Feb ski/culture tour
#1
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Joined: Nov 2017
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Feb ski/culture tour
I am seeking advice on itineraries for a two week road trip in February for 5 adults. We got a great deal flying into Paris and plan to rent a 7 passenger van to accommodate our luggage. Our goals are to ski for 5-6 days and see as much as we can of the natural beauty. We need to keep our lodging cost to a minimum and are considering airbnb’s or home rentals since we will have a car. We would like to ski a couple days each in the French Alps, the Dolomites, and end at Wengen. We have discussed castle hunting, Venice canals, walled cities, and quaint villages. We are not city people and prefer not to be in crowded areas (Venice as a concession). Any suggestions would be great. I am concerned that only snow chains may be available for rental cars in Paris. Will that prohibit us from driving in the Alps? We are experienced mountain snow drivers but do not wish to break any road laws.
#2

Joined: May 2003
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For skiing in February, check the school holidays.
The week starting February 12 is carnival; very busy period in most resorts. And in France, check the vacances scolaires calender and avoid in particular the weeks that Paris schools are on holiday.
Many hotels will insist on a one-week stay during school holidays - not sure about airbnb.
Check with the rental car firm regarding chains. The car should have winter tyres. We have never used chains on 30+ trips to the French Alps in winter. It depends on how far you are driving into the mountains. A resort such as Megeve is easier to reach than for example Val d'Isere.
Winter tyres are essential, though. In some European countries they are mandatory in winter.
The week starting February 12 is carnival; very busy period in most resorts. And in France, check the vacances scolaires calender and avoid in particular the weeks that Paris schools are on holiday.
Many hotels will insist on a one-week stay during school holidays - not sure about airbnb.
Check with the rental car firm regarding chains. The car should have winter tyres. We have never used chains on 30+ trips to the French Alps in winter. It depends on how far you are driving into the mountains. A resort such as Megeve is easier to reach than for example Val d'Isere.
Winter tyres are essential, though. In some European countries they are mandatory in winter.
#3
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Joined: Nov 2017
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Thanks! We are stuck on our dates 10 feb-24 feb and will have to work around school holidays. We do not need to stay at the resort, but instead a town nearby. I cannot find any car rental places in Paris that mention winter tyres, yet alone reserve one. Am I correct that having chains does not substitute for winter tyres?
#4

Joined: May 2003
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If you don't have winter tyres you must have chains; even if you are not using them, if there's a lot of snow you must have them with you. With winter tyres it's less of an issue, since you will be able to drive in light snowfall without any problem.
I suppose in heavy snowfall you may have to use chains even if you have winter tyres, but we've never had to use them (we do have them just in case).
If you are going to drive through the Alps in winter you just have to have winter tyres. I would never do that without them. Look up the law regarding this for the countries that you will be visiting. If you don't have winter tyres, you'll be at fault in case of accidents.
Paris holidays are from Feb 17 - so you may be OK the week of the 10th in France. The carnival holiday is more of an issue in Switzerland and Austria, not so much in France.
Be aware that roads to and from the Alps are extremely busy on Saturdays in February.
I suppose in heavy snowfall you may have to use chains even if you have winter tyres, but we've never had to use them (we do have them just in case).
If you are going to drive through the Alps in winter you just have to have winter tyres. I would never do that without them. Look up the law regarding this for the countries that you will be visiting. If you don't have winter tyres, you'll be at fault in case of accidents.
Paris holidays are from Feb 17 - so you may be OK the week of the 10th in France. The carnival holiday is more of an issue in Switzerland and Austria, not so much in France.
Be aware that roads to and from the Alps are extremely busy on Saturdays in February.
#5
Joined: Apr 2016
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Everybody has winter tyres these days, I think it would be crazy to rely on chains because chances are you'll have to use them if you don't have winter tyres and they are so uncomfortable. Either chains or winter tyres are mandatory everywhere where there is a chance of ice.
I know you can get cars with winter tyres in Venice. Also in Geneva of course. Maybe you could change cars in Geneva on the French side of the airport if you can't get winter tyres in Paris. Chances are you'll get a better price in Switzerland too.
I know you can get cars with winter tyres in Venice. Also in Geneva of course. Maybe you could change cars in Geneva on the French side of the airport if you can't get winter tyres in Paris. Chances are you'll get a better price in Switzerland too.
#6

Joined: Oct 2013
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In Italy, the law requires that you have winter tires or chains on board even when there's no snow. It varies by region, but, for example, where we live you need then from mid-November to mid-April. We hardly ever have snow, but almost anyone in Italy could encounter snow within a half-hour's drive. (There's a big mountain range right down the middle of the country, after all, and the north is all mountains.)
Ash Wednesday is the 14th of February this year, and the 2 weeks before are Carnevale. Carnevale in Venezia is something worth seeing, but there are enormous crowds and lodging is both scarse and expensive. You might want to time your visit to Venice for after the 14th, unless you'd really like to see the Carnevale. We went once, and although the trains were very crowded, and St. Mark's Square was almost impossible, we found that you could easily get away from the crowds.
A very odd thing, we were able to go up to the top of the Campanile in the square without waiting in line at all, on the day of the "flight of the angel", when if you had dropped a coin in the square, it wouldn't have hit the ground. I could only guess that all attention was riveted on what was going in the square and no one spared a thought for the Campanile.
Ash Wednesday is the 14th of February this year, and the 2 weeks before are Carnevale. Carnevale in Venezia is something worth seeing, but there are enormous crowds and lodging is both scarse and expensive. You might want to time your visit to Venice for after the 14th, unless you'd really like to see the Carnevale. We went once, and although the trains were very crowded, and St. Mark's Square was almost impossible, we found that you could easily get away from the crowds.
A very odd thing, we were able to go up to the top of the Campanile in the square without waiting in line at all, on the day of the "flight of the angel", when if you had dropped a coin in the square, it wouldn't have hit the ground. I could only guess that all attention was riveted on what was going in the square and no one spared a thought for the Campanile.
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#8

Joined: Oct 2013
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If I were travelling in the mountains in the winter, I'd want both winter tires and chains. In heavy snow, unplowed, chains work much better than winter tires. Besides, when renting a car, you don't really have the choice. If they provide chains, which would be a lot less trouble and expense for them, they probably don't have winter tires.
#10
Joined: Oct 2015
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Car rental places do not supply chains for tires.
You will either have to purchase them yourself or find someplace to rent them.
Most people in Paris don't bother with them, because there is really not a lot of snow.
If you are going to the countryside, I'd get them.
You will either have to purchase them yourself or find someplace to rent them.
Most people in Paris don't bother with them, because there is really not a lot of snow.
If you are going to the countryside, I'd get them.
#11

Joined: May 2003
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We've never used chains in 30+ trips to the French Alps in winter. 2 years ago we had to dig our car out of the snow when we were leaving Megeve; but the roads were absolutely fine without chains. A minority of cars were using them then, mostly people who were staying further up the mountain. They had to stop just outside the village to remove them again.
So it really depends on where you are. If you stay in a place like Chamonix you wouldn't need chains. If you stay somewhere high up with lots of steep and small roads; you would.
I'd never drive to the places you are considering without winter tyres, though.
So it really depends on where you are. If you stay in a place like Chamonix you wouldn't need chains. If you stay somewhere high up with lots of steep and small roads; you would.
I'd never drive to the places you are considering without winter tyres, though.
#12
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Joined: Nov 2017
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Thanks for the replies. The biggest immediate issue now is that cars rented in Paris do not have winter tyres. Simply none I can find. Hertz says they may have rental chains but won't guarantee it. Can we get a ticket for not having winter tyres if we have chains? Should we rent a car and drive to Lyon or Geneva and try and switch to a vehicle with winter tyres? This would obviously be more expensive.
We will ski probably 5-6 days out of the 13 we will be in Europe - a couple days at different resorts. The tentative plan is to stay near Paris the first day--jet lag cure-- then drive south possibly taking in places like Rocamadour (yes a bit off track-not definitive) or a couple castles. Then to the resorts to ski a couple days. Not sure which town to stay in yet. We do not mind driving up to an hour to ski for the day in order to keep the rental chalet/house/apartment/condo cost at a minimum.
Next we will travel either through Switzerland or around Italy towards the Dolomites or Italian Alps and anchor there for a few days to ski and take a day trip to Venice. From there we should head north(Austria? Germany?) and eventually land in Wengen/Interlaken for our last couple days before driving back to Paris for our flight out.
All this is up in the air and very flexible. We very much want to see small towns, castles, and vistas. Love the suggestions!
We will ski probably 5-6 days out of the 13 we will be in Europe - a couple days at different resorts. The tentative plan is to stay near Paris the first day--jet lag cure-- then drive south possibly taking in places like Rocamadour (yes a bit off track-not definitive) or a couple castles. Then to the resorts to ski a couple days. Not sure which town to stay in yet. We do not mind driving up to an hour to ski for the day in order to keep the rental chalet/house/apartment/condo cost at a minimum.
Next we will travel either through Switzerland or around Italy towards the Dolomites or Italian Alps and anchor there for a few days to ski and take a day trip to Venice. From there we should head north(Austria? Germany?) and eventually land in Wengen/Interlaken for our last couple days before driving back to Paris for our flight out.
All this is up in the air and very flexible. We very much want to see small towns, castles, and vistas. Love the suggestions!
#13


Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 26,491
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Mountain driving in winter... Being flexible is a given. And no matter what, the bigger the group, the longer it takes to do everything.
You don't have enough time for all of the geography mentioned AND 5-6 days of skiing. Rocamadour is more than a bit off-track.
Day 1. Land Paris.
Day 2. Paris
Day 3. Drive to Rocamadour (6 hours).
Day 4. Rocamadour.
Day 5. Drive to, say, Chamonix (7 hours).
Day 6. Ski Chamonix.
Day 7. Drive to Venice (6 hours).
Day 8. Venice.
Day 9. Drive to, say, Cortina (3 hours).
Day 10. Ski Cortina.
Day 11. Drive to, say, Garmisch-Partenkirchen (4 hours).
Day 12. Ski Garmisch.
Day 13. Drive to Wengen (6 hours).
Day 14. Wengen.
Day 15. Drive to Paris (7 hours).
Day 16. Fly home.
More days than you have, and you only get to ski 4-5 days. I don't think you'd be staying anywhere long enough to rent a house or apartment, and staying an hour from skiing will only eat into the little ski time you have. If you'd be renting equipment in each place, that will take time as well.
Do you have to fly out of Paris? If so, consider flying from Venice or Innsbruck back to Paris to eliminate the backtracking.
You don't have enough time for all of the geography mentioned AND 5-6 days of skiing. Rocamadour is more than a bit off-track.
Day 1. Land Paris.
Day 2. Paris
Day 3. Drive to Rocamadour (6 hours).
Day 4. Rocamadour.
Day 5. Drive to, say, Chamonix (7 hours).
Day 6. Ski Chamonix.
Day 7. Drive to Venice (6 hours).
Day 8. Venice.
Day 9. Drive to, say, Cortina (3 hours).
Day 10. Ski Cortina.
Day 11. Drive to, say, Garmisch-Partenkirchen (4 hours).
Day 12. Ski Garmisch.
Day 13. Drive to Wengen (6 hours).
Day 14. Wengen.
Day 15. Drive to Paris (7 hours).
Day 16. Fly home.
More days than you have, and you only get to ski 4-5 days. I don't think you'd be staying anywhere long enough to rent a house or apartment, and staying an hour from skiing will only eat into the little ski time you have. If you'd be renting equipment in each place, that will take time as well.
Do you have to fly out of Paris? If so, consider flying from Venice or Innsbruck back to Paris to eliminate the backtracking.
#16
Joined: Mar 2015
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When asking a rental about tyres pay attention to wording.
Winter tyres are tyres for the winter. Snow tyres are entirely different and a lot of people are confused.
I would not drive with summer tyres in the mountains.
Like tulips i have bought chains for all my cars and used them three times. Once in my own road actually.
I now buy socks - chaussettes - so much easier to put on and remove.
Some people say it has no legal value - bs - I investigated at the time and am sure they are as valid as chains. I put them during a snowstorm and was happy to have them.
Winter tyres are tyres for the winter. Snow tyres are entirely different and a lot of people are confused.
I would not drive with summer tyres in the mountains.
Like tulips i have bought chains for all my cars and used them three times. Once in my own road actually.
I now buy socks - chaussettes - so much easier to put on and remove.
Some people say it has no legal value - bs - I investigated at the time and am sure they are as valid as chains. I put them during a snowstorm and was happy to have them.
#17
Original Poster
Joined: Nov 2017
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I realize we need to cut out some things. What about this?
Day 1 (Feb 11) land in Paris 8am – take tour, spend night
Day 2 (Feb 12) drive to Albertville – (6 hours)
Day 3 (Feb 13) ski/play
Day 4 (Feb 14) ski/play
Day 5 (Feb 15) drive to Trento, Italy (6 hours)
Day 6 (Feb 16) ski/play
Day 7 (Feb 17) ski/play
Day 8 (Feb 18) Venice Day trip
Day 9 (Feb 19) Drive to Interlaken (6 hours)
Day 10 (Feb 20) ski/play
Day 11 (Feb 21) ski/play
Day 12 (Feb 23) drive to paris (7 hours)
Day 13(Feb 24) fly out of Paris 1:40pm
Day 1 (Feb 11) land in Paris 8am – take tour, spend night
Day 2 (Feb 12) drive to Albertville – (6 hours)
Day 3 (Feb 13) ski/play
Day 4 (Feb 14) ski/play
Day 5 (Feb 15) drive to Trento, Italy (6 hours)
Day 6 (Feb 16) ski/play
Day 7 (Feb 17) ski/play
Day 8 (Feb 18) Venice Day trip
Day 9 (Feb 19) Drive to Interlaken (6 hours)
Day 10 (Feb 20) ski/play
Day 11 (Feb 21) ski/play
Day 12 (Feb 23) drive to paris (7 hours)
Day 13(Feb 24) fly out of Paris 1:40pm
#18


Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 26,491
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Better, but for me Trento would be too far from Venice for a decent day trip. Train is at least 2.5 hours going and a bit longer on the evening return. Driving isn't quicker when you include parking, etc. And Trento is a bit too far south to ski in the heart of the Dolomites, although there is skiing nearby if you just want to get in the days. If it was me, I'd leave the Dolomites and Venice for another trip. Both deserve more time than you're giving them.

