dave63

This is my first time, so there may be too many questions here - sorry in advance. My wife and I and our 2 sons (14 and 11) are spending 2 weeks in France at the end of July / beginning of August. We are spending one week at a chateau in the Loire Valley, and we are spending the second week driving through the Massif Central to Provence and on to the Riviera. On our first day, on the way from CDG Airport to the Loire Valley, we would like to visit either Vaux Le Vicomte OR Fountainebleau. Which is the better choice for travelers whose experience of France has been confined to Paris and Versailles? Also, any thoughts as to the "must see" chateaux of the Loire Valley, considering guided tours in English, history, furnishings & grounds? Same question for "must see" towns around Avignon? Thanks in advance!

indytravel

In the Loire valley the usual suspects are the 3 C's: Chenonceau, Chambord and Cheverny.

Chambord is sparsely furnished but has the double helix stair case and is huge. It has literally hundreds of rooms. Chenonceau has beautiful gardens and an exquisite location straddling the Loire. It has some furnnishings. Cheverny is still richly furnished. It's the only one of the 3 I've not been to.

Most of the Loire chateau were pleasure palaces for royalty. For real history I suggest Amboise, Chinon (though it's a ruin) and Blois. I liked the sound & light show at Blois. It used to run one night a week in English.

I took my niece then 14 and nephew then 13 through the Loire in 2001. I really recommend you keep the chateau viewing to 1 per day max. It's easy for me to get chateau-ed out and I'm over 40.

You don't say where you'll be staying in the Loire valley. Though it's not huge the summer traffic can be horrific on the little two lane highway that parallels the Loire. You might take that into consideration when you plan chateau trips. I was there in early June when traffic wasn't bad. Even then I noticed that as you went further west past Tours the tourists thinned out a bit. Maybe that will hold true in July/August.

shellio

I would choose Vaux le Vicomte, particularly if you've seen Versailles, simply because the scale is smaller and more easily grasped than Fontainebleau.

FYI, Vaux is the chateau that is said to have inspired Louis XIV to build Versailles. It's quite lovely and as I recall has a very good tour. If there's any chance of visiting on an evening that a candlelight tour is offered, I'd recommend that you do so.

If it's your first visit to the Loire valley, you should probably visit at least Chambord, Chenonceaux and Azay-le-Rideau for a spectrum of different styles. With a week in the area you'll be able to select your second tier visits while there.

ms_go

We spent a week in the Loire Valley, near Chinon, a few years ago. In addition to some of those mentioned, our favorites included the gardens at Villandry, Fontevraud Abbey, and the Chateau d'Angers with the apocalypse tapestry.

SalB

We prefer Vaux Le Vicomte but you could look both up on the web and see if your family could come to a decision together.

If anyone in your family is interested in horses, Chambord has an equestrian school and gives wonderful riding demonstrations. If you don't want to attend one, you can just get there about an hour before the show and watch them riding about the grounds trying to entice people into the show.

I'll second the suggestion to visit the gardens (and chateau) at Villandry. It is a sight not to be missed. The chateau is charming but the grounds are marvelous. There is a little sandwich shop right outside the chateau entry that is a fun place for a light lunch under the trees.

Near Avignon, don't miss the Pont du Gard. It's a great place to take a picnic too. You can walk down to the river and picnic while watching all the tourists. I would also highly recommend Arles. Take the little train tour to get the lay of the land and then walk all over town. There is free parking a block from the coliseum.

Have a great trip.

Underhill

Your drive through the Massif Central--especially the Auvergne portion--should be wonderful. We've been enjoying the scenery in the Tour de Trance as it goes through the Massif: glorious walled towns. You'll be in a region that many tourists skip, for reasons that have always escaped me.

For towns around Avignon, I'd recommend Beaucaire/Tarascon, St-Rémy, Fontvielle, Maussanne-les-Alpilles, and Uzés. Your boys (and you as well) would certainly enjoy Les Baux, but try to time your visit for early morning or evening when the crowds are lighter.

Even if you don't go inside (and it's a long tour), try to see the Château de Saumur--right out of the Book of Hours of the Duc de Berry.

Morgana

Hi Dave
We have just returned from a holiday in Provence.
Another vote for Uzes, a lovely small town.
We also thoroughly enjoyed a drive up Mont Ventoux. I have a feeling your lads would enjoy this, especially if they have an interest in the Tour De France (the cyclists ascend this mountain every year, and it's where the English cyclist Tommy Simpson sadly died - there's a memorial to him up there). It's a very good road up, and you just climb and climb, right above the tree line so it actually looks like the surface of the moon up there. The views are truly astounding. My description hasn't done justice to this place - it really was a highlight of our trip.
We found Les Baux to be heaving with tourists, even before the schools had broken up for summer. Tourist shops everywhere! We had a quick look round but didn't linger.
We loved the Roman ruins just outside Remy (think it's called Glanum). We had these practically to ourselves, very atmospheric - you could see the rut tracks on the stones etc, and again a nice place for your boys to explore and let off some steam.
M

dave63

Thanks for the advice, Morgana (and everyone else, too). We are staying in a hotel in Villenueve-les-Avignon for 3 nights, from which it appears that we can reach any of the towns (Orange, Arles, Nimes, St-Remy, etc) with ease via driving. I am a bit concerned about the volume of traffic (pedestrian and vehicular). What was the traffic like when you were there? The weather seems cooler than last summer. In fact, one of my wife's clients in Paris has told us to bring sweaters.

Morgana

Hi Dave
I went to Villeneuve-les-Avignon! Saw the huge tower and went round the Chartreuse du Val de Benediction.
We actually stayed in Uzes for a week (3 weeks ago). The weather was scorching! One day it reached 38 but every other day mid 30's, blue skies all day. My jumper remained unpacked!! Actually one of the reasons we decided to ascend Mont Ventoux was we had been told it was 10 degrees cooler up there! However......the second week we stayed at a gite near Bergerac (still a long way south) and the temperature dropped like a stone - late teens, early 20's, and lots of wind and rain. I gather this low front was all across France. I would certainly take a light jumper or thin fleece just in case.
Traffic - well, I live in England and am used to busy roads and it's certainly much easier getting round France. We didn't sit in any long traffic queues and we found each town very well sign-posted. Getting around was never a problem although a good navigator helps! Motorways were generally quite empty but you do have to pay for most stretches (peage). Have you heard of something called Bison Fute? Think it translates as Crafty Bison. You can pick up free Bison Fute maps at tourist offices. Basically if you look at French motorways on a map they frequently have an A road running alongside them. Although they won't get you to your destination as fast as a motorway they are free, often empty, and much more interesting. They are known as Bison Fute roads, marked clearly on road signs as Bis. I believe there is a Bison Fute website. On long trips we did a mixture of Bis roads and motorways.
Les Baux was our only disappointment in Provence. The approach is fantastic - it perches on this rocky outcrop, flags flying, and looks like something out of a medieval fairytale. The reality was shop after shop selling the same 'local produce', buildings 'restored' to within an inch of their lives, and restaurants with prices twice as high as anything else I saw (and that includes lunch in St Remy). I know others may disagree - this is just our personal view.
I do envy your trip - it's raining here (again) and my tan is fading fast......
M

indytravel

Like Underhill I think the Central Massif is very underrated. In May 2003 I took my Dad on a rail trip through the area with a rental car for a few days.

From Clermont-Ferrand through Ambert and La Chaise-Dieu to Le Puy-en-Velay is beautiful. Ambert is famed for Forme d'Ambert blue cheese.

Le Puy-en-Velay has a most amazing church perched 80 meters or so in the air on a thin volcanic stump.

The drive through the Allier gorge from Le Puy-en-Velay through Alès on your way to Avignon is even more beautiful.

I'd read that the train route through the Allier gorge is one of the most scenic in France. Now that I've done it I don't doubt that one bit. I arranged this trip to drive one way through the gorge and take the train the other way. That way my Dad could see what the train bridges and route looked like from the road that's near it.

dave63

Underhill and Indytravel:
I initially chose the overnight stop in Clermond-Ferrand (C-F) as it's about half way to Avignon, AND because my sons want to visit Vulcania, the Volcano themed science center/museum. However, based on your messages, I will seriously check out the map and our route to take in some of the sights you have described.

From Chinon, where our chateau is located, we're driving through Bourges for lunch and a visit on the way to C-F. The next day, after the morning at Vulcania, we're stopping in Vienne, south of Lyon, for lunch and a visit to their Roman archeological remains. I had no idea how far into Europe the Roman Empire truly reached - and not just reached but planted roots! I'm actually having to determine which Roman ruins to delete from the itinerary, fearing that it may get repetitive.

Underhill

In Vienne you'll see the temple to Livia, she of "I, Claudius" fame; he promised her on her deathbed to make her a goddess, and he fulfilled his promise.

The Roman Empire stretched over a good chunk of southern France and up into Burgundy, and there are wonderful ruins and intact edifices to see. Autun has a good theater, as do Orange and Arles; Nimes, Arles, and Vaison-la-Romaine have excellent arenas. St-Rémy has a memorial arch to the grandsons of Augustus, not to mention the ancient city of Glanum. Fréjus, over on the Côte d'Azur, has excellent ruins as well. You're in for an embarrasssment of riches!

About the Loire Valley: the Château d'Angers is one of the most massive and has a really nifty moat, although most of it is a garden now. Most of the other châteaux weren't actually fortified, and I think your sons would enjoy seeing one that was.

Underhill

I doubt that you'll find the Roman ruins repetitive--each is incredibly impressive, with the Pont du Gard at the top of the list and the town remains at Vaison especially interesting. There's a small but cherce (and cool) archaeological museum near the arena there.

laurie_ann

Dave, don't quite know your style, but my husband and I are planning the reverse, to spend the night near Vaux and return our rental car at CDG. For staying, while there are more "stylish" hotels in Fontainebleau, we found there is both an Ibis and a Formule 1 nearby (closest town to Vaux is Melun). If you don't know them they are the budget end of the scale of the various types of Accor hotels, a French chain. Think Red Roof Inn in U.S. too. Both types have parking I believe which is handy if you are driving. We chose Formule 1 although less amenities, closer to Vaux, and what can be 23 euros for a double room? www.accorhotels.com. Enjoy your trip!

kevin_widrow

Dave -

A bit of advice: think long and hard about vulcania. end july/beginning of august it will most likely be a mob scene. I wanted to take our son there two summers ago and the line of cars to get in was all the way out of the park and onto the roadway. if you go, get there very early. we ended up going to the much older volcano park just across the street - which isn't nearly as high tech, but was a stunning visit into a volcano that was once a mining site and has been completely gutted. So you take this tour and get to walk around what is effectively the insides of a volcano. it was great.

-Kevin

dave63

Thanks to all for your insights. I have actually juggled our itinerary around to accommodate a number of your suggestions.

Kevin: thanks for the heads up about Vulcania. Our plan is to get there when it opens at 9 am - keeping our fingers crossed.