In June I will taking my first trip to Europe. I will be there for 4 weeks (I'm a teacher w/ summers off). I am planning on taking the trains and am going to visit England, France, Italy, Greece, and Switerland. Are there any tip people can suggest to make my trip go more smooth. Thanks.

Hi Sara: <BR> <BR>Lucky you!! <BR> <BR>A few questions about your trip: Will you be solo or with a group? If solo, will you have a set itinerary or are you going to wing it? In what types of hotels do you want to stay (budget range)? What kind of a budget are you giving yourself for four weeks? What kind of traveling have you done in the past (a seasoned traveller or a novice)? What are your interests (art, food, mountains, etc...) <BR> <BR>If you answer these questions, you'll probably get a lot people eager to give you tips (I know I will, but I need more info). <BR> <BR>Carol <BR>

Greece is a bit far away from the other countries dont you think?

Carol to answer your questions. I will be traveling with a friend. We want to stay in mostly B&B's but maybe a couple of nights in a "real" hotel. My budget is around $3,000. The main thing that I would like to get from this trip is to see all of the things in the History books. I am more focused on seeing historical sites first. <BR>Tony: I read where you can take a ferry from Italy to Greece and take the rails there. This is why we included Greece. <BR>Anything More please ask. I love this site.

Sara, You are trying to make the mistake <BR>that is common with many first timers. <BR>You cannot do it all in one trip. I would drop off the extremities from this itinerary and spend your time in <BR>France, Switz., Italy, and Bavaria. Greece is definately too far--the trip <BR>from Brindisi will take you almost 2 days each way and that gets you none of the Greek Isles. Fly into Paris and out of Munich and include 8 other destinations in between. If you want some help with that give me a holler.

I am inclined to agree with Bob on this one. However, it depends on what you want to do. From a strict logistics point of view, he and Tony are right in suggesting that you may lose time in going to Greece. If you want to get a good cultural experience, this is probably too much for four weeks, but if you are very focused about what you want to see and do, I don't see anything wrong with your plans. For example, you may simply want to visit great museums, the capital cities, or have some other similarly specific goals for this trip. Then, why not? In that case, perhaps a couple of days in the Swiss Alps in between makes for a good break too. Just plan carefully so you don't spend all your time travelling around. If you don't have very specific goals, Bob's plan sounds like a winner to me.

As Carol pointed out, some specifics from you could help us give you specific advice (we do that really well). <BR>General advice: <BR>Pack extra sox and humor <BR>Everything takes longer than planned <BR>Things will not all go smoothly; restaurants will be too busy and turn you away; museums will be closed due to a flood in the basement; trains will be delayed because of a strike. Roll with the punches, or die. <BR>Learn the polite and vital words in each language (please, thank you, bathroom, you're welcome, bail bondsman) <BR>Pack as light as you can. Pack your suitcase two weeks before you leave. Carry it around the block, up and down a couple of flights of stairs, then hoist it over your head. You will now hate everything in that suitcase. This is a good thing; you will now only take those things you hate the least. <BR>Get a few dollars of the currency in which country you land (8000 hours in flight; you land at cock's crow, you do NOT have the mental capacity to deal with foreign exchange or an ATM). After that, use your ATM cards (I have two bank accounts, two ATM cards, in case one card offends an ATM and is mangled in retaliation). Use credit cards wherever possible (just like ATM cards, very good exchange rate). <BR>Before you go, make a list of souvenirs you'd like to get (Greek olive oil? Swiss watch?); this will give you a handle on 1) how much you will be carrying back and 2) spending. See "suitcase" for what to do next. <BR>Don't promise everyone a postcard; it takes 10 mins to write out the card; postage is about $.50 (more in some countries, less in others); the cards are at least a quarter each. Add up costs in time and money - start whittling down that list. Then type or print mailing labels for the cards you MUST send (leave that irreplaceable address book at home). <BR>Take more film than you think you'll need; you'll need it (if nothing else, you'll win favors by giving someone a roll who's just run out). <BR>Read up on each country/region; then vow to re-read when you get home. <BR>Comfy shoes comfy shoes comfy shoes <BR>Just because it's not like home, doesn't mean it's not good. Avoid comparing things to 'what it's like at home', except as a frame of reference (as in "wow they eat mayonnaise with their fries; we eat ketchup. how interesting!" vs "WHO in their RIGHT mind would eat MAYO when you could get ketchup??? Are these people STUPID??") <BR>The biggest differences (in my observation)between cultures are food and toilets. You will prove this to yourself by the end of your trip. Happy fish heads and squatting to you. <BR>Talk to people; common bonds: food, children, weather, people doing dumb things. These surpass all known spoken languages - eye-rolling and hysterical laughter are universal. <BR>It ain't DisneyWorld: keep your wits about you and use your streetsmarts. <BR>Assume you will have a wonderful time; turn adversity into interesting stories; don't panic. <BR>

Sara, <BR> <BR>I hope you enjoy your trip. I have been to Europe several times and I really believe my first trip was the best. It was so new! Everything was different, every day was a new adventure. Everything from bathrooms to trains was a new lesson. After a while things become old hat and you forget what it was like on your first adventure. I hope you enjoy Europe as much as my husband and I do. We travel each September to France, Germany, Austria, Switzerland or Italy. Don't try to see too much on your first trip. You will want to remember the details of the different areas you visit. Most of all have fun! Lynda

Sara: Elvira's advice is great. I think your budget is realistic for the length of time you plan to go. <BR> <BR>Regarding the itinerary: if you want to do Greece, you can do Greece! It just means that you will have less time in the other places. It's not a tragedy; you will go back another time and see the places you missed or didn't get enough of. Yes, the ferry will take you a day and a half to and from, and you will need to spend at least 5-7 days in Greece just to make it worth your travel time. It also means that instead of doing "England" you may only do London, and instead of doing "Italy" you may only do Rome or Venice or Florence or wherever. I did a trip very similar to what you're planning -- got a rail pass and went to England (London, with a day trip to Bath and Stonehenge), France (Paris, with a day trip to the Loire Valley), Italy (Rome), Greece (ferry to Athens, which I hated -- the city, not the ferry -- and quickly abandoned for the island of Poros, which was fab), back to Italy (Venice), Switzerland (Lugano), Germany (Rhine and Mosel), Brussels, back to London. I did that in 6 weeks (plus a few more places I breezed through too quickly to count). On another 6-week trip I did London, Cambridge, Amsterdam, Paris, Nice, Florence, Frankfurt, Paris again, London. My point is, you can see a lot in 4 weeks. Just make sure you spend at least 3 nights in each place or you will feel like you're on the go too much and won't be able to enjoy it. My personal "don't miss" places on a first trip would be Paris, Venice, and Rome. Florence is a close runner-up. And whatever you do, don't spend too much time in Athens -- see what you have to, fast, and move on (Greece is great apart from Athens though). Have a wonderful time.

elvira: Thanks for the advice. Everything you say helps tremedously. <BR>Lisa: The trip you took sound exactly like what we want to do. We are planning to fly into London and spend time touring that area. Then off to Paris, then Italy, Greece, Switerland (couple of days) and the back through france to london again. Thanks for the information.

elvira: Thanks for the advice. Everything you say helps tremedously. <BR>Lisa: The trip you took sound exactly like what we want to do. We are planning to fly into London and spend time touring that area. Then off to Paris, then Italy, Greece, Switerland (couple of days) and the back through france to london again. Thanks for the information.

Sara, <BR>I've focused on two of your words: "teacher" and "history". From them I assume you're a history teacher. If so, make your trip a learning experience of the first order. Spend a week or more in London with day trips to Bath with its Roman baths and Stonehenge with its 4,000 years of history and mystery; spend a week or more in Paris with day trips to Versailles and Compeigne, where Joan of Arc was captured by the British; spend a week or more in Rome with its vast liturgical and Imperial history. Save Greece for another summer. Visit Switzerland for a day or two on your way to and from Rome. It will offer a restful interlude. Stay long enough in each place to capture its essence both historical, cultural and societal. Come home with lasting, meaningful memories and experiences rather than fleeting impressions.

Hi Sara, <BR>I fully agree with Bob the navigator. Doing Greece is a bit much for one trip. Enjoy France, Italy, Switzerland, and the Munich area. <BR> <BR>However,if you decide to do Greece, let me suggest that you leave from Venice to Patras instead of from Brindisi. You avoid having to waste a good part of the day taking the train to Brindisi and the ship leaves Venice in the PM after a day of sightseeing in Venice. My wife & I took it last year from Venice and we decided it was one of the smartest things we did. Rent a cabin and the total price is competitive with a hotel stay. <BR>We took the Minoan Greek Line their website is:http://www.minoan.gr/ <BR>The ships are very nice with swimming pool etc. Food prices are reasonable. <BR> <BR>My other recommendation would be for you to buy an open jaw ticket to Europe, flying into France or Switzerland and flying out of Athens. <BR>I,m sure you will have fun!

Sara: Lots of good tips, e.g. fly into London and out of Zurich, no need to back-track. Visit Suisse last, scenic? absolutely, historical? eh. Re B&Bs, won't find many around rail stations, more likely 2 star hotels. Pack light, take a small bottle of laundry soap and wear stuff that doesn't need ironing. My wife and I cycle in Europe for 2 1/2-3weeks each year and carry everything in 2 panniers that total the size of a large backpack. Good shoes, a pair of Birkies. Some OTC meds, stuff we take for granted, Excedrin, Nyquil etc. are hard to find. Ear plugs, we use Quies. A budget of 3K is adequate assuming you are not taking transportation costs out of this. Request info from each country's tourist bureau and declare your dining room table a travel research zone. Make up a grid, each box indicating a day and lay out an itinerary, you'd be surprised how quickly you run out of days. Lastly, research, research, research.

I am continually amazed how helpful everyone is. Thank you all. Richard: Switzerland is last because I think we are going to need some down time after 4 weeks on the road. I am planning to visit my local library and check out book related to the countries that we are visiting.

Sara, it sounds like you are planning a great trip. Here are some things that have helped me on my trips. <BR> <BR>1) Don't plan anything strenuous on your first day. You will be groggy and disoriented after 6+ hours on the plane, going through customs (yuck), and getting to your hotel. What I usually do is unpack my clothes, shower, and find some place eat. That first day is perfect for wandering about, learning the subway system, and getting to know your "new" neighborhood (where's the nearest laundromat/restaurant/subway station). Save doing The Louvre/Sistine Chapel/Tower of London for Day Two! <BR> <BR>2) When planning your itinerary, don't forget to note days and times when sights are open. In Paris, some museums are closed on Mondays and others on Tuesdays. <BR> <BR>3) As others have said, be patient and flexible. Museums will be closed due to renovation and your favorite cathedral may be shrouded in scaffolding! <BR> <BR>4) REMEMBER: You will always go back. Believe me, once you get there you will be surprised at how easy it is to get sidetracked from your itinerary. I've been to Paris twice and I still haven't gone to the Musee D'Orsay. Sure I was disappointed, but as my mother pointed out, "Now we have a reason to come back!" <BR> <BR>5) When I am travelling with other people, I always state upfront, that we don't have to spend every waking moment together and that people should feel comfortable going off on their own. Sometimes we separated, other times we didn't. And on one occasion, by the time we boarded the plane home, we were no longer speaking! <BR> <BR>6) Share the responsibilities. On every trip, I am usually the map girl…not only because I have a good sense of directions, but also because I am usually the only person who bought a map BEFORE we left the US! My sister and I can proudly say that we have fought "all over the world" due to disagreements over THE MAP. When I finally threw the map at her and told her to direct where we are going, she finally realized that to put all the responsibility on one person was not fair. <BR> <BR>I hope this helps you out! Good Luck!

Sara, which historical subjects interest you most? That may help with suggestions. <BR> <BR>I still think you may want to reconsider where to place Switzerland on your trip. Unless you fly, it will eat up a lot of time going back and forth between Greece and Italy/Switzerland. I think you will appreciate having time to relax some after England and France. Plus, if you do decide to do some hiking/walking in the Alps (which I recommend), you may just simply be too exhausted to enjoy it as much after all the city walking. Unless, you have a special interest in ancient history, I really would consider skipping Greece for Germany. It would make the trip a lot easier. Germany definitely has a lot of historical interest - you could visit the towns on the Romantic Road, castles along the Rhine and in Bavaria, Dachau, etc. Maybe even add in a trip to Vienna, which is literally dripping with history. Then fly out of either Munich or Vienna. Prague would be another great place to visit for history, and it is one of Europe's most beautiful cities. However, unless you end up going to the adjoining areas of Germany, it is probably too much out of the way. <BR> <BR>Along with Wes' excellent suggestions, consider the D-day landing areas in Normandy too. <BR> <BR>A good planning tool that may make your trip easier is Deutsche Bahn's web site. Go to bahn.hafas.de/bin/detect.exe/bin/query.exe/e. This will take you to the screen for typing in connections. You can see train times and routes here for just about any route in Europe. When you decide where you are going, print the relevant schedules, and take them with you. Works like a charm. <BR> <BR>

Scheduling down time is a good idea, but it might be better to do it mid-trip rather than right before you leave (to return home, the land of down time, in a sense). Also, bear in mind that you can have down time almost anywhere--sit in a cafe and write in your journal (because we'll want a trip report), send postcards to the lucky few, do laundry, whatever.

If there's a better, briefer touring guide than that Elvira's set forth - I've never seen it! Good job! <BR> <BR>Note to Richard: Will you please come pack us for our next journey? <BR> <BR>Sara: Since I'm NOT that kind of a packer, and maybe you aren't, either, here's my tip: Stuff into your luggage somewhere a good-size fabric tote. It comes in handy when you suddenly discover you're carrying far more home than you arrived with (see the souvenier thread). You might also consider, when you're packing to leave, taking those items you're about sick of in your wardrobe anyway, and discarding them along the way. Have a WONDERFUL time!

Sara, <BR>Lucky you -- to add to the tips I'd say allow time for the unexpected and don't structure the entire trip so as you have no time to just wander around, linger in a cafe, sleep late one morning (yes, sleep is important and while you don't want to sleep your trip away, an extra hr. sometimes can make the difference between feeling dead on your feet and enjoying yourself.) Speaking of feet, take 2 pair of really comfortable walking shoes - when your feet hurt your trip is spoiled. <BR> <BR>As someone else said don't plan a big day for your first day there - jet lag does creep up on you, espiecally if you are flying from the western U.S. where you have a 10-11 hr flt. to contend with. Do go outside after you check in upon arriving that first day and walk around a bit, get something to eat and go to bed reasonably early. You will find that makes a vast difference in how you feel the next day. <BR> <BR>I'd also suggest getting an easy to manage hair cut that requires no special blow drying, etc. If you do require that buy a set of adaptors and plugs (Franzus makes a good set) as you will need them. You might also want to take along a piece of heavy string (clothesline) to string up over the tub so that you can wash out a few things. <BR> <BR>Be sure to always have a tiny foldable umbrella with you (altho you can buy umbrellas most places, it's best not to be caught without). <BR> <BR>Make xerox copies of all the articles, etc. that describle what you want to see. Put them in a folder and take that. Do no take any books, they are too heavy. <BR> <BR>We always get some "foreign currency" before leaving home so we can pay taxi's etc. with no problem. <BR> <BR>Altho I understand the urge to see so many countries, I'd concentrate on just 3 of them and to avoid the packing and unpacking stuff (which gets old fast) I'd plan on staying in the major cities and doing day trips to the sites that interest you. There is no way you are going to see everything, but it sure gives you a reason to go back!