats on a specific train on a specific date and no changes allowed - fine for you just don't miss the train.

For lots of train info for Italy check www.seat61.com -great info on discounted tickets; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com. First class is also discounted and may not cost much more at times than the cheapest 2nd class ticket and if so go for it - significant differences especially for folks with 'too much baggage'! You are not traveling enough to even consider the Italy Eurailpass.

I would stay in those cities as you do not have that much time in either Rome or Venice if you count days of arrival, departure and travel time in between.

But in Rome a short half-day trip could go to nearby Ostia Antica, Rome's ancient port and an archaeological site kind of like Pompeii except without all the mobs of tourists - short metro ride from Rome itself(Pompeii itself is 3-4 hours each way by train from Rome):

https://www.google.com/search?q=osti...w=1920&bih=950

annhig

great advice from Pal, IMO.

I agree that with only 10 days and young kids in tow, you only want 2 main bases with the one night in Pisa for seeing the sights of the Campo Dei Miracoli [the Leaning Tower etc] which are particularly lovely at night when all the hawkers and tourists have gone home and they are beautifully illuminated.

A half-day trip to Ostia is probably as much as you will be able to manage in Rome, remembering that daylight will be pretty short at that time of year and in Venice, just seeing the main sights will take you all the time you've got when you take into account the fact that you have children with you.

I also agree that you should book your train tickets now.

Jean

Random comments...

I would play the day trips from Rome and Venice by ear. Agreeing with annhig, you may find you can't see all you want to see in either city in the time you'll have, esp. if the weather isn't great. If the kiddies have trouble with the time change, you may have to pull back on your plans for the first day or two.

I would make reservations for dinner on Christmas Day before you leave home.

Depending on the ages of your children, they may not find Ostia Antica very interesting. There is also a bit of a walk from the metro stop to the sight. Personally, I wouldn't consider it a half-day excursion but more like 5-6 hours. Do some research before you decide and definitely don't go if it's raining.

http://www.ostia-antica.org/touristguide.pdf

In case you haven't already looked up train travel times, Rome to Pisa and Pisa to Venice are both about 3 hours. There are a few options for both journeys that involve no change of trains which would be easier with small children but which may not be at the best times for your plans.

You need timed reservations in advance to climb the Leaning Tower. Minimum age to climb is 8. If it's raining, I wouldn't climb as the marble gets very slippery.

http://www.opapisa.it/en/

It will be dark by 5:00p in Rome and shortly after 4:30p in Venice.

musicking

thanks Guys .... we my kids are young enough (12 and 16) and interested to visit historic sights

I got the idea by now and booking the trains.

I plan to visit Pompeii as a day trip, i was thinking of visiting Capri but heard December is no fun since most things are closed. Other days i would visit Rome, vatican etc.

will update you on my final plans ..

Thanks

annhig

OK - helpful now to have the ages of your kids, I think that we had all assumed that they were younger.

However, don't underestimate the time that it will take to get around these cities, or forget that you/they will need to eat, [and you won't be picnicking in December] use the loo [which means finding one] have some down time, etc. etc.

your kids are old enough to do the Leaning Tower I think but think carefully about whether you want to spend the time required to get to Pompeii, when Ostia is just on your doorstep. [and I've done it easily in 3 hours with a group of teenagers who were like herding cats, so with two of them it should be a doddle]

<<Other days i would visit Rome, vatican etc.>>

I'm not sure what you mean by this - surely the plan is to stay IN Rome? to see only the main sights takes a few days - one for the Colosseum and Forum [where the money spent on a guide is money well spent, IMO], and then possibly the Capitoline museums if time, one on St Peter's, and the Vatican [in truth part of Rome geographically, if not politically] another on exploring places like Trastevere, the Ghetto, Monti, perhaps a visit to the Borghese Gallery -

Ant why not ask the kids to look at a guide book and see what they would like to do? for much of the time ours just liked the excitement of being in Rome and exploring whatever part of it we were in - you will never lack something to look at! And the rest of the time they were eating - the food is great.

PalenQ

Rome to Naples Centrale - then take CircumVesuviana commuter train right to the Pompeii ruins - Pompeii Scavi station right at entrance. 3 hours would be a minimum- book your Rome to Naples train early ASAP at www.trenitalia.com - buy the CircumVesuviana tickets once in Naples (not part of Trentialia so can't buy thru them) - they cost just a few euros -it's like a metro - no need to book in advance and may not be possible - can't book seats anyway as it's like a metro.

The train ride along the slopes of Mt Vesuvius is cool.

bvlenci

You have only four days in Rome, and you really need three to get even a brief glimpse of the city. I agree with Ann that it would be better to visit Ostia Antica instead of Pompeii.

http://ostia-antica.org

If you buy train tickets in advance, and if it's pouring rain (always a risk in late December) the day you planned to visit Pompeii, the trip will be a bust. Plus, as Ann says, the daylight hours are very short at that time of year. The sun sets at around 4:30, and it's full dark at 5.

If you really want a day trip, Orvieto is a popular trip. The kids might enjoy the Underground Orvieto tour, and St. Patrick's Well (Pozzo di San Patrizio) is fascinating, with its double helix staircase to the bottom, so that mules could haul water to the surface without getting distracted by their brother mules going in the other direction. And the funicular railway that takes you up to the town from the station should be fun.

The 26th is a national holiday (St. Stephen's Day) and it's also a Monday this year (the usual museum closing day) so check openings. Some museums may have special openings on the 26th, even though it's a Monday, because that's a very popular week for family vacations. The Vatican Museums (including the Sistine Chapel) will definitely be closed on both the 25th and the 26th, because they're religious holidays, and it will be very crowded on the 27th because of the backlog.

Verona is a nice day trip from Venice, but consider that you have only two full days there, and one of them (the 1st) is a holiday, when most things are closed. You probably will have to get a godawful early flight on the 3rd, so you wouldn't want to do a tiring trip the day before.

I actually think you'd better stay in Florence the day you visit the Tower of Pisa. It would put you that much closer to Venice the next morning, and you wouldn't have to change trains with your luggage. Plus you could get a quick look at Florence, just a walk around, Piazza della Signoria, and the Ponte Vecchio. I recommend a quick visit to the Basilica of Santa Maria Novella, right by the train station. It has a beautiful chapel affrescoed by the Ghirlandaio workshop, when a teenaged Michelangelo was an apprentice there. It's thought he painted one of the figures in the foreground. There's a lot of other great masterworks in the church, and it also has a beautiful cloister. For some reason, few tourists visit this beautiful church.

PalenQ

.I agree with bvlenci on staying in Florence -does put you closer to Venice the next day by about an hour and just to see Florence for a few hours is a treat - the Ponte Vecchio- don't need to go to any of its famous museums - get a hotel by the train station - I always do- there are many including some bed-and-breakfasts to facilitate your going to Pisa that day by train.

Take a train to Pisa Centrale then a train to Pisa S Rossore if convenient timing as that station is a short walk from the Leaning Tower- Centrale a long walk but can of course take buses or cabs.

Pisa Centrale has luggage storage is opting to do Rome to Pisa then to Florence (which is probably the fastest way to Venice from Florence no doubt).

If staying in Florence you could spend half the next day seeing say the Uffizi, one of the world's most famous art museums- Florence SMN station - the main one - has luggage storage too.

Iahawk

We spent almost 2 weeks in Rome over the Christmas holidays in 2013-14. Agree you should make dinner reservations now for Christmas Day. We ate at either Tempo Perso, La Fortunato or Tempo Bacco (cannot remember which one) You'll need to check and see what is open (and we were surprised that so many were..as well as shopping!). Depending on where you'll be for New Years Eve, make those now as well. Our sons were a bit older than your children but it was our third trip to Rome. I would look into booking a walking tour (we used Guia Bargili) for the Vatican Museum assuming that it on your must see/do list along with St Peters. If you are interested and they are still on display, walk into the various small churches as well as the major sites for their presecpi (nativity scenes). Really unique and beautiful. Side trips - we did Ostia as mentioned above and Anzio (the D-Day of Italy). Take your pick: Colosseum, St Peter's, Vatican Museum, Forum (really...get a guide for that one!), Pantheon, Villa Borghese (tickets are required), Catacombs....as I said, we spent two weeks on our third trip and still feel like there are things we've missed!

On one trip, we rented a car in Rome and drove to Florence via Pisa - easy to do and you can 'do ' Pisa in a half day.

Loved Florence; stayed at Accademia hotel. Smallish, funky layout and close to everything (2 blocks from the main train station and hertz location). Uffizi is fantastic; book your tickets now for L'Accademia and David or you could be standing in a very long line. So, for Florence, I'd see Uffizi, David, Pitti Palace, Cathedral (climb to the top).

In Venice....St Marks, Doge Palace, Bridge of Sighs, Ghetto, St Maria Salute, Harry's Bar, Grand Canal, Rialto Bridge, Accademia (art museum) and Guggenheim (if you like contemporary art) are favorites of ours. I'd skip the tours to buy glass - maybe if you had more time but honestly, its an add on not a must see in my book.

Weather will be somewhat warmer in Rome than Florence or Venice that time of year. We had zero rain which was wonderful - lightweight quilted jacket with turtleneck sweaters was warm enough.

There will be Christmas Markets in those cities as well - hopefully,, they will still be open (Piazza Navona in Rome for sure).

enjoy!!

suze

With such very short stays in each city, I wouldn't plan any "day trips" myself.

bvlenci

With such a short time in Florence, I wouldn't recommend the Uffizi. It's a huge museum, and justifiably famous, but it's enjoyable mostly for people who have a serious interest in Italian Renaissance art. Many of the paintings were originally in churches, so there is a heavy religious component.

On a short visit, and if you want to see some Renaissance art, it's best to pick out a few of the museum/churches that still have their art displayed in its original setting. Some of the best are San Marco, Santa Maria del Carmine, Santa Maria Novella, Santa Trinità, the Battistero del Duomo, Orsanmichele, and I'm sure I've forgotten a few.

You wouldn't have time for many of these, but I would definitely visit Santa Maria Novella, because it's so near the train station. If I had to choose just one more, it would be a toss-up between San Marco and Santa Maria del Carmine.

If you really want to visit a museum, I would suggest the Museum of the Duomo, which has much of the art that used to be in the Duomo, and also very interesting exhibits about the construction of the Duomo, and its immense dome.

PalenQ

I love just wandering around the Duomo-Uffizi-Ponte Vecchio area - all largely a car-free pedestrian area. Check out the copy of The David there (original in a museum).

That would be my number one suggestion to do with just a few hours. And go into the Duomo - the one single edifice we learnt in art history that launched the Renaissance - its massive dome made possible only by new architectural style that allowed it to not fall down.

bvlenci

Most of the art that was once in the Duomo is now in the Museum dell'Opera del Duomo. I would certainly go into the Baptistery, right in front of the Duomo, which is older than the Duomo and has wonderful medieval golden mosaics in the dome. The inside of the Duomo was a bit of a letdown to me after seeing the outside, and there's often a long queue to get in.

By the way, in the Duomo Museum, I learned that the facade of the Duomo is less than 200 years old. The Duomo museum has recently been reopened after a complete renovation and reorganization. It's a very interesting museum, with some great works of art, and a lot of historical exhibits. One of my favorite works is Donatello's Mary Magdalene; I've gone to the Museum several times just to see it again.

I was there last November, shortly after it reopened. The new space is very impressive from an architectural point of view, but there were still a few things that needed work, in my opinion. For instance, many of the descriptions were engraved in metal on the walls, and were almost impossible to read if the light struck the metal. However, they have much more on display than they used to. The old facade featured many medieval statues, some now lost. They have a life-size reconstruction of the old facade, with the remaining statues in their correct places, and drawings of the ones that are missing.

The original of Michelangelo's David is in the Accademia. I recently read an article by an Italian art critic, who said what I've always said, which is that a non-expert couldn't tell the difference between the reproduction in Piazza della Signoria and the original in the Accademia. Yet the collective opinion is that you absolutely must visit the Accademia to see the original of the David.

On the other hand, there is always a large crowd around the replica of Ghiberti's bronze door on the Baptistery, known as the "Gates of Paradise". (Michelangelo gave them that name.) The original, recently restored, is in the Museum of the Duomo, and in this case, the original is clearly better than the copy, even to the average observer. I never hear anyone say you must visit the Museum of the Duomo to see the original of the Gates of Paradise. Furthermore, there's not much else worth seeing in the Accademia once you've seen David, whereas there's a wealth of other things to see in the Museum of the Duomo.

With the reopening of the museum, there is now a single ticket (€15) to visit the Duomo, the Museum, the Baptistery, the Dome, the Bell Tower, and the Crypt. You couldn't possibly visit all of these in one day, but the ticket is good for 48 hours after your first visit. The Dome is also worth visiting, especially if you've read the book about its construction, <i>Brunelleschi's Dome</i>, by Ross King. If you have to choose what to see, I'd visit the Baptistery, the Museum, and the Dome. If there's not a long queue, you should surely visit the Duomo, but if time is short, that wouldn't be my first choice. I've never visited the Bell Tower or the Crypt.

annhig

Excellent information about Florence, BVL, and you make some very good points about the differing attitudes to different works of art. My only disagreement would be about the Bell tower - you might not enjoy it, but kids certainly do and if I were in Florence with young ones, it would be on my list.

topeater

I agree with suze, you really don't have anytime to do other trips, there is just too much to see in each city and your time is so short. Remember, the first day is usually kind of a loss as you are getting over jet lag, so you really only have 3 days in Rome.

With such a short period (plus it will be dark early), I would look at Walks of Italy and decide what you want to see. They will take care of everything which makes the best use of your valuable time. The tours are very small and each person has a headset, so you can look at different things while hearing the commentary instead of keeping next to the guide hoping to hear what they are saying.

We also did a day tour in Florence covering The Accademia Gallery where David is located and the Uffizi in the afternoon. It was a great tour and I learned so much even through I had done both of them on my own years ago.

Have a good trip and holiday!

musicking

thank you all for your prompt suggestions and recommendations i really appreciate your efforts.

At this time i have a small question:

our plan to visit Florence or PISA is to visit the 'Leaning Tower of Pisa', is it worth to stop at Florence or PISA and store the luggage at the station and then after 4-5 hours proceed to Venice.

Do we have a luggage storage facility on PISA station or Florence Station?

Any suggestions?


Thanks

Jean

There is baggage storage. Only you can decide between a stop in Pisa or a stop in Florence. I'll just point out that you'd have more time in Florence than you would in Pisa. Then again, there's more to see in Florence.

Rome to Pisa is just under 3 hours if you leave at 7:00a, but this does not include time to store luggage, walk to/from the Leaning Tower, retrieve luggage, etc. Rome to Florence is 90 minutes not counting time to store and retrieve luggage. Sightseeing in Florence begins right outside the train station, and the Duomo is about 10 minutes' walk. Pisa to Venice is 3.5+ hours not including time to reach your hotel. Florence to Venice is 2+ hours.

Whichever you decide, make reservations for anything you want to see that offers them. If you want to climb the Leaning Tower, timed reservations are mandatory.

bvlenci

There is a luggage deposit at Pisa Centrale station and at Florence Santa Maria Novella station. If you just want to see the Leaning Tower, and nothing at all in Florence, you'd be better just to leave the luggage in Pisa and leave for Venice after you've seen the Tower. You may have to change trains in Florence to get to Pisa, though. There are some direct trains to Pisa from Rome, but they're not high-speed trains, so it's usually faster to make a detour through Florence.

PalenQ

There are some direct trains to Pisa from Rome, but they're not high-speed trains, so it's usually faster to make a detour through Florence.>

But the direct coastal route is more scenic than the high-speed route via Florence and you need not change - all in all I think it would be about the same total transit time -given the time for changing in Florence- a hectic busy station IME.