My husband and I plan to travel to France and Spain in September/October 2017 for about 5 weeks. We have only been to Europe once before, when in 2015 we spent an amazing 5 weeks in Croatia and Italy.
I have been reading guidebooks and searching websites for weeks now making copious notes so although we are in the early stages of our planning, it’s time to seek some help.....

To set the scene: my husband and I are in our early 60s, fit for our age (him more than me) and we love a gorgeous view, scenery, hiking, biking, kayaking and a glass of wine (or2) with a simple meal. We also love the history that Europe offers but definitely need to break up the museum/ art gallery visits with breaks from the crowds and quiet walks. We enjoy the atmosphere and sights of big cities but after a few days, we crave the slower pace of smaller, further out towns and villages.
We have learnt to travel relatively slowly where we have a 'must see' list but then also build in rest days where we just wander and enjoy with no plans at all. Trouble is, slower travel means more places you have to cut out and more decisions have to be made. The more we read, the harder it becomes!

So far we are thinking……
PARIS 6 nights (mid September)
Train Paris to Annecy
ANNECY 2 nights
Hire Car.
TALLOIRES 3 nights (possibly 4?)
• I know we are changing accommodation from Annecy to Talloires rather than basing ourselves in one or the other for a 5 night stretch but thought the 2 days in Annecy could be car free so we don’t have to worry about parking. We could enjoy the 'old town', hire bikes and ride the lake and take a boat ride. When staying in Talloires, we would make use of the car to visit Switzerland, Mt Blanc and The Semnoz as well as nearby villages.

Drive to Provence
PROVENCE 5 nights Need some help here.... Really having trouble making a decision as we can’t picture the distance between the towns of Provence and the difference between staying in one area or another.
Thinking of staying in or near Pernes Les Fontaines but like the look of L’Isle sur le Sogue and Saint Saturnin as well.
Drive to Nice: want to return hire car somewhere near here....
NICE/VILLEFRANCHE: 3 nights (not sure which to stay in, will rely on public transport)
Fly to Spain from Nice: 12 nights (Still to be planned)
What do you think?

Alternatively, the Dordogne and the French Basque country for your stay in France, speding a couple of days driving down to the Dordogne to see parts of the Loire valley.

To whet your appetite:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mksfca...7624827253292/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mksfca...575935008/show

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mksfca...163616289/show

To avoid a stiff cross-border drop-off fee on your car rental, drop off your car near the Spanish border and pick one up in Spain. Hendaye would make sense in my suggested itinerary, as there is a local commuter line from there to San Sebastian.

I would always choose the Dordogne and Basque Country over Provence, but that's just me. I think I've overdosed on Provence.

There's no need not to be able to "picture the distance between towns in Provence." Look at a small-scale map and calculate.

Anyway, if that's what you want to do, it sounds like a fine plan to me.

Keysie57 this looks like a nice relaxed plan. You can drop your rental in Avignon or Aix en Provence at the TGV station (both out of the city center) and take the train to Nice. From what I remember it's not a very nice drive, that is, on the highway anyways.

I am also hoping for recommendations on where to base in Provence and hotels in Nice for a trip in September. I have been perusing trip reports and it seems there are many apartments in Nice.

Welcome to Fodors!!

You might consider reversing your itinerary and start in Nice and end in Paris. This will give you a little more "summer" along the Cote d'Azur and Provence. October is perfect in Paris. Should not be too hot. Probably better flight options to Spain from Paris than from Nice.

We stayed in a gite in Talloires for 2 weeks several years ago - and it was very easy to drive into Annecy to visit for the day, or have dinner, or just wander around at night. IMO, Annecy can be thoroughly explored in about 2 hours. We spent most of our time in the Annecy region driving through the Alps & visiting beautiful areas. We were in Mt Blanc for 1 week this past September.

Where to stay in Provence. My wife & I have spent 20 weeks in Provence and going back for 2 more next year. Our favorite region is the Luberon. We've stayed near Gordes for 4 weeks and in Goult for 2 weeks (both in the Luberon). We've also stayed in Bedoin near Mt Ventoux for 8 weeks, near St Remy for 2 weeks, near Uzes for 2 weeks and near Vaison for 2 weeks. I think St Remy is a good place to base if you want the best access (IMO) to most of the sites people want to visit. You can walk to dinner, shops, cafes, and lots of English is spoken in St Remy (that may either be a plus or a minus). Its a good place to base if you want to be in a city. We prefer the countryside - that's why we've spent most of our time in other "countryside" areas of Provence. I would not base in Aix (too remote), or Avignon (too much ugly sprawl that you'll have to drive through).

We've also spent 20 weeks on the Cote D'Azur - mostly in & around Nice - but also 5 weeks in St Tropez. Here is where we've stayed in Nice
http://www.nicepebbles.com/nice-fran...t/rentals/242/

I have a 30+ page itinerary for Provence & Coth d'Azur and another itinerary for Annecy. I've sent my various itineraries to over 6,000 people on Fodors. If you would like a copy, e-mail me at [email protected] & I'll attach one to the reply e-mail. I also have an itinerary for the Dordogne (13 weeks there) and another for the Pays Basque (4 weeks there).

Stu Dudley

A couple of years ago, we spent 10 days in Provence. We split it up into 5 days in Gordes exploring the Luberon and then 5 days based in St. Remy. It was a really nice way to visit the 2 different areas. Although, it's only about an hour's drive between the 2 towns, staying in Gordes allowed us to drive to the places that were north of Gordes without a long day of driving. Staying in St. Remy allowed us to see the sights south.

I agree with Stu that St. Remy makes a good centralized place for the area. One day we drove to the Pont du Gard with a picnic lunch and rented canoes and paddled down to the bridge. Great way to see it and have a nice day on the water. Later, we visited Uzes which was really beautiful.

This year, we visited St. Tropez and Nice staying for a few days in each place. We've been to Burgundy and also to the Dordogne and I must say that this trip was our least enjoyable. We drove from Crillon-le-Brave to St. Tropez and I must say, the last half of the drive was not very scenic. I found the change from being in a more quiet area with small villages rather jarring to be in Nice which is a large city. I've gone from Provence to Paris and not had that feeling, so it had to be something more than just being in a city. I guess we all have our cup of tea and Nice was not mine. I guess for that reason, I would reverse the trip too if possible as I would not like to risk ending my trip to France in a place that might disappoint and Paris never disappoints!

Thanks to those who have replied. All very helpful and more thinking to be done….

Whenever you plan, you have to have a starting point. I knew we wanted to visit Paris and there was something about the Annecy area that captured my imagination. I like the idea of the ‘little Venice’ and being able to ride around the lake. I also like the idea of being close to the Switzerland border and driving across to Lausanne. It seemed easy to catch the train from Paris to Annecy so that was where we started.

However, nothing is set until we book it so the changing, tweaking and second guessing can continue for a while yet….
If we stick to this first itinerary, I like the advice and reasoning from StuDudley and topeater to reverse it and end in Paris.

Michael, your photos are lovely. The decision on whether to explore the Dordogne area or Provence continues to be a huge one for us.
I spent many hours on the computer entering differing versions of ‘Dordogne or Provence’ and reading many trip reports and from all I have read, we would love the scenery and history of the Dordogne area and the canoeing down the rivers sounded so relaxing.

In fact, our first itinerary draft had us including the Dordogne and not visiting Nice and Côte d'Azur area. In that version, we planned to drive from Pernes les Fontaines (stopping somewhere overnight) and spend 5 nights in Beynac before driving to Bordeaux and catching the train to Spain.
The reason we changed this was I thought I might be trying to ‘see and do too much’ as so many experts warn against. It seemed a long way from Provence to Dordogne for just 5 nights. This will be our first time driving in Europe and as we don’t speak French, I am sure that even with a TomTom the navigation and decision making of which roads to take will be a challenge in itself (to say nothing of a different countries speed limits and road rules)

It is possible though. We could…
Fly into Bordeaux (mid Sept)
Hire car and spend 5 nights Beynac
Drive to Provence
Stay 1 night on way at?
5 nights St Remy (or nearby)
5 nights Annecy/Tailloires
Drop car
Train to Paris 5 nights

Any thoughts? Does this still sound relaxing Sundriedtopepo?

Yes it does. The drive through the vineyards on the way to Dordogne is very pretty.

We are staying in Sarlat then driving to Carcassonne before continuing on to Provence.

Dropping the car and training to Paris is a great idea.

You really have:

4 days in Beynac
1/2 day in Carcassonne
4 1/4 days in St Remy
4 days in Annecy
4 1/2 days in Paris

Doable - but is it relaxing??????

IMO:
- Annecy itself is about a B+. The "most photographed" "little Venice" building was covered with netting & scaffolding in late Sept this year. The surrounding Alps are an A. But you'll need to be in the car to explore the Alps.
- Provence is an A
- Dordogne is an A
- Carcassonne is a B - but only a 2 1/2 hr visit.

You can drive from Beynac to St Remy in 6 1/2 hrs - plus a 2 hr stop in Carcassonne to break up the drive. This would give you an extra night in Provence or the Dordogne of Paris.

I would drop 1 night in Annecy and do the 6 1/2 hr drive, and add 1 night each to Provence & the Dordogne.

OR

I would drop Annecy completely, and land at CDG & immediately take the TGV to Avignon.

- Provence 7 nights/6 days, split between St Remy & Gordes
- Dorodgne 7 nights/6 days. St Cirq Lapopie 2 nights/2 full days (stuff east of the A2o), Beynac 5 nights/4 full days
- Train from Brive la Gaillarde to Paris, & Paris 7 nights/6 days.

Stu Dudley

<i>Train from Brive la Gaillarde to Paris, & Paris 7 nights/6 days.</i>

The OP was thinking of going to Spain.

>>The OP was thinking of going to Spain.<<

And then fly to Spain from Paris.

Stu Dudley

I think you should trust your instincts a little Kelsie. As you said you have done a lot of research and you chose these places that you wanted to see and I don't think that you need to completely renovate your plan.

There are no bad choices. I have never seen anything in Europe that I regretted. I also don't feel the need to visit every single town in an area. Pick the ones you want to visit and normally those will give you a good representation of the area.

Thanks again for giving me imput. I like reading other peoples views and taking time to consider them but then as topepo kindly says, in the end we just need to make the decision and enjoy whatever trip we have planned.

It looks like all who have answered think it is a good idea to try and build in Dordogne and drop Cote D'Azur. We like the idea of visiting some of the charming French villages people speak about in Provence (yes, I do realise they exist in other regions too..)but we are not heavily into markets, 1 or 2 would be plenty for us. As I said before we appreciate the feeling of being amongst buildings and streets that have existed for centuries (so different from Australia)and love peaceful scenery, taking time to enjoy through lovely walks, canoeing, cycling etc.

I'll spend a week or so doing some more research and after discussions with my other half, I'll get back to you with more queries I'm sure. Maybe we can even build in a couple more days as that can make a big difference.

<i>And then fly to Spain from Paris. </i>

Why not drop off the car close to the Spanish border?

>>And then fly to Spain from Paris.<<

>Why not drop off the car close to the Spanish border?<

They want to spend some time in Paris.

From the OP:

>>It is possible though. We could…
Fly into Bordeaux (mid Sept)
Hire car and spend 5 nights Beynac
Drive to Provence
Stay 1 night on way at?
5 nights St Remy (or nearby)
5 nights Annecy/Tailloires
Drop car
Train to Paris 5 nights<<

Stu Dudley

Hi Keysie
I am in the middle of planning my 5th trip to France. I love all things France.
This trip we too will visit Annecy for the first time. However we fly into Geneva from Croatia. We too like kayaking, biking, walking etc. Our visit will by in July.

In 2009 we did a trip to France for a month (I did do a trip report for that trip). We spent a week in an apartment in Paris, absolutely loved it. We then caught a TGV train to Avignon picked up our rental car and rented a farmhouse in Buoux, a tiny village in the Luberon area of Provence. Stayed 2 weeks and used it as a base, such a wonderful time. We mixed it up with day trips, walks and a trip to the seaside.

We then drove to Sarlat in the Dordogne for 1 week using Sarlat as a base (this drive was done in 1 day). Such a lovely contrasting area to Provence with wonderful places and villages to visit and lush countryside. We then drove to Bordeaux airport for the next part of out trip.

Our trip was in September/October. My favourite time to visit. I think your travel style is very similar to ours, so maybe worth having a look at my trip report. We found the driving experience very good.

There are many helpful travellers on this forum (that have given me lots of valuable information) but I am happy to help with any questions as well.

If you do decide on the Dordogne, I surely wouldn't focus on Beynac. Yes, it's pretty. It's also close to impossible to get in and out of with the road construction that's been going on for the last year. Plus, it is always (even in September/October) maddeningly jammed with tourists. Very hard to get any sort of "local flavor" in Beynac that isn't totally contrived. A boat trip on one of the gabarres from there, on the other hand, is always worth the hour or so it takes.

We were near Beynac for 1 week in late Sept this year. I didn't see anything "jammed" with tourists around Beynac. Sarlat was crowded, though. There was construction going on that delayed us for about 20 mins getting through Beynac heading west - and that was quite frustrating. But only once out of maybe 8 trips through Beynac. One of those trips was to & from the weekly market in St Cyprien - which is on a Sunday and perhaps they don't do construction on Sundays. We drove through it later that same day to visit some of the Patrimoine sites that we wanted to visit that weekend.

This past trip was perhaps the 8th or 9th week we've spent in the Beynac region in Sept. It's never seemed crowded to us (except for markets & Sarlat). However, "crowded" is quite subjective.

Stu Dudley

<i> Very hard to get any sort of "local flavor" in Beynac that isn't totally contrived.</i>

Often the fate of designated <i>plus beau village</i>.