german cuisine-need advise!
Aug 27th, 2006, 09:31 AM
#101
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Nessundorma, that's just plain rubbish. I've eaten wonderfully all over the U.S. Blame your poor choices, not the availability of good food in the U.S. American food doesn't have to be encased in fat; that's just another snob stereotype.
And I've lived in Europe for years, so it's not as if I don't an international reference for comparison.
Saying you can't eat well in the U.S. is as false as saying that German food is all pork and potato. Nonsense.
And I've lived in Europe for years, so it's not as if I don't an international reference for comparison.
Saying you can't eat well in the U.S. is as false as saying that German food is all pork and potato. Nonsense.
Aug 27th, 2006, 11:00 AM
#102
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Well, la de dah BTilke. If I'm the intolerant snob here, than so be it.
About four months ago I returned from several weeks in Texas -- Houston, Galveston, Austin and much of the bbq trail of the hill country -- and every place I ate had been highly recommended, by Fodorites and published food guides, for either its authentic food or its chef. The food ranged from mediocre to just plain awful. The only exception was Vietnamese food in Houston.
And that has been my experience throughout the country. Hands down the best food is in New York and Los Angeles. Otherwise, a lot of grease, a lot of salt, a lot of food that isn't served hot, a lot of tasteless vegetables, a lot of overdone fish -- and mainly just a LOT instead of something fresh and hot and good.
I'm still waiting for a list of good burger joints in NYC.
About four months ago I returned from several weeks in Texas -- Houston, Galveston, Austin and much of the bbq trail of the hill country -- and every place I ate had been highly recommended, by Fodorites and published food guides, for either its authentic food or its chef. The food ranged from mediocre to just plain awful. The only exception was Vietnamese food in Houston.
And that has been my experience throughout the country. Hands down the best food is in New York and Los Angeles. Otherwise, a lot of grease, a lot of salt, a lot of food that isn't served hot, a lot of tasteless vegetables, a lot of overdone fish -- and mainly just a LOT instead of something fresh and hot and good.
I'm still waiting for a list of good burger joints in NYC.
Aug 27th, 2006, 11:10 AM
#103
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The ingredients they use are of really good quality, it's just a shame that the results are so poor. I had the worst breakfast ever at a "Dennys" chain restaurant. Inexpensive and bad..., but it was full of people...
OTOH in Las Vegas, they served some fabulous food in the big hotels!
OTOH in Las Vegas, they served some fabulous food in the big hotels!
Aug 27th, 2006, 11:17 AM
#104
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I keep hearing the food at Vegas hotels and casinos is good. Some of the best food I had in Canada was at a casino in Hull, and the best meal I had in Atlantic City was at a casino (although it had its problems!) I think it's a culture unto itself.
Anyway, there is no resolving food fights. I've been thinking of cooking my favorite gumbo recipe tonight in honor of NOLA. (It calls for baking the roux, which works out really well.)
Anyway, there is no resolving food fights. I've been thinking of cooking my favorite gumbo recipe tonight in honor of NOLA. (It calls for baking the roux, which works out really well.)
Aug 27th, 2006, 11:34 AM
#106
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bellacqui,
we might have met - either at DWH (nowadays people dine in two shifts!) or Petit Café. Love their "Blechkuchen". I am also familiar with Luehmanns Teestube (great place for tea and scones), but do not frequent it that often as it's too far out of the way for me.
When visiting, make sure to try the cakes of "Sweet Dreams" at Lehmweg - not too far from Petit Café! Divine.
nessundorma,
I think the quality of food available in America has increased significantly. I have had more than just a few outstanding experiences in Southern California - in L.A. and outside, e.g. Santa Barbara, the Santa Ynez Valley, San Diego. Great produce available in stores, too. Even the quality of the bread is so much better now as compared to about 10 to 20 years ago.
we might have met - either at DWH (nowadays people dine in two shifts!) or Petit Café. Love their "Blechkuchen". I am also familiar with Luehmanns Teestube (great place for tea and scones), but do not frequent it that often as it's too far out of the way for me.
When visiting, make sure to try the cakes of "Sweet Dreams" at Lehmweg - not too far from Petit Café! Divine.
nessundorma,
I think the quality of food available in America has increased significantly. I have had more than just a few outstanding experiences in Southern California - in L.A. and outside, e.g. Santa Barbara, the Santa Ynez Valley, San Diego. Great produce available in stores, too. Even the quality of the bread is so much better now as compared to about 10 to 20 years ago.
Aug 27th, 2006, 01:03 PM
#107
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Sweet Dreams, hsv, reading the name alone made my senses fill with the aroma of butter. It is so lovely. Those guys really understand the fine art of baking....they add so much to Hamburg. You are making me homesick for the Hansestadt!!
PS Good news about the Champions League..
About the States: Food, good food is available in all of the metropolitan areas... It is a question of price and finding the right places. Philly, for example, has become as much of a restaurant town as Chicago, with its theme restaurant entrepreneural spirit ala Lettuce Entertain You. LA has always had food, I lived in the OC for years and can attest that outstanding cuisine has been alive and well there for more than twenty years. Honolulu, New York, Chicago, Philly, ... I mean, if you can not find a great abalone steak, beef steak, calamari steak, veal steak or cheese steak in one of those cities you just have not looked hard enough. Sorry, good food is everywhere to be found. Even in the United States.
PS Good news about the Champions League..
About the States: Food, good food is available in all of the metropolitan areas... It is a question of price and finding the right places. Philly, for example, has become as much of a restaurant town as Chicago, with its theme restaurant entrepreneural spirit ala Lettuce Entertain You. LA has always had food, I lived in the OC for years and can attest that outstanding cuisine has been alive and well there for more than twenty years. Honolulu, New York, Chicago, Philly, ... I mean, if you can not find a great abalone steak, beef steak, calamari steak, veal steak or cheese steak in one of those cities you just have not looked hard enough. Sorry, good food is everywhere to be found. Even in the United States.
Aug 27th, 2006, 01:21 PM
#109
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I've spent a lot of time in Germany, and I enjoy the food. The Schnitzel is great and usually not that expensive. I remember two years ago finding Jägerschnitzel and Zigeunerschnitzel on most menus for less than €10, complete with a salad and Spätzle or Pomme Fritz.
German salads, by the way, are more than the American iceberg lettuce with a few pieces of tomato and cucumber. A "gemischte salat" usually includes cole slaw, potato salad, cucumber, shredded carrots, lots of veggies.
Jägerschnitzel is a boneless slice of meat (usually pork) fried lightly, with a brown sauce with mushrooms. Zigeunerschnitzel is a similar cut in a sauce of onions and red, green, and yellow pepper. I can sometimes be a little "pikant" from cayanne pepper.
I love Spätzle, but the Pomme Fritz in Germany are wonderful.
Looking back at my expense sheets, my total expense for meals, per day, has averaged about €20 including modest tips and bier. Of course, breakfast is included with the room. I normally stay in small towns, so that makes the expenses less.
I suggest you pick up a copy of "Marlings Menu Master" for Germany. It should be on Amazon for less than $10. Small, easy to carry, and good reading for the plane on the way over. It explains a lot about the menus.
German salads, by the way, are more than the American iceberg lettuce with a few pieces of tomato and cucumber. A "gemischte salat" usually includes cole slaw, potato salad, cucumber, shredded carrots, lots of veggies.
Jägerschnitzel is a boneless slice of meat (usually pork) fried lightly, with a brown sauce with mushrooms. Zigeunerschnitzel is a similar cut in a sauce of onions and red, green, and yellow pepper. I can sometimes be a little "pikant" from cayanne pepper.
I love Spätzle, but the Pomme Fritz in Germany are wonderful.
Looking back at my expense sheets, my total expense for meals, per day, has averaged about €20 including modest tips and bier. Of course, breakfast is included with the room. I normally stay in small towns, so that makes the expenses less.
I suggest you pick up a copy of "Marlings Menu Master" for Germany. It should be on Amazon for less than $10. Small, easy to carry, and good reading for the plane on the way over. It explains a lot about the menus.
Aug 27th, 2006, 03:22 PM
#110
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Hi ness,
>Los Angeles and New York (and probably now Los Vegas) are the still the best places to eat.<
You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but I believe that your dining experiences might be of the sort that are a mile wide and an inch deep.
>New York City ...[has] some of the best classic Jewish delis on the planet,...<
This once was true - about the time that I was in college - but I can't agree that it is still true.
Check out Baltimore.
>Los Angeles and New York (and probably now Los Vegas) are the still the best places to eat.<
You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but I believe that your dining experiences might be of the sort that are a mile wide and an inch deep.
>New York City ...[has] some of the best classic Jewish delis on the planet,...<
This once was true - about the time that I was in college - but I can't agree that it is still true.
Check out Baltimore.
Aug 27th, 2006, 03:29 PM
#111
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Leaving aside the silliness that one can't find wonderful food across America, anyone truly interested in German cuisine should try to get their hands on Culinaria Germany by Christine Metzger. It's a superb coffee table book telling you almost everything you'd want to know about food in Germany. Full of gorgeous photos (of food and the regions the food is from), excellent recipes, historical anecdotes, etc.
We have a copy in French that we picked up in Bourges two years ago and it's one of our favorite coffee table books.
It's out of print, but copies can still be found. Definitely worth getting if you can locate one!
http://www.allbookstores.com/book/38...a:germany.html
We have a copy in French that we picked up in Bourges two years ago and it's one of our favorite coffee table books.
It's out of print, but copies can still be found. Definitely worth getting if you can locate one!
http://www.allbookstores.com/book/38...a:germany.html
Aug 27th, 2006, 03:34 PM
#112
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>If you want to eat well in America, it's best to stick to ethnic food made by immigrants. <
Wall, goll dang, Ness. Y'all an I agree 'bout that (pronounced sort of like "they at" bu t not exactly).
Fur as ah can recall, it's all ethnic cookin' bah immugrints.
English, Dutch, Spanish, French, Carib, African, German, Norwegian, Swedish, Danish, Irish, Italian, Sicilian, Portugese, Polish, Hungarian, Russian, Indian, Chinese, Vietnamese, Thai, Mexican, South American, Moroccan, as well as Jewish variations on the above, to name a few.
Wall, goll dang, Ness. Y'all an I agree 'bout that (pronounced sort of like "they at" bu t not exactly).
Fur as ah can recall, it's all ethnic cookin' bah immugrints.
English, Dutch, Spanish, French, Carib, African, German, Norwegian, Swedish, Danish, Irish, Italian, Sicilian, Portugese, Polish, Hungarian, Russian, Indian, Chinese, Vietnamese, Thai, Mexican, South American, Moroccan, as well as Jewish variations on the above, to name a few.
Aug 27th, 2006, 03:35 PM
#113
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Some more info about the book, including reviews. The publishers might do a reprint--although I can read my French copy, I would love to get a copy in English.
http://www.free-recipes.co.uk/recipe...Culinaria.html
http://www.free-recipes.co.uk/recipe...Culinaria.html
Aug 27th, 2006, 04:35 PM
#114
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Nessundorma - Relax. And please don't perpetuate the NYC (or in your case NJ) food snob sterotype! It's a bit outdated.
As a 15 year resident of Manhattan, I can assure you there is equally great food all over the US that is usually cheaper, and served in a much nicer atmosphere where your fellow diners are not virtually in your lap and you can actually get a table before 10 o'clock.
Keep looking! It's a big country out there.
As a 15 year resident of Manhattan, I can assure you there is equally great food all over the US that is usually cheaper, and served in a much nicer atmosphere where your fellow diners are not virtually in your lap and you can actually get a table before 10 o'clock.
Keep looking! It's a big country out there.
Sep 3rd, 2006, 05:43 AM
#115
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Really food is OK in Germany. We were OK - there is a lot of sausage as fast food, but heh. Otherwise I have to concur that Italian is big there. I agree with a previous post that there is an abundance of bread in various forms. Some of the best meals we had were on the ICE trains watching the world rush by, and eating pretty decent meals.
Sep 3rd, 2006, 06:33 AM
#116
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My advi<b>c</b>e would be to study a German food translator before you arrive. That way, DH will have some idea of what's what. I absolutely crave things like <i>rahmschnitzel</i> (pork cutlet in cream gravy), <i>sauerbraten</i> (marinated, spiced pot roast), and Black Forest Ham. A few garden vegetables and spätzle on the side, and he's set.
Sep 3rd, 2006, 07:00 AM
#117
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amaclise,
I don't think I'm the one who needs to relax here. I've lived in NYC a lot longer than 15 years (I have a house in NJ) but I rarely go to mid-priced restaurants where you need reservations. You and other Americans who've taken offense need to understand I'm not criticizing *you*. I'm talking about American food. You are *not* what you eat.
The problem with American cuisine (yes, there is such a thing after 200 plus years) isn't a lack of good chefs in America and who can dispute anybody's assertion they had a good restaurant meal in Utah? The problem with American cuisine is the American tolerance for ingredients that are of poor quality to begin with or were flown or trucked long distances. American menus revolve around a very narrow range of ideas and ingredients, and many "traditional" American "favorites" are just about inedible.
I don't want to send people back into a tizzy of defending the heartland, but if "y'all" as Ira would say can eat Thanksgiving turkey, or most of what gets served up as American bbq, or any sweet sauces, all those chicken breasts, everything cold mixed with commerical mayonnaise or Oreos, I envy your enjoyment. But along with Dutch cuisine and what *used* to be English cuisine, traditional American cuisine -- which is what you will still find on 99 percent of American menus with the addition of herb butters, herb crusts and confits -- lacks the exciting variety you find in Italian, French, Chinese, Japanese, Indian, etc. It's just plain boring and most often not well made anyway.
I don't think I'm the one who needs to relax here. I've lived in NYC a lot longer than 15 years (I have a house in NJ) but I rarely go to mid-priced restaurants where you need reservations. You and other Americans who've taken offense need to understand I'm not criticizing *you*. I'm talking about American food. You are *not* what you eat.
The problem with American cuisine (yes, there is such a thing after 200 plus years) isn't a lack of good chefs in America and who can dispute anybody's assertion they had a good restaurant meal in Utah? The problem with American cuisine is the American tolerance for ingredients that are of poor quality to begin with or were flown or trucked long distances. American menus revolve around a very narrow range of ideas and ingredients, and many "traditional" American "favorites" are just about inedible.
I don't want to send people back into a tizzy of defending the heartland, but if "y'all" as Ira would say can eat Thanksgiving turkey, or most of what gets served up as American bbq, or any sweet sauces, all those chicken breasts, everything cold mixed with commerical mayonnaise or Oreos, I envy your enjoyment. But along with Dutch cuisine and what *used* to be English cuisine, traditional American cuisine -- which is what you will still find on 99 percent of American menus with the addition of herb butters, herb crusts and confits -- lacks the exciting variety you find in Italian, French, Chinese, Japanese, Indian, etc. It's just plain boring and most often not well made anyway.
Sep 3rd, 2006, 07:08 AM
#119
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The best pork I've ever eaten has been in Berlin and Salzburg. In Berlin it was Eisbein, served with sauerkraut and boiled potatoes. In Salzburg it was Schweinhaxe, served with sauerkraut and a huge dumpling. In both cases, washed down with a cold "helles" beer.
They really know how to prepare sauerkraut in those counties. If all you know is the American ballpark stuff, you will be pleasantly surprised.
In Berlin there is a department store on the Kudamm called KaDeWe. In it is a food court with sampling stations. You can try fish at one station, variety meats at another, etc. A great way to sample sausages from all over German-speaking Europe.
Bill in Connecticut
They really know how to prepare sauerkraut in those counties. If all you know is the American ballpark stuff, you will be pleasantly surprised.
In Berlin there is a department store on the Kudamm called KaDeWe. In it is a food court with sampling stations. You can try fish at one station, variety meats at another, etc. A great way to sample sausages from all over German-speaking Europe.
Bill in Connecticut
Sep 3rd, 2006, 07:50 AM
#120
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It's interesting. I just googled "American cuisine" and of course the first link to pop up was Wikipedia. In their list of American foods and recipes, only a hnadful are what I would consider edible and most of them are not served in restaurants in New York.
Amish Friendship Bread
Apple Pie
Boston baked beans
Brownies
Buffalo wings
Buffalo steaks and burgers
Chicago-style pizza
Chili con carne
Chocolate chip cookies
Chop suey
Corn dogs
Corn on the cob
Cream cheese
Disco fries
Fortune cookies
French Fries
Fried chicken
Fudge
Grits
Grilled pizza
Gumbo
Hamburgers
Hoagie
Hot dish
Hotcakes
Hush puppies
Ice cream cone
Jambalaya
Macaroni and cheese
Pancake
Peanut butter
Peanut butter and jelly sandwich
Pecan pie
Pecan pralines
Popcorn
Philadelphia cheesesteak
Potato Chips
Pumpkin pie
Scrapple
Shoo-fly pie
Sloppy joe
Sweet potato pie
Thanksgiving Dinner (Roast Turkey, Cranberry sauce, etc.)
Whoopie pies
and Wikipedia's American recipes:
1-2-3-4 Cake
Apple Pie
Artichoke Hearts Attack
Barbecued Spare Ribs
Barbeque Sauce - Kansas City style
Beef and Barley Stew
Biscuits
Chocolate Chip Cookies
Cottage Cheese Eggs
Denver Crunch
Grilled Cheese Sandwich
Grilled Peanut Butter Sandwiches
Low Country Shrimp and Grits
No Bake Chocolate Chip Cookie Pie
One-Hour Thanksgiving Dinner
Peach Cobbler
Pumpkin Pie
Rice and Beef Soup
Southwestern Scramble
Spicy Chicken Casserole
S'more
Toasted Cheese Sandwich
Tomato with Cheese Stuffing
Turkey Biscuit
Amish Friendship Bread
Apple Pie
Boston baked beans
Brownies
Buffalo wings
Buffalo steaks and burgers
Chicago-style pizza
Chili con carne
Chocolate chip cookies
Chop suey
Corn dogs
Corn on the cob
Cream cheese
Disco fries
Fortune cookies
French Fries
Fried chicken
Fudge
Grits
Grilled pizza
Gumbo
Hamburgers
Hoagie
Hot dish
Hotcakes
Hush puppies
Ice cream cone
Jambalaya
Macaroni and cheese
Pancake
Peanut butter
Peanut butter and jelly sandwich
Pecan pie
Pecan pralines
Popcorn
Philadelphia cheesesteak
Potato Chips
Pumpkin pie
Scrapple
Shoo-fly pie
Sloppy joe
Sweet potato pie
Thanksgiving Dinner (Roast Turkey, Cranberry sauce, etc.)
Whoopie pies
and Wikipedia's American recipes:
1-2-3-4 Cake
Apple Pie
Artichoke Hearts Attack
Barbecued Spare Ribs
Barbeque Sauce - Kansas City style
Beef and Barley Stew
Biscuits
Chocolate Chip Cookies
Cottage Cheese Eggs
Denver Crunch
Grilled Cheese Sandwich
Grilled Peanut Butter Sandwiches
Low Country Shrimp and Grits
No Bake Chocolate Chip Cookie Pie
One-Hour Thanksgiving Dinner
Peach Cobbler
Pumpkin Pie
Rice and Beef Soup
Southwestern Scramble
Spicy Chicken Casserole
S'more
Toasted Cheese Sandwich
Tomato with Cheese Stuffing
Turkey Biscuit
