thursdaysd

"Used car salesmen"??? Carpet salesmen, oh yes! But I've never seen a used car salesman in Istanbul. And I'd take Istanbul over Rome, much more interesting.

lauren_s_kahn

I found Turkey to be absolutely riveting and would recommend that you go there:

http://altecockertravels.weebly.com/...ange-ever.html

http://altecockertravels.weebly.com/...th-photos.html

http://altecockertravels.weebly.com/...th-photos.html

http://altecockertravels.weebly.com/...s-islands.html

While I am shamelessly shilling for my own website above, I would be remiss if I did not mention turkeytravelplanner.com. That site is the best online site for travel to Turkey and I used it heavily in planning my trip.

PegS

We were in Istanbul a month ago and noticed gay couples. We also know two gay couples who regularly go to Istanbul (one half of one of those couples goes there at least once a year for business) and have always had a grand time.

LucieV

By 'used car salesmen', thursdays, I meant the vibes of the place. Just my opinion/impression, of course. And, as I said, I am well-aware that I am in the minority (a very small minority at that) re: Istanbul.

I probably shouldn't even offer my opinion, but I kinda wish that when I had been doing my research about Istanbul, I had read at least one comment from somebody who didn't go gaga over the place. Then maybe my disappointment would not have been so profound -- and I wouldn't have felt so guilty about not being one of the fans!

thursdaysd

Lucie - well, of course, it's good that we don't all like the same places. And it's often subjective, or just a gut reaction. I love Lisbon, but don't care for Madrid, but I know that's just how I react to them. Is that why you don't like Istanbul, or is there something tangible? (I do agree that the sales pressure is annoying, but it's fairly localized.)

LucieV

"Tangible"? Not sure what you mean, thursdays. All I know is that both times I visited (1977 and 2012), I just didn't <i>like</i> the city; and my hopes were especially high in 2012, having been encouraged to visit by several friends and family members who raved about the place. I especially did not like the feeling that the minute we walked out the door of our lovely hotel in the heart of Sultanahmet, we had to put up a guard against the unending barrage of bull***t sales tactics. I like to be able to wander the streets of a city without feeling like I have to defend myself against assault (and I am NOT talking about physical security -- which I had no issues with in Istanbul, as I rarely do when I travel.)

Goldens

LucieV,
I feel the same as you. We have recently returned and are glad we went, but disappointed.
I encountered the same tactics and found it much dirtier then expected. All of the stray dogs and cats saddened me and, unfortunately, we witnessed three incidents involving these poor animals.
(Yes, I have been to other places with strays and it saddens me there also.)

thursdaysd

I guess, when it comes to strong-arm sales tactics, anywhere is better than India! And I did think it was mostly around Sultanahmet and in the Bazaar. But if you just don't like the city you just don't like it. A bit how I feel about Rome, although I keep meaning to try it again at a cooler time of year.

LucieV

thursdaysd, fwiw: I did not like Rome at all the first time I went. I fell in love with it the second time...and have felt the same every time since! (Though I always go in late spring or early autumn, and would never go in the summer.)

Also, I loved Cinqueterre immediately, and have returned at least 4 times. But I know it is a place that a lot of people, for various reasons, do not enjoy.

And I hated Paris the first time I went. Then I loved it the next few times. The last time I was there (several years ago): not so much.

In any case, I have no illusions that we all have the same reaction to <i>anything</i> (though for the life of me, I cannot understand somebody not liking Ben and Jerry's Coffee Heath Bar Crunch!)

Goldens: thank you for the validation. I genuinely felt guilty about not enjoying our time in Istanbul, as much because of the amount of money we spent (it was hard not to think, "For this much money, we could have gone someplace we love!") as because everybody else seemed to find it so special.

Pepper_von_snoot

I also like Rome much more than Istanbul but it is something to see, especially the Topkapi Palas, Dolmahbache Palas, and the Chora Church.

Sultanahmet is the pits, so many carpet salesmen chasing after you. And just sooooo touristy and tacky.

Do NOT stay in Sultanahmet!!!!!!!

Thin is warning you!


Thin

otherchelebi

I can think of committing oneself to staying at a location not at all suited to one's tastes in any city in the world and not liking it.

But, it is difficult to understand travelers, especially seasoned ones to decide to put down any city or location on the basis of spending a few days once or twice at the same area instead of looking for different locations and experiences.

I have met many Fodorites who enjoyed all their travels, finding great things to feel good about finding and having some experiences which can best be chalked up for experience and quickly put away in very long term storage.

My pedantic nature and age comes out forth again. If you really know what you like and are rather strict about it then you should do your homework well. No location is like another. Comparisons are useless and worthless. There are no two of Rome or Paris or Istanbul each, so you cannot say number one is better than number two. Places change, people change; both the observed and the observer; but most values, attitudes and beliefs stay the same.

As a short stay tourist I would prefer small, compact Rome to many major European cities.

As a longer term tourist, Paris would be my choice among European cities I have visited.

To live, Istanbul would be my first choice and then London.

But all of the above applies to choices among those cities I have visited and only in Europe.

Not being able to understand more than three languages is my biggest regret because I know that my fears and phobias have prevented me from traveling to some areas of the world when I was younger because I could use the language barrier as an excuse.

Now, I realize that one does not necessarily need a common language in order to communicate, but a belief in homo sapiens, a sense of wonder, a wander lust and most of all, a great deal of empathy.

The fact that all of us who are here as writers and lurkers are here means that we all have those characteristics to a certain degree whether we like places or do not.
, bu
Just ask yourself, "Would I have been a happier or better person if I had not visited that location?"

Money better spent elsewhere is not a very valid preposition in view of the Indian maxim, "What has happened was what was meant to happen" and not meaning that it was fate or kismet but just that, "that's the way it was and what are you griping about?"

By the way, I do not like most ice creams, especially American ones which are over-sweet and can kill a person's delicate taste buds as well as insulin balance.

yestravel

I agree with all of what you say, OC, except for the ice cream comment--I love ice cream and America does have some very good ice creams -- you just have to know where to look. Come to DC and I will share.

Goldens

Personally, I don't find comparisons useless and worthless.

Every destination has good and not so good.
I always appreciate comparisons from others, it gives me input into making my own choices. I don't think any comparisons on this thread said one city is better than another, posters were indicating personal preferences.
My time and money are valuable and limited. Sometimes I do wish that I had spent them in a different place. To each his own.

tom42

It's great to read everyones impressions and suggestions. I don't think I would dislike any city that I visit although I agree that I like some better than others. I liked London way more than I thought I would. Paris less so. I've been to Berlin and Barcelona and loved both in entirely different ways. In any event, otherchelebi mentioned the weather and that is actually one of the things that I had already added to the "con" list for visiting Istanbul in February. I was in Rome once many years ago right after college. I was on one of those ridiculous 10 cities in 12 days tours with family but I did love Rome and vowed to go back and spend a more proper amount of time there. Part of the problem is that my partner wants to wait until we have more time so we can explore the amalfi coast in addition. That being said we have talked about visiting Istanbul for a couple years now. I love city travel so I know I will enjoy whatever place we decide on. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts.

otherchelebi

Tom42, If you can afford to wait before deciding. check the extended weather reports and make your reservations possibly as late as one week before departure.

Late reservation in the Winter may actually have advantages because of reduced cost due to low demand, whereas, it invariably increases your cost in Tourist season (summers, Easter, Christmas, etc.)

Good weather, meaning freedom from any kind of precipitation will do wonders for your trip and continuous Winter rains with overcast skies throughout your trip can make it miserable no matter which city you visit.

Checking the weather of past year is not very meaningful because probability of weekly repeat performances are statistically and practically very low.

kja

Jumping in a bit late, but I think any one of these cities could be a good choice depending on your interests. And if you have mentioned what those interests are in any of your posts, sorry, but I've missed it.

For 7 days in/around Madrid, consider up to 4 or even 5 full days in Madrid itself if art is a high priority. Near Madrid, Toledo is worth at least 2 full days IMO, Segovia a day, Avila 1/2 day or more, and further afield, Salamanca is easily worth at least 2 full days. Put your time in Madrid at the end so you don't have to worry about getting back before your flight.

For 7 days in/around Rome, you could easily spent all your time there! Waiting until you can add time for the Amalfi Coast really means waiting until you have at least 2 weeks. The Amalfi Coast actually pairs better IMO with Naples and is better visited at a time when ferries are running.

You've already gotten lots of great info about Istanbul, a wonderfully enchanting city that could easily warrant all your available time.

Hope that helps!