awayfromitall

We just returned from our 12 day trip to Germany (including travel time). Thanks to everyone on this forum who helped me plan it. To level set for others planning their trip in the future, we are a family of four....adults in their late 40s, teenagers 15 (DS) and 17 (DD).

Day 1: We flew US Air via Philadephia to Munich. I originally booked this flight through Orbitz back in April but at the time the seat selection was acting flaky so I booked the flight without seats and told myself I'd follow up on it later. $1400/ticket. Unfortunately I didn't look at my reminder notes until 2 weeks before the trip and when I called to get seats, they said that we'd have to sit in 4 different places scattered throughout the plane...or we could pay $30 extra a seat and sit together in a "premium" row. We did because it's a long trip not to be able to sit together. There was nothing premium about this row. It was exactly like almost every other row in coach. As soon as we booked it, I'm sure another "premium" row opened up. I was glad we got to sit together but the nickel-and-diming that the airlines are doing these days is driving me nuts.

We ate in Philadelphia, even though we weren't terribly hungry, not knowing if they were going to feed us on the plane, and hoping to escape airline food even if they did. The plane flight was pretty good. All the seats had their own video on demand screens so it helped time pass quickly. We tried to sleep but as always never can.

We arrived in Munich at about 8:10 AM and took the S to a U to a short cab ride to get to our hotel. I didn't realize the airport train was part of the subway system so we ended up buying 1-way train passes and then later had to buy multi-day passes to the subway. As a "do over", we'd buy the multi-day passes at the airport and be set for the rest of our stay.

We stayed at the Holiday Inn Schwabing, arriving about 10:30 AM. It was an unadventurous hotel looking like every other Holiday Inn but it was only 86E a night to sleep 4 on a weekend so a deal. It was an ok, not great location. It was a 10-minute walk to the subway and then 4 stops on the U to Marienplatz. There was a tram that ran to the hotel that you could ride to the subway but we never tried to figure out its schedule...seemed easier to walk.

We checked in easily, dropped off our baggage in our room, and then took the subway/train to see Dachau. It probably took about 40 minutes to get to Dachau. DS and DD slept en route. We ate at a pizza place there...probably the only one...and got gelato. Very good. Then we caught the bus to the memorial site. I was actually kind of disappointed in Dachau. I expected it to be more moving from others' posts. It may be that I have read so extensively about the holocaust that nothing really affected me. Very little is really still intact. Half of the buildings standing turn out to be memorial chapels built after the fact when you get close to them. Only the foundations of the original barracks are left. We stayed a couple of hours, toured the prison cells and the single reconstructed barracks, read a lot of information, watched the movie (DH fell asleep) and walked the full circuit.

At this time, it was only about 4:30PM. Everyone was exhausted but I was trying to push them to stay awake until at least 7PM to get on Germany time so we stopped off at Marienplatz on the way home. We watched the glockenspiel (at 5PM I think) and climbed to the top of St. Peter's church to see the view. We headed home and crashed.

awayfromitall

Day 3: Day 1 was really "Day 1/Day 2". Even though we made it to bed about 8, we slept until about 8:30 the next morning and only roused because DH, DS, and DD wanted to run before we started our day.

Another reason I had booked the Holiday Inn was to try to be close to the English Garden to give them a good place to run. It turns out that it's a little too far from there. Their run (about a 4-5 mile loop) only got them to the edge of it. The great thing though is that Munich (and Germany) has awesome bike paths. They are everywhere and everyone takes advantage of them. Although it takes a little learning at first when you're walking to stay out of the bike path. Because it's smoother than the walking path which runs beside it, you naturally migrate towards it. There were tons of people biking just to do their regular business and the paths turned out to be a great place to run also. One interesting thing about Germany is that people obey their walk/don't walk signs. In the US, they seem to be more of a suggestion than a law. Also, biking seems to be all about function in Munich and not about "healthy exercise". You'll see lots of folks biking along smoking cigarettes.

After running and showering, we went off in search of breakfast. The Holiday Inn serves a buffet breakfast but at 23E a person, it was a little too rich for us. We walked about 5 minutes down the street towards the subway to an awesome pastry shop where we all ate (and drank) for 13E total. Germany has awesome pastries....much better than the wursts. Stop in one at least once a day to truly enjoy your vacation.

After breakfast, we headed back to Marienplatz and then to the
Isator to rent bikes. We rode bikes in the English Garden for a couple of hours. It was a gorgeous sunny day in the high 70s/low 80s. Tons of clothed and unclothed folks enjoying the sunshine but the unclothed folks are far enough away that it's still family-friendly. There are tons of paths through the English Garden. We boringly stuck to the main one so as not to get lost. On our way back, we stopped at the Beer Garden with the Pagoda and ate sausages and roasted potatoes. Lots of folks here...a very good atmosphere.

On our way out of the English Garden, we stopped off and saw the surfers on the Isar river. Lots of teenagers were also floating with the current down the river. We didn't have bathing suits but if we had brought them, it would have been something the kids would have enjoyed doing.

We rode back to the bike rental store, turned in our bikes, and poked our heads into the Hofbrauhaus which was close by. It was the middle of the afternoon so it was pretty quiet in there.

Next we took the train to Herrsching to hike to Andechs Monastery thinking we'd get a snack and dessert there. It was a long endeavor...taking us about 5 hours round trip. About an hour to get there on the train each way, an hour to hike there and back, and some time at the monastery. The hike was pleasant enough. You have to follow "little bitty" signs through the town to get to the trail to Andechs. They're very easy to miss. The trail is a very nice, fairly easy hike through the woods and fields. The monastery when you arrive is ok as a destination for a hike but nothing special in and of itself. Another pretty church (among lots of pretty churches in Europe). We ate a pretzel and got some beers, even though we're not big beer drinkers. My travel book had talked about getting apple strudel as a dessert there and we were imagining something hot and fresh but they only had the generic snack cakes you see at stands around Munich.

After our snack, we decided we'd like to catch the bus back to town rather than hike back only to see the last bus for the day pass as we got there. Oh well....back down the path.

Back in Munich, we stopped for a gelato in Marienplatz. (The previous night we had stopped for a fruit smoothie. These are like they make in the US...but they unfortunately skip the ice.) Back to the hotel and bed after that.

Some notes on Munich:
1) This town feels incredibly safe. You don't feel like you have to chain your wallet in your pocket and you see lots of bikes left unlocked.
2) Subway tickets seem to be a suggestion. We hardly saw anyone buying a subway ticket and you don't need a ticket to get onto the platform. They supposedly check them sometimes and fine you if you don't have a ticket...but we never saw any checking going on.
3) The city center is nice but unless you're going to tour some museums, you can probably see it all in an hour.

logos999

>lots of bikes left unlocked.
I had 2 bikes stolen in 3 years, always properly locked.
>Subway tickets seem to be a suggestion.
People use weekly or monthly tickets. They'll send you a new ticket every month by mail. No need to buy from a machine.

klondike

good start, interested in rest of trip when you get a chance.

awayfromitall

Day 4: Up early this morning to run. Breakfast at our yummy pastry shop. Then back to the hotel to pick up our car from Hertz. This was yet another good thing about the Holiday Inn - it had a Hertz office right there. DH was bummed to have to pass up a BMW sedan for a Hyundai station wagon but thought the latter would be better for out luggage. It was a compact station wagon but fit our 4 pieces of luggage well (2 large, 2 medium). It was also a manual which DH hasn't driven in about 20 years so getting out of the steeply inclined Holiday Inn parking lot was an adventure.

We headed off to Berchtesgaden to the Alpenhotel Garni Weiherbach. An uneventful drive. We had our Garmin with European maps (Thanks Paul!) which was absolutely vital. If you're going to drive between small towns, this is a must. I had printed out maps/instructions for getting between our destinations also in case the Garmin decided not to work but if we had tried to follow those, I'm pretty sure we would be divorced now.

The Alpenhotel Garni Weiherbach was a fine hotel..although you must drive to town or walk a really long way. It is on the same road as the Salt Mines parking. We had a suite with 2 bedrooms and a small kitchenette..about $200/night...cash only. After checking in, we headed to the Eisriesenwelt ice caves in Austria. These were about 40 minutes away. Not sure if it's the only way to go but Garmin took us from Berchtesgaden to Hallein on very steep, narrow 1-lane roads with 2-way traffic..another adventure.

Right by the ice caves is Hohenwerfen Castle. We didn't get to see it because we only had time for the caves but it looked really cool, especially views from the top, and would have been cool to see. If anyone else is doing a trip like this, I'd recommend getting an early start and combining both the castle and the ice caves in one day.

The road to the ice caves was supposed to be really steep so we parked in the parking lot at the base and took a shuttle up. Most people drove up so it's doable but DH was still not feeling confident enough with his manual to assure we wouldn't fall off a cliff.

At the top, we bought our tickets, and then hiked 15 minutes to a gondola. At the top of the gondola was a restaurant where we stopped and ate...good food and great views. After that another 15 minute hike to the caves themselves. The hike was strenuous since it was an incline but very doable. We saw all ages of folks who made it fine.

With information we gathered on this site, we were prepared with out sweatshirts, gloves, and hats. Which is about how the guide was attired also. Inside the cave, you climb 700 stairs up and 700 stairs down which makes the sweatshirt sufficient for keeping you warm even though it's below freezing. But you use cold handrails going up and down the stairs which make the gloves invaluable. I probably could have sold them for big bucks.

The tour was given in both German and English and was very interesting. Every third person carried a lantern. It lasted about an hour. I found the stair-climbing to be fine but a couple of folks (in their fifties probably) were really struggling.

After the tour, we just enjoyed the awesome views again and headed down to the restaurant for dessert. They have great strudel here...try it. Back down the gondola and the path. Bad news is the shuttle just comes some time. We had to wait about an hour for it. So if you're not weak of heart, it's probably better to drive up yourself.

Back to Berchtesgaden. The first night, we wandered what we thought was the main street by the Salt Mines and were underwhelmed. We found out later where the real "much better" town was.

Back to our hotel...and to our flat square pillows (How are you supposed to use these - lie with your upper torso on them? fold them in half?). Slept with the windows open. Temperature was comfortable.

bardo1

awayfromitall,

Sorry that the Andechs Monastery was "nothing special in and of itself". To beer connoisseurs everywhere, it is considered one of the best beers in the world and worthy of a pilgrimage

Enjoying the report, though, and looking forward to more.

awayfromitall

Yes, for Germany overall, one would do well to hone their beer-drinking skills. As for me, I'm the unfortunate person where only the third glass starts to taste good...even though others find it divine.

awayfromitall

Day 5: No run this morning as we're trying to fit 2 things into 1 day.

Standard German breakfast served at the hotel...cold cuts, cereal, hard rolls. Perfectly fine...but wishing for my pastries! Next we're headed to the salt mines.

We got right in at around 9:30 and the tour lasted about an hour. Robed up in miner suits. Unfortunately, we were with a high school student tour group...which translates to very rowdy. First you take a train into the mine, then go down a couple of slides (good fun), and then ride on a boat on an underground lake with a light show going on. This is accented with some commentary on the salt mining process...and at the end they give you a small sample of salt in a small container. My kids enjoyed the salt mines but it sort of feels like a Disney ride...so take it with a grain of salt (stupid but accurate pun intended).

After the tour, we headed to the Documentation Center which was only a mile or 2 from the salt mines. En route, we saw a sign for a Sommerodelbahn so stopped at that. I had read about these and was expecting a long luge ride down a mountain. This one, and the next one, we went on, turned out to be more like Germany's version of the U.S. Go Kart tracks you see at "fun centers"...but propelled by gravity instead of gasoline. It was pretty cheap though...10 rides for about 15E...and we enjoyed it.

Then to the documentation center...where finding a parking place was a challenge. We ended up at a parking lot a short hike away and then bought bus tickets to go up the Eagles' Nest. The tickets were for about an hour from the purchase time so we ate at the restaurant near the documentation center...then headed back to catch the bus. The bus ride is maybe 5-10 minutes up to the Eagles' Nest...then you have to wait in line in a tunnel and up an elevator (with lots of other tourists). At the top, we walked out to where a cross is, climbed around the rocks, and enjoyed the view. At this point we lost DS for about 10 minutes which scared me to death as I pictured him plummeting to his death. However, as usually happens, it was just a miscommunication and he had headed back to the building. When we found him, we all headed back to the building to see what was in it...only to find that nothing is. There is one hallway with a few pictures and a restaurant. I was quite disappointed that we paid 16E a piece for a good view. This would be the one thing in the trip that I would recommend for everyone to skip. It's a pretty view but there are a zillion chair lifts around in the Bavarian Alps that will lift you to equally good views at a cheaper price and with fewer tourists.

We caught the bus back down and toured the documentation center. We only had about an hour left before it closed so we saw the bunkers underground, watched a movie in German that had cool footage from the World War II era even though we couldn't understand a lot, and then spent a short time reading some of the information on the upper floors. We had bought the audio guides as they were recommended but actually didn't listen to them much. They're good but verbose..and I think my family's ADD tendencies kick in way before the commentary ends. This is the same for the written museum information. There is a ton of it. You could probably spend all day in the documentation center if you read all of it (BTW, all written text is in German). But the documentation center was only 3E a piece and was worth it. I'd recommend to skip the Eagles' nest and spend more time here.

After the documentation center closed, we were raring for dinner and wanted something non-German so we sought out the closest Chinese restaurant which Garmin said was 4.3 miles away. These ended up being the same 4.3 miles we took on the way to the ice caves...steep, windy, and 1-laned but we were ultimately successful in finding the restaurant.

Back home, I decided that I wanted to attempt some laundry, even though it was early in the trip, since the only laundromat pointed out to me in fodors was in Berchtesgaden. This proved challenging. We found the laundromat fine...4 washing machines, 1 broken, and the other 3 in use...but finishing up shortly...so we waited. Drinks were for sale in the laundromat but no soap....another thing I didn't expect. Not knowing how/where to get soap, I decided I'd just wash them without it...at least they'd be kind of clean. Got them washed and waited for one of the 2 dryers. The 2 folks in front of me finished up but both took their clothes away damp because the dryer hadn't completely dried them and they didn't want to wait longer. Even so, I attempted the dryer on ours. It got hot, but the clothes came out damp...and the laundromat was closing...so we took home damp clothes...and hung them up to dry. The only reason I tell this mundane happening is because, to jump ahead a few days, we decided to have the next hotel wash some clothes for us. They came back nicely folded but all damp. Is this considered normal in Germany? Do folks not dry their clothes all the way or is it just coincidence?

awayfromitall

Day 6: Early morning run. The hotel is close to the national park so the running was good but a bit hilly. Lots of slugs. Breakfast at our hotel then off to Fussen.

En route, we stopped in Garmish-P to do some hiking...arriving about 1PM. I originally wanted to hike the Hoellentalklamm gorge but we ended up at the Olympic stadium where the Partnachklamm gorge was...so decided to do this one instead. At the Olympic stadium was another sommerodelbahn so we tried this one also. About the same as the other one but a little more scenic. We hiked down to the gorge (entry fee is required). The gorge was pretty but small and there were lots of people so the tunnels felt more like winding through a ride line at Disney World. At the end of the gorge, there was a sign for a trail that said Eckbauer 20 minutes so we took this...turned out to be a miscommunication. After about 20 minutes, there was another sign that said Eckbauer 45 minutes so I think the original sign was for 1 hour 20 minutes. The hike was pretty much straight up-hill but very few people on the trail and very enjoyable. We made it to the lift and took the 2-person chair down (for a fee). Most people do this hike in reverse which would be a good recommendation.

I would recommend looking into the other Hoellentalklamm hike (and mapping out directions to it) though which would probably have fewer crowds at the gorge. We had to check in at our hotel in Fussen by 8 so didn't have time to find this. We ate in a Mexican restaurant by the train station...good fajitas...but no burritos, enchiladas, and such.

On to Fussen, where we checked into the Altstadt-Hotel zum Hechten right in the middle of town. Large suite...2 bedrooms (1 with twin beds) and a huge sitting room with a couch and table and chairs.

If I had to do this over, I probably wouldn't stop in Garmisch-P. I'd probably stay an extra night in Berchtesgaden and hike there. If I were going to Garmisch-P, it would be good to stay a couple of days and do a couple of hikes. A quick stop was kind of rushed and unsatisfying.

bettyk

The visit to the Eagle's Nest is much, much better if you have an English tourguide. We were given the history of the construction (did you know that the fireplace in the dining room was a birtday gift to Hitler from Mussolini?) and other details during our 30+ minute tour. All the original furnishings were taken as souvenirs by the liberating troops.

Anyway, for us this made our visit much more than just a "pretty view."

logos999

Yeah, you've got to love those Nazis..

bettyk

logos, give it up. We've already had that discussion. You are entitled to your opinion as am I.

logos999

See betty, it's not an opinion it's you that is the problem.
And the law sets limits to peoples expressions of opinion. Be aware that certain things will rightfully ban you from entering Germany.

Kristinelaine

awayfromitall -- More please. I'm enjoying your report so much!

jgg

Enjoying your report - we did a similar trip 2 years ago. My son called those pillows "crackers" cause they looked like a Saltine!!

klondike

Regarding damp clothes: I believe it finds its roots in the high cost of energy, and Europeans as a whole are much more "green" than many Americans; people are very careful of their energy consumption.

For example, the refrigerator in our rented house does not have a freezer compartment and the dryer has a mode"cupboard dry" where the clothes are as you say still very damp and finish drying as they hang in the closet. To me they're just right for ironing that way.

awayfromitall

klondike, what's an iron? We're way too lazy in our house...only the rare item gets ironed.

Day 7: Rough night's sleep. While the hotel suite was huge and the hotel conveniently located, our room fronted the main street and the narrow cobbled streets seemed to act as an echo chamber. There wasn't a lot of night life going on, but any conversation at all or clicking of heels was amplified. If you choose to stay at this hotel, ask for a room that doesn't front the streets..which would be the majority of them. Also this hotel did "wash and fold" laundry for us...5 days worth of laundry for 4 people for 30E...pretty reasonable compared to prices hotels in the states can charge.

No run this morning as we have to be at the castles by 9:20 to pick up tickets we reserved on the web. Skies are overcast so we brought our raincoats and umbrellas. The drive to the castles, Hohenschwangau and Neuschwanstein, was only about 5 minutes. Got our tickets easily and walked up to Hohenschwangau. You're supposed to pick up your tickets 1 hour before admission and this gives you tons of time. We were about 10 minutes late picking ours up and still waited outside the castle for 30 minutes. After the tour, we hiked up the road to Neuschwanstein. Arriving early, we walked to Marienbrucke, the bridge with the great photo ops. However, by this time, the clouds had moved in so basically we have a picture of a cloud with one fuzzy turet showing. Back down for the tour, the rain decided to cut loose...and the perfect German weather we had before that ended. Luckily our tour was in about 5 minutes so we took that and then walked back down in the pouring rain. We stopped at a place making fresh fried doughnut ball type of things which were yummy. As for my opinion of the castles, I think they're a must see. Not seeing them would be like going to Paris and not seeing the Eiffel Tower. The crowds were fine and the tours and insides of the castle long enough and interesting enough. If you've seen a lot of Europe, there's a little feeling of deja vu in the elaborateness of the decorations...but still worth seeing...from the inside and outside.

At this point, our original plan was to drive to the Tegelberg lift, ride it to the top, and hike down but in the pouring rain, it seemed less an optimal choice...as the kids' shoes were already soaked even with umbrellas. So we decided to head back and grabbed lunch (very good) at an Italian restaurant called San Marco close to the hotel. As the rain wasn't lifting, we opted for a lazy evening reading in the hotel room stepping out with our umbrellas later for gelato. Since the hotel had a separate "living room", this worked out great.

Note that musts for any trip to Germany are: umbrellas, raincoats, waterproof (or resistant) shoes, and warm clothes (Day 8's story).

logos999

>It got hot, but the clothes came out damp...and the laundromat was closing.
There are two settings "Schranktrocken" and "Bügelfeucht", translated "closet dry" or "damp to iron". It depends what you prefer and how you set the dryer.

awayfromitall

These particular dryers were preset in that their controls were taped over...but logos' comment does bring up an interesting point I should mention. Buy an English-German dictionary. This seems like an "uh duh" but we didn't. In our first European trip to France, we bought one, but ended up having enough high school French (and Spanish) to puzzle out most things and never accessed the dictionary. In Italy, we didn't buy one but again the language roots were so similar to French and Spanish that again it was easy enough to figure out. Not so the case for German. You will have that dictionary well-worn by the end of your trip.

Pegontheroad

I've enjoyed this report. Just as an aside, I noticed that some people who have washers don't have dryers. They just hang the clothes on a rack. I don't know if it's about economy or being green or both.

I dry my clothes on hangers or a drying rack, but I also fluff them for a few minutes. Otherwise they're very wrinkled.

I do dry my towels and sheets, though if I were a really good greenie, I'd put up the umbrella rack in the back yard and hang them there. I'm wondering if Germans hang their towels and sheets to dry.