Todor, where did you purchase your Raycide tablets? Sounds like something I might like to try. Thanks.

LJ that is a priceless story! (Ever wonder what happened to "Jane"?

CharlesIII has posted the best reply.
1. alcohol based hand sanitizers are NOT antibiotic and do not contribute to development of resistant organisms
2. Handwashing is recommended for visibly soiled hands. Sanitizers are for cleansing, not debris removal.
3. Access to safe water for handwashing can be variable - sanitizers offer an alternaive when it is not possible to wash hands.
4. Any health care provider who practices based on "how it was when I was a kid" better make sure they have paid up their malpracice premiums.
5. Obsessive attention to washing your hands with anything is about a mental disorder, not hygiene.
6. Attention to basic hygiene, including "common sense" knowledge suffered greatly with the overuse of antibiotics. We are now seeing the result both in tems of resistant organisms and lasissez faire attitudes.
7. Hand hygiene is not only intended to protect the individual but to prevent unwitting transmission to others. It is hand contact, whether from shaking hands or touching something handled by someone else - not coughing and sneezing - that is responsible for spreading the most common microorganisms.
Now go wash your hands.

Yes, I often wonder about Jane, but until today had not really given any thought to a destination she might enjoy-apparently her talents are needed in Ireland-check out the thread about kissing the Blarney Stone!

Ugh, knives and forks. How barbaric to have sharp weapons at the dining table.

Chopsticks are the only civilized way to handle food--which should be cut into manageable pieces before appearing at the table.

Thanks Seamus-

I was going to post another reply to the thread but you have said it all.

Oh yes, wash your hands or use alcohol sanitizers.

LJ - that story is hilarious! You're making me LOL at work...

esm - thanks for the info. I think hand sanitizers are great, especially when traveling.

hi esm -- I'm not saying that your post about hand sanitizer indicates in any way that you are OCD or obsessive. I was referring to Daisy's post about other people "packing their own sheets, pillowcases, towels, mattresses and their pads, wiping down of all surfaces with self brought Lysol, etc". I'll still stand by my observation that many people on Fodors and other message boards sound a little manic -- but sorry if this implied that the OP was being unreasonable. Hand sanitizer is pretty mundane, practical, everyday stuff IMO...

hahaha Zeus! You are makin' me laugh on a Friday night!
LJ I did my own little Mexico lets-be-clean some 20 years ago. I wasn't crazy obsessive but used tablets with my teeth brushing water, tried to be conscientious, etc., but still got sick as a dog.
Having said that at home, in Maryland, I wash my hands many times thoughout the day and use sanitizer when soap and water is not available and I am rarely sick.
And this afternoon I check the santizer in my car: 62% alcohol. Thanks for the heads up esm!

No problem fishee, I was joking.

I'm a proud graduate of "school of packing light" so you won't find bedding in my luggage. And my hands are clean!

Actually, alcohol content does not necessarily reflect effectiveness of a sanitizer. There are several products out there that are more effective then average hand sanitizers and have the added benefit of being able to be used in on the face, nose, mouth, and ears.

Others said it, but it bears repeating. Alcohol sanitizers do not contribute to resistance, triclosan and other antibacterials of its ilk do. Those of use who use them for convenience should be urged to choose our hand sanitizers accordingly.

Hand sanitizer is useful and effective in certain situations. There are times when soap and clean water are not readily available.

As others have pointed out, alcohol-based hand sanitizers do not create "super germs."

Many cases of what people often mistakenly call stomach flu are actually caused by germs they've picked up from doorknobs, keyboards, and other items they touch during the day. Some people have poor resistence to such germs, so the occasional blob of hand sanitizer can be very helpful for them.

Wow, you guys really miss the actual way that alcohol based hand sanitizers work. Even at 30%, that is 60 proof. A pretty good cocktail. At 60%, now we are at 120 proof, that makes a straight shot of vodka look tame and we are almost at the moonshine level.

See, what really happens, it doesn't kill the little germs, it gets them so drunk they fall off your hands and when they hit the floor they are all running around in a mindless haze, smashing into other germs. This then causes massive germ traffic jams or even worse, they end up going home with some really ugly germ without any teeth and....well you know what happens then...a bunch of mutated, weird germs, living in germ trailers, not knowing whether to infect a dog or a human. It can get really disgusting, let me tell you.



dave

Are we still discussing hand sanitizer, for 3.5 years now?

On trips, I carry individually packed wipes, the main ingredient "benzalconium chloride," purpose "antiseptic handwash" - in case there is no washroom where I fancy to have a picnic.

I have just read an interesting article published by the Vienna Ecological Authority (unfortunately available in German only). It says:

- Hand sanitizers are not necessary for normal people in normal (European) conditions. They may be necessary for people who have certain diseases and in third-world-countries, but certainly not in Europe.

- Hand sanitizers DO contribute to the development of resistance. Pseudomonas and Providentia bacteria have already learnt to survive certain customary desinfectants.

- Hand sanitizers harm human health. They impact the natural skin flora which helps to protect us from harmful germs. Especially the alcoholic sanitizers degrease the skin and make it more vulnerable to fungi and allergenes. Eczema are the consequence.

- The human immune system needs in fact constant training, especially the immune system of children.

- Hand sanitizers harm the ecosystems if they get into the water circle.

The Vienna Authority recommends not to use hand sanitizers.

http://wua-wien.at/home/images/stori...sinfektion.pdf

Most germs are airborn. I have worked as a RN in a Emergency Department, one day very early in the morning before the am rush we decided to do a swab of the taps and counter area around where our staff washed their hands. It came back from our lab with more bacteria than most patients had coming into the department.

Though I agree with taking precations to help prevent the transmission of germs. I think that we are becoming a society of over usage of antibiotics, hand sanitizers, antibacterial wipes etc. Good old soap and water does the trick.

Hand sanitizers dry my skin out terribly, so I don't use them. Instead, I carry around a small bottle of soap with a spray nozzle - same thing was always in all our first-aid kits for as long as I can remember, long before the days of Purell, etc. I've always got water with me, so if there aren't handwashing facilities around, we can always wash our hands anyway. Just as convinient as hand sanitizer, but nicer on the skin. Plus the soap is great for guarding against poison oak, which is everywhere here. It breaks down the oils so they can be washed away before causing a reaction.

I agree with november_moon. Hand sanitizers make my hands ridiculously dry. I would carry around soap and a spray bottle, but soap stings if you happen to get it in your eyes and carrying soap AND a spray bottle can be a bit too much. I use MyClyns, it’s the size of a pen and can be used everywhere. Not to mention you can take it on a plane, which is a definite plus.

ange - the soap is in the spray bottle, no bigger than your average travel-size bottle of hand sanitizer, so not inconvinient at all. The only downside is that it has to be in the ziplock bag on a plane.