Has anyone hiked through the Hollentalklamm gorge? We'd really like to do it--and we're all reasonably fit--but I read a few cautions about surefootedness that sort of scared me.

What's it like?

Actually, we'd like to tie this in with a hike across the Alpspitz Norwand (northface). I understand that there is a klettersteig section--which again sounds scary. We have never hiked in the Alps--so we need some advice. What is this like?

I did the hike through the gorge up to Höllentalangerhütte, which is a normal mountain hike. This means, it is not a walk in the park, but on the other hand it does not involve any climbing and has no especially dangerous parts. No problem for experienced hikers. You have to pay a small entrance fee for the gorge. There is also an alternative path, the "Stangensteig", which is much more difficult.

I have no personal experience with the Klettersteig (fixed rope route), but on a scale from A (easy) to E (extremly difficult) it is rated A/B. For rating B or more difficult it is recommended to have some gear to secure oneself. If in doubt, you can hire a guide.

I went down it, having gone up on the gondola from Garmisch to the Osterfelderkop, where several walks start.

The gondola was the scariest part (for me). The paths are well signposted and maintained. Actually going through the Höllentalklamm wasn't that much of a problem, it's just that it gets a bit slippery where the water splashes over the path and into a few bits that are tunnels (it's the remains of an early attempt at a hydro-electric station). As long as you've got footwear with a good grip and you keep your wits about you, it's not a problem.

But I wouldn't want to go up it.

Jochen and Patrick, thanks very much for the information. That is a big help.

I guess what I'm worried about is a situation where if "you fall, you die".

In the gorge, I suppose that would mean that if you lose your footing you fall into the rushing water.

And on the klettersteig section, I suppose that would mean that it travels across such a steep face that on a fall you'd just slide down--no rocks to stop you.

If in either situation there are ropes that make it virtually impossible to fall--then that would make the whole thing seem safer.

I guess the other thing is that I wonder what the part of the hike across the Alpspitz Norwand is like in the part that is NOT the klettersteig section. If it is a very sheer face (but with NO ropes, it might be even worse than the klettersteig).

Any input?

Unfortunately I have no personal experience with the Nordwand of the Alpspitze. There is a website describing it, but it is in German only:

http://www.klettersteige-online.de/alpspitze.htm

The key sentence is "Der Nordwandsteig auf die Alpspitze kann quasi von Jedermann begangen werden" which means that it can be hiked by virtually everybody. However, fitness and surefootedness are required. It is very difficult to say what this really means. Very often it just means that it is not a walk in the park, and they write it to keep people from hiking in sandals. In any case it is much easier to walk a difficult path uphill than to do it downhill.

I'm sorry I can't help you further. Perhaps you'll find somebody with personal experience.

Can't help on the Nordwand, though Jürgen's quote suggests you would have to be doing something way beyond any common sense to be in any danger.

As far as the Höllentalklamm goes, I never for a moment felt there was any risk of falling in the water. As I recall, the slippery bits came as one went down the tunnels to one side: spray and splashes made the floor wet, but the paths were wide and mostly enclosed, with occasional apertures looking out on to the water. I can't remember if there were grabrails at any point, but I'm not a frequent walker and am very fond of my own comfort zones, and I never felt I was doing anything particularly difficult or dangerous.

Thanks for the input. Your answers make me feel much better about attempting that hike. It sounds like it is really beautiful--I'd hate to miss it!