PalQ, you certainly paint a stunning picture, I think we are sold on the Mosel though will still take a ride along the Rhine too just to compare.

Hi Betty, I think I will have a look at the places you suggested on the Mosel as an alternative to Cochem then make a decision. A small quieter place sounds nice but I wonder if Sunday makes a difference in Cochem? I had another look at your photo's - sigh!

Thanks heaps to everyone for their suggestions, you have come through yet again.

Hello Maudie, I am going to quite a few of the places you plan to see in May with my husband. We are on a coach tour of Munich, Budapest, Prague, Vienna and Salzburg to begin with. Three nights in each city, and want to do a 1/2 day tour to the Eagle's nest from Salzburg. We then plan to have two nights in Hallstatt, travelling by train.

Originally we had planned to then hire a car in Salzburg and drive to Hohenschwangau at the bottom of the Romantic Road, and work our way up, but the cost of hiring a car in Austria and dropping off in Germany had a fairly hefty penalty rate, so now we are "training" to Munich and will hire the car there (am not much looking forward to navigating out of Munich in a left hand drive car!!). I think my husband said he found that Avis had the best rate. We plan to hire an automatic, so at least we won't have to think about gears & clutch whilst careering around a 4 lane roundabout on the (to us) wrong side!

I see that you plan to get to Rothenburg O.D.T. by train. This is what I had hoped to do when I first started planning our trip over a year ago (!!) - this stage of planning nearly did my head in, as trains don't go into a lot of the towns on the R. Road - this is when we decided to do this bit by car. I know there are local buses to towns like Dinkelsbuhl etc., but we thought if we had a car we could take day trips to other little towns along the R. Road, and stop wherever & whenever we fancied during the day. P.S. We are Aussies too....

P.P.S. Reading bettyk's wonderful trip reports, I noted her mentioning "Gracie", her golden retriever, and suddenly realise that she is "Betty", wife of a gentleman whose photographs of their trips I admired so much (on a photo forum), that I used their pictures to help plan my own trip! Hello to Mr & Mrs K, and thank you!!

Sorry, this has turned into an epic.

Hi Jane,
Thanks so much for your reply. Well if we decide to hire a car for the first part of our trip around the Mosel we can then go to Rothenburg easily but my first choice is Dinkelbuhl but this is a pain on public transport then we can drop off in Regensburg.

We can then hire again outside of Salzburg as suggested for the rest of our trip, but I don't know if two lots of hire car will be too expensive, have yet to investigate this. I will check Avis though, thanks.

Glad someone else feels a bit apprehensive about driving. We went to Europe last year but our friend drove that time, we have some funny memories of the ring road at Rotterdam.......
I hope you will do a trip report when you get back, I will be looking for it.

And yes, those photo's are just amazing.

PS, where are you from Jane?

Hello again. A couple of points in response to Maudie and Jane's comments:
1. Driving on the German Autobahn this september, we found it to be generally congested, many construction slow-downs, some places where you could really speed it up. I had to concentrate a lot to make sure when I could pass, when I could get back in the right lane and when I should exit. The back roads, though, while slower, were so much more fun. There was traffic, but nothing out of the ordinary and in many places, very little. The drive from Freilassing to Berchtesgaden avoids much of the Autobahn

2. I've been in the Rhein/Mosel area with a car and without. While a car gives you flexibility and easier Burg Eltz/Marksburg access, it isn't essential. I love the trains and their much less stressful for the ride to Rothenburg, that I'd be tempted to use public transportation for that portion of the trip.

3. Jane--don't train to Munich to get a car rental. Either go from Hallstatt to Berchtesgaden by train and rent there, or go to Freilassing, just into Germany and adjacent to Salzburg.

4. For the best rental rates and terrific service, contact Bob or Andy Bestor at www.Gemut.com. They will give you awesome service, great advice and better rates than you can do on your own via Avis/Hertz or a consolidator like AutoEurop.

Enjoy your travels.

Oops: NOT "their" much less stressful...

THEY'RE

Hello MissJane. Yes, I remember your comments on David's photos from webshots. Thanks. He really is good, isn't he!!! Your trip sounds wonderful! The weather in May has always been pretty good for us -- I can't wait to hear all about it!

Hi Maudie,
Just in case you'd like to read another trip report and see some more pic's, we were in quite a few of these area's Oct. 2007 and Oct. 2006.

http://fodors.com/forums/threadselec...p;tid=35089110

http://fodors.com/forums/threadselec...p;tid=34893886

Paul

Darn, reviewing all these trip reports and photos makes me want to jump on a plane!!!

Unfortunately, I think our travel will be domestic only this year. Having to do major work to our house, so funds will be limited.

Hello there again JN,
Your comments are just what I wanted to hear!
1. Yes, I think it is the thought of driving on those autobahns that creeps us out. It's one thing to be passenger/navigator but to be the driver, yikes - so back roads sound good to us and I am sure we will enjoy the countryside more.

2. We love train travel as well so it is good to hear your were more than happy going by public transport. I have found the suggested walk from Moselkern train station to Burg Eltz on Bavarian Ben's site which is just the sort of thing we like. To hire a car for this portion and again later will be pushing up the price too much, we will take up PalQ's advice and look into a rail pass for the long stretches. I know we will miss a few things by not having a car but that's ok too, at least we will BE there.

Paul, thank you for your report links, we will enjoy reading them over the weekend.

Hello again Betty, yes unfortunately life gets in the way of holidays, it's a balancing act isn't it? But just think once that house in done you can go again - anyway keep planning and keep posting with your great suggestions.

Ok, I have been giving my little brain a work out and on a Saturday too!

How does this sound - if we train from Vienna to Salzburg and stay for 2 nights then get to Freilassing to hire a car should we then go to St Gilgen to have 3 nights or should we go straight through to Berchtesgaden as JN suggested and have 5 nights there, visiting St Gilgen, Hallstatt etc? Or do we need to stay in St Gilgen to really get the feel of the place?

Now back to the Mosel, I found a few suggestions on Bavarian Bens' site for places to stay at Klotten which is 5 minutes from Cochem, any one any comments on this town? I have only just started looking at accommodation so all suggestions are welcome.

I think the commute from Berteschgaden to Halstatt and St Gilgin is too far

i'd stay in St Gilgin or St Wolfgang or somewhere on Lake Wolfgang and then go from there to Halstatt

IMO i'd spend more days in this area than in Berchestgaden - many more places on interest it seems

We spent 3 nights in Berchtesgaden and then went on to St. Gilgen and spent 3 nights there also. It was only a short drive, but we really wanted to STAY in St Gilgen and not just do it as a day trip. But you can do Berchtesgaden as a day trip from St Gilgen. However, you'd be at the mercy of the weather if you decided to do the Eagle's Nest. But you could still do the boat trip on Koenigsee even if the weather wasn't perfect.

Google shows the drive between St. Gilgen and Berchtesgaden to be about an hour.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&tab=wl

There's just so much time and so much to see and do. It's really hard to decide, isn't it!!

Hello Maudie - I am in Tasmania... Can I ask where you are? At certain stages of planning, I thought my head would explode, and had to just LEAVE IT ALONE for a few days - have you reached that point yet? If not, rest assured, it will come! But I'm sure it will all be worthwile in the end.

JN - thanks so much for the good advice - I definately think secondary roads are the best plan! I thought I had this all sorted, but now you've made me think twice and I will have to go back and review plans. Thanks also for the car hire link - will investigate.

bettyk - I'm sad to think I won't be seeing another album from you and Mr K in the near future, but yes, real life does have an irritating habit of eating up spare cash! Do you have a vague plan of your next trip yet? I don't know about you, but as soon as I get back from one, I start dreaming of the next.

MissJane, we've been thinking about Poland. David's ancestors are from Poland and he's been wanting to go there for awhile. We might incorporate that with another visit to Germany. I love Germany, Austria and Switzerland and altho we've been there a number of times recently, I never get tired of it. There seems to be something new and exciting around every corner!

Depending on what we do, there still might be a new album this year -- just not of Europe!

Hi Betty,
Well you hit the nail on the head, the reason we decided to stay 2 nights in Berchtesgaden as well as nights in St Gilgen was that everyone said you have to BE there to enjoy the places. I am just trying not to move accommodation too much. Maybe we should kill the nights in Berchtesgaden and stay 5 nights in St Gilgen and do it for a day trip, something to ponder seeing as it is only a hour.
Yes, it is hard trying to do justice to everything. Did you have any thoughts on Klotten, Betty?

Friends just got back from Poland and they said it was worth going just for the icecream - amazing creations even one that looked like Spaghetti Bolognese!

Hello again, Jane. I am over here in WA, about 20kms from Perth. No, haven't had the exploding head yet, I am more organised this time around. Last year we spend 8 weeks in Europe and that did my head in for a while. We went to the Netherlands, Denmark, London, Norway and Switzerland so 5 weeks in virtually one place is a breeze compared to that. I have done a heap of reading here and have hopefully picked the best itinerary for us, think I am nearly there thanks to all the great advice we have received. Have to start looking at accommodation now that we have nailed down the overnights.

Maudie, I don't know enough about Klotten to give an opinion but it looks nice from their website. And the location is great. I'm sure it will be fine. You'll have easy access to Cochem and you could even visit the castle in Beilstein if you have time.

http://www.klotten-info.de/

Yes, I thought it looked nice too and we have found a nice place to stay right on the river edge with a beer garden out front, looks great.
Thanks for the suggestion of the Beilstein castle, I will look that up.

Thanks again Betty for all your help - you have been outstanding. Wish I could give you a bouquet of flowers but you will just have to be happy with a virtual one!

Maudie, I did not realise you were such a seasoned traveller - I should love to see your itinerary when you have got it to the "final draft" stage!

I wish now that I had allowed us time to visit Mittenwald, like you, but there is never enough time and something always has to (regretfully) go. I'd love to stay in Worms too, just so I could say I spent a night in Worms. I just love that name! I'll be happy to post a trip report on our return.

Are you staying in Salzburg at all? The more I read about Salzburg, the more I am looking forward to staying there - also, my travel agent said it is her favourite city in the world - that's some praise! Most of our accommodation is at two star B& B's with, I hope, lots of local flavour, but we are treating ourself to 3 nights at the Wolf Dietrich in Salzburg, where I got a fantastic price on Expedia.

Other places we are both planning to go to - in Rothenburg O.D.T., we are staying at the Gasthof Goldener Greifen, in Wuerzburg the hotel Gruener Baum, and in Hallstatt, the Gasthof Pension Gruner Anger, if that is any help to you....

I hope you'll forgive me for hijacking your thread to thank JN for their wonderful hint to me?

JN - I've just worked out that your hint to hire a car in Freilassing would save us backtracking from Hallstatt to Salzburg to Munich (not to mention avoiding driving out of Munich), so saving us time and anguish!! I am so grateful to you.

Betty - I shall look forward to yours and Davids next album/s very much, whether from abroad or not! I always think it's a fantastic idea to go back to where your forbears come from. When I first went to England, where my mother came from (and I had always longed to visit), it was so weird, because if felt like coming home. Race memory, or too many Enid Blyton books as a child?

Hi jane,
No I wouldn't use the term seasoned traveler just yet - but maybe one day!!!

Worms, yes great name and was it you that mentioned Bad Aussee or something similar? I couldn't find it on our map. I am sure we will love Mittenwald too. Yes, we have decided to stay 2 nights in Salzburg, I think we will look at Haus Am Moos B&B that Ira suggested, another name that tickles my fancy, but will look at Wolf Dietrich. I will also have a look at your suggestion for Rothenburg, we seem to like similar accommodation.

We stayed in Pensions and B&B's last year and didn't have one complaint, we don't need expensive accommodation and feel more at home in simpler places. I will post back here later when we get ourselves sorted out. I will look forward to reading your report too.

No problem with having a chat to JN, I have just hijacked the post about the 4 days on the Rhine!!!