hello all!
i am in the initial planning stages for a trip to Germany this September/October. my boyfriend and i want a laid back vacation and sightseeing trip. we have both traveled internationally, with others and solo, so we are experienced travelers. we are budget travelers and would like to keep the entire trip under $5k (well under, if possible!). my BF has never been to Germany or Austria and would like to see some of both. i'd like to revisit Strasbourg, Garmisch and Lichtenstein if possible (haven't been there since i was a kid). i also think he'd enjoy the Mosel region as well as the Black Forest. we are planning to rent a car (he wants to drive the autobahn). so my questions are:
1 - how much of Germany and the other listed countries can we see without exhausting ourselves?
2 - are there any highlights in western Germany and western Austria that shouldn't be missed, especially by a first time visitor?
3 - since he's never been to Germany, i want to be sure to hit at least one big city with a good history museum or two - which western German cities would you recommend?
4 - which airport(s) should we fly into and out of, considering the areas we want to see? for instance, is it reasonable to consider flying into MUC and out of ZUR?
i'd rather start off at a good clip and end on a slower note, if that helps. i'd also like to spend less than 2-3 hours in the car at one time. we could consider a longer day of driving if it means less driving on the other days, though. and i plan to book B&Bs for lodging.
i know this isn't all that much to go on, but i thank you for your comments and suggestions!
i am in the initial planning stages for a trip to Germany this September/October. my boyfriend and i want a laid back vacation and sightseeing trip. we have both traveled internationally, with others and solo, so we are experienced travelers. we are budget travelers and would like to keep the entire trip under $5k (well under, if possible!). my BF has never been to Germany or Austria and would like to see some of both. i'd like to revisit Strasbourg, Garmisch and Lichtenstein if possible (haven't been there since i was a kid). i also think he'd enjoy the Mosel region as well as the Black Forest. we are planning to rent a car (he wants to drive the autobahn). so my questions are:
1 - how much of Germany and the other listed countries can we see without exhausting ourselves?
2 - are there any highlights in western Germany and western Austria that shouldn't be missed, especially by a first time visitor?
3 - since he's never been to Germany, i want to be sure to hit at least one big city with a good history museum or two - which western German cities would you recommend?
4 - which airport(s) should we fly into and out of, considering the areas we want to see? for instance, is it reasonable to consider flying into MUC and out of ZUR?
i'd rather start off at a good clip and end on a slower note, if that helps. i'd also like to spend less than 2-3 hours in the car at one time. we could consider a longer day of driving if it means less driving on the other days, though. and i plan to book B&Bs for lodging.
i know this isn't all that much to go on, but i thank you for your comments and suggestions!
Moving this back to the top. Your plans are pretty vague at this point so you may not get a lot of help. Still:
1. We need to know how many days you have. You have a good idea to start fast and end slow.
2. Western Germany has Trier, Koln, Aachen ( if that's the west you mean). Also Worms, Speyer. Roman and medieval history there. Also the Weinstrasse (southwest-ish) - good for slow. Pretty towns and villages and lots of wine tasting in September and October.
3. Berlin has a good museum the name of which I will remember eventually. Had friends who loved it - but Berlin is in the wrong place. Lots of small towns have museums. Try to google that, using your interests as a key word.
4. I think Frankfurt would be a good place to start for Western Germany; Munich on the way out. Close enough to Austria, a country about which I cannot advise.
Re: driving the autobahn: it isn't Indianapolis or Daytona. The rules are specific and Germans are good drivers and stick to the rules. Please learn about them first. Driving the autobahn is fantastic when you know the rules and particularly understand the signs (as so many in the military have discovered when they take the test). Spend money on a good car - my first time I drove an E-class Mercedes. Tooo cooool but pricey. Now I just use my 12-year old BMW - still great.
Germany is a great country to visit - people are kind and helpful and autumn is absolutely gorgeous. (I have fallen totally in love with the place.) Have a great time; try not to do too much. A lot of your trip will be impressions; give yourself time to absorb them.
1. We need to know how many days you have. You have a good idea to start fast and end slow.
2. Western Germany has Trier, Koln, Aachen ( if that's the west you mean). Also Worms, Speyer. Roman and medieval history there. Also the Weinstrasse (southwest-ish) - good for slow. Pretty towns and villages and lots of wine tasting in September and October.
3. Berlin has a good museum the name of which I will remember eventually. Had friends who loved it - but Berlin is in the wrong place. Lots of small towns have museums. Try to google that, using your interests as a key word.
4. I think Frankfurt would be a good place to start for Western Germany; Munich on the way out. Close enough to Austria, a country about which I cannot advise.
Re: driving the autobahn: it isn't Indianapolis or Daytona. The rules are specific and Germans are good drivers and stick to the rules. Please learn about them first. Driving the autobahn is fantastic when you know the rules and particularly understand the signs (as so many in the military have discovered when they take the test). Spend money on a good car - my first time I drove an E-class Mercedes. Tooo cooool but pricey. Now I just use my 12-year old BMW - still great.
Germany is a great country to visit - people are kind and helpful and autumn is absolutely gorgeous. (I have fallen totally in love with the place.) Have a great time; try not to do too much. A lot of your trip will be impressions; give yourself time to absorb them.
My apologies - just noticed your 7-10 day title. Too much wine w/dinner. Oh - wait - I didn't have dinner. Back on target: Essentially you're looking at 4 days in each country. Not a lot of time to really explore both in depth Decide your interests (e.g., roman history) and go from there. I've also found a lot of autobahn travel close to big cities can mean road construction. Had a 2 hour detour on A5 in Germany south of Karlsruhe last month and 6 qnd 62 always seem to have repairs. Not sure how you can find out about the repairs being done.
Hi JFGgirl
A review of your requirements
1.BF wants to see some Germany and some Austria (OK)
2.JFG wants to revisit Strasbourg, Garmisch and Liechtenstein (OK)
3.Both want to spend < $5k ($500/day, OK but close)
4.Both want a laid back vacation and sightseeing trip (OK but some conflicting requirements).
5.BF would enjoy the Mosel region as well as the Black Forest (I will take this as a soft requirement)
6.BF wants to drive the autobahn (No problem here)
7.Both want fastest pace at beginning of the trip(OK)
8. I will assume you have 10 nights in Europe.
Questions
1 - how much of Germany and the other listed countries can we see without exhausting ourselves?( I will propose an itinerary, you will determine if it is too exhausting).
2 - are there any highlights in western Germany and western Austria that shouldn't be missed, especially by a first time visitor?( There is no London,Rome, or Paris but Rothenburg, King Ludwigs castles,Salzburg,Alpine area(like Garmish),Tirol, Rhine valley,Munich are first time visitor locations for 7 nights. For 10 nights add Berlin.
Strasbourg and Liechtenstein are not usual 1st trip itinerary).
3 - since he's never been to Germany, i want to be sure to hit at least one big city with a good history museum or two - which western German cities would you recommend?(Munich, Berlin does not fit) )
4 - which airport(s) should we fly into and out of, considering the areas we want to see? for instance, is it reasonable to consider flying into MUC and out of ZUR?
(Munich and Frankfurt. Zurich is not good because high drop off rental car charges for a car rented in Germany).
Here we go
Day 1.ROTHENBURG(1 night). Arrive Frankfurt in AM, pick up car, Drive(2 hrs) to Rothenburg ob der Tauber- Germanys finest medieval town.
-Walk the wall
-Riemenschneiders wood carving in the church.
-Medieval Museum/ Crime and Punishment
-Night Watchman Tour
Day 2.STRASBOURG(1 night). Drive(3 hrs) to Strasbourg, last part of drive could be the scenic Schwarzwaldhochstrasse.
Day3. MEERSBURG (3 nights). Drive(3hrs)(Could route through the heart of the Black Forest from Stasbourg-Triberg-Donaueschingen-Meersburg) to Meersburg on Lake Constance(Bodensee), Switzerland across the Lake via ferry.
Days 4 and 5. MEERSBURG
-day trip to Liechtenstein possible, also Appenzel.
-day trip across the lake to Switzerland- Stein am Rhine and Rhinefall(Niagra like falls)
- Meersburg is a living snapshot of a fairytale Germany with a lakefront of half-timbered houses, and one of Germany's oldest castles.
Day 6.GARMISH (1 night). Drive to Garmish (3-1/2 hrs)with a stop in Fussen/Hohenschwangau to see Ludwigs castles Neuschwanstein and Hohenschwangau. From there you can take the southern route (through Tirol) to Garmish or a northern route (through Steingaden-possible stop to see Wieskirche) to Garmish.
-Mittenwald
-"Mad" King Ludwig's Linderhof palace
-Karwendelbahn cable car-Mittenwald
-Zugspitze trip-Garmisch
-Sommerrodelbahn (luge ride)-Garmisch
-Ettal Monastary
-Oberammergau
Day 7.MUNICH. Drive(1-1/2 hrs) to Munich, turn in car.
Day 8,9 MUNICH.Day trip to Salzberg, Austria via train.
Next day Fly Home
If you have a 10th night you can consider one of these OPTIONS
OPTION 1- from Frankfurt airport drive to Mosel and spend the 1st night in Cochem or nearby. Next day continue on to Rothenburg.
OPTION 2-From Strasbourg spend a night in a small town in the Black Forest and then on to Meersburg the next day.
OPTION 3-From Stasbourg drive to APPENZEL and see Liechtenstein. Drive to Meersburg the next day.
OPTION 4-From Garmish drive to SALSBURG, spend the night and then drive to Munich.
Hope this helps!
A review of your requirements
1.BF wants to see some Germany and some Austria (OK)
2.JFG wants to revisit Strasbourg, Garmisch and Liechtenstein (OK)
3.Both want to spend < $5k ($500/day, OK but close)
4.Both want a laid back vacation and sightseeing trip (OK but some conflicting requirements).
5.BF would enjoy the Mosel region as well as the Black Forest (I will take this as a soft requirement)
6.BF wants to drive the autobahn (No problem here)
7.Both want fastest pace at beginning of the trip(OK)
8. I will assume you have 10 nights in Europe.
Questions
1 - how much of Germany and the other listed countries can we see without exhausting ourselves?( I will propose an itinerary, you will determine if it is too exhausting).
2 - are there any highlights in western Germany and western Austria that shouldn't be missed, especially by a first time visitor?( There is no London,Rome, or Paris but Rothenburg, King Ludwigs castles,Salzburg,Alpine area(like Garmish),Tirol, Rhine valley,Munich are first time visitor locations for 7 nights. For 10 nights add Berlin.
Strasbourg and Liechtenstein are not usual 1st trip itinerary).
3 - since he's never been to Germany, i want to be sure to hit at least one big city with a good history museum or two - which western German cities would you recommend?(Munich, Berlin does not fit) )
4 - which airport(s) should we fly into and out of, considering the areas we want to see? for instance, is it reasonable to consider flying into MUC and out of ZUR?
(Munich and Frankfurt. Zurich is not good because high drop off rental car charges for a car rented in Germany).
Here we go
Day 1.ROTHENBURG(1 night). Arrive Frankfurt in AM, pick up car, Drive(2 hrs) to Rothenburg ob der Tauber- Germanys finest medieval town.
-Walk the wall
-Riemenschneiders wood carving in the church.
-Medieval Museum/ Crime and Punishment
-Night Watchman Tour
Day 2.STRASBOURG(1 night). Drive(3 hrs) to Strasbourg, last part of drive could be the scenic Schwarzwaldhochstrasse.
Day3. MEERSBURG (3 nights). Drive(3hrs)(Could route through the heart of the Black Forest from Stasbourg-Triberg-Donaueschingen-Meersburg) to Meersburg on Lake Constance(Bodensee), Switzerland across the Lake via ferry.
Days 4 and 5. MEERSBURG
-day trip to Liechtenstein possible, also Appenzel.
-day trip across the lake to Switzerland- Stein am Rhine and Rhinefall(Niagra like falls)
- Meersburg is a living snapshot of a fairytale Germany with a lakefront of half-timbered houses, and one of Germany's oldest castles.
Day 6.GARMISH (1 night). Drive to Garmish (3-1/2 hrs)with a stop in Fussen/Hohenschwangau to see Ludwigs castles Neuschwanstein and Hohenschwangau. From there you can take the southern route (through Tirol) to Garmish or a northern route (through Steingaden-possible stop to see Wieskirche) to Garmish.
-Mittenwald
-"Mad" King Ludwig's Linderhof palace
-Karwendelbahn cable car-Mittenwald
-Zugspitze trip-Garmisch
-Sommerrodelbahn (luge ride)-Garmisch
-Ettal Monastary
-Oberammergau
Day 7.MUNICH. Drive(1-1/2 hrs) to Munich, turn in car.
Day 8,9 MUNICH.Day trip to Salzberg, Austria via train.
Next day Fly Home
If you have a 10th night you can consider one of these OPTIONS
OPTION 1- from Frankfurt airport drive to Mosel and spend the 1st night in Cochem or nearby. Next day continue on to Rothenburg.
OPTION 2-From Strasbourg spend a night in a small town in the Black Forest and then on to Meersburg the next day.
OPTION 3-From Stasbourg drive to APPENZEL and see Liechtenstein. Drive to Meersburg the next day.
OPTION 4-From Garmish drive to SALSBURG, spend the night and then drive to Munich.
Hope this helps!
many thanks to all, especially dugi_otok for that possible itinerary!
i need to make sure he is okay with missing Berlin. if he isn't that will obviously have a big effect on the planning, as it's well outside the area i was considering. if he does want to see Berlin i think i'd want to fly in there, then take a train out west, and then pick up a rental car and get out of the cities. since we are both looking for a true vacation, we want to stay out of the big cities as much as possible (coming from DC, the last thing we need is traffic and congestion frustration on our trip).
i need to make sure he is okay with missing Berlin. if he isn't that will obviously have a big effect on the planning, as it's well outside the area i was considering. if he does want to see Berlin i think i'd want to fly in there, then take a train out west, and then pick up a rental car and get out of the cities. since we are both looking for a true vacation, we want to stay out of the big cities as much as possible (coming from DC, the last thing we need is traffic and congestion frustration on our trip).
Here's a thought. Start in Munich and spend a few days including a daytrip on the train to Salzburg. When you leave Munich rent a car and go to Garmish, Mittenwald, Oberammergau and Fussen. After you browse a few of the mad king's castles drive across to Lindau (close to Lichtenstein). Take a boat trip on Lake Constance (Bodensee) to Mainau Insel, the flower island. It will be a ways to go but from there you can head for the Black Forest. And then across to Strasbourg and maybe fly home from there. One bad part of this plan is the cross border drop fee on a rent car.. Also late Septmer is Oktoberfest time in Munich and they jack up hotel prices a lot during that time. Check Googlemaps or ViaMichelin.com for driving times, distances, and costs.
since he's never been to Germany, i want to be sure to hit at least one big city with a good history museum or two - which western German cities would you recommend?(Munich, Berlin does not fit) )
With his request or with the itinerary?
We love Berlin, it is our favorite city in Germany and in our top three in Europe. The museums are plentiful and world class, the public transport system is exception, the vibe is unique and electic and prices very reasonable.
Headed back for visit #6 in December. We like Munich but for us, Berlin rules.
And I agree with Aisle Seat = that is a very good itinerary without too much cramming.
With his request or with the itinerary?
We love Berlin, it is our favorite city in Germany and in our top three in Europe. The museums are plentiful and world class, the public transport system is exception, the vibe is unique and electic and prices very reasonable.
Headed back for visit #6 in December. We like Munich but for us, Berlin rules.
And I agree with Aisle Seat = that is a very good itinerary without too much cramming.
Another option is to fly into/out of Zurich(ZRH) and sort of follow dugi's itinerary, only go clockwise - (Rheinfall, Strassburg/Meersburg/Munich/Salzburg/Garmisch/Lindau (maybe with 1/2 day to Bregenz, Austria and Lichtenstein) then around the southern shore of Lake Constance back to ZRH.
thanks again for the replies! 
some work issues have come up and we probably won't be headed to germany until late october/november. and we are tossing around the idea of going after thanksgiving, also, which would allow us to be there for the christmas season (which i love!). based on the comments i received here, and additional research, it might make the most sense for us to stay in southern germany and leave the other areas for a different trip. right now we are planning on a 10 day trip, and i think that'd be enough time to do the following:
Munich (fly in and out of here)
Salzburg (at least a day trip, if not an overnight)
Garmisch area
Lake Constance
obviously that's not a proper order, but i figure we could see those areas without too much stress.
as always, comments and suggestions are welcome! and thanks again for all your assistance!
some work issues have come up and we probably won't be headed to germany until late october/november. and we are tossing around the idea of going after thanksgiving, also, which would allow us to be there for the christmas season (which i love!). based on the comments i received here, and additional research, it might make the most sense for us to stay in southern germany and leave the other areas for a different trip. right now we are planning on a 10 day trip, and i think that'd be enough time to do the following:
Munich (fly in and out of here)
Salzburg (at least a day trip, if not an overnight)
Garmisch area
Lake Constance
obviously that's not a proper order, but i figure we could see those areas without too much stress.
as always, comments and suggestions are welcome! and thanks again for all your assistance!
We love to go for the Advent markets and my advise would be to spend a few nights in Salzburg as it is just lovely at this time of year.
The market at Helbrunn is delightful and the small towns in the Salzkammergut (get there by bus or train) as gorgeous as a post card. St. Gilgen, St. Wolfgang are two that we really enjoy, along with Bad Ischl.
We really enjoyed out day trips to GP as well. Last year we ascended the Zugspitze in late December and it was truly magnificent!
The market at Helbrunn is delightful and the small towns in the Salzkammergut (get there by bus or train) as gorgeous as a post card. St. Gilgen, St. Wolfgang are two that we really enjoy, along with Bad Ischl.
We really enjoyed out day trips to GP as well. Last year we ascended the Zugspitze in late December and it was truly magnificent!
Thanks to everyone for their inputs. We have finally decided on dates, so I am going to close this topic and open a new one that includes those details, so that we can get inputs from everyone.
Thanks again!
Thanks again!
I am with Kfusto. Going after our Thanksging the Christmas Markets are a lot of fun. The weather can be iffy so dress in layers with a waterproof outside layer. The Germans and Austrians are very good at keeping the roads clear so driving is not a huge problem. Munich has several Christmas markets, the big one in the center of town at Marienplatz and the nativity figure market and the mideval market close by.
