Chartres or St Denis Cathedral - which to choose?
May 8th, 2012, 04:11 AM
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Chartres or St Denis Cathedral - which to choose?
I will be visiting Paris shortly with two friends. On the Friday, they are heading out to Versailles, and since I was there two years ago, I am going to take the opportunity to visit somewhere I haven't seen before.
I have narrowed down all the Paris day trip possibilites to Chartres - the town and cathedral, or St. Denis. Which would you choose and why? I have checked out a few of the threads on here, but didn't see a direct comparison.
I watched the PBS show about building gothic cathedrals on my computer last night. Very interesting!
Thanks in advance for any guidance you can provide.
I have narrowed down all the Paris day trip possibilites to Chartres - the town and cathedral, or St. Denis. Which would you choose and why? I have checked out a few of the threads on here, but didn't see a direct comparison.
I watched the PBS show about building gothic cathedrals on my computer last night. Very interesting!
Thanks in advance for any guidance you can provide.
May 8th, 2012, 04:36 AM
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I've not been to St. Denis so can't offer a direct comparison, but I'll say that Chartres truly feels like a day trip rather than just taking the metro out towards the end of the line (if that's an aspect you're looking for). Chartres is very interesting to see from the train as you're approaching as it sits on a hill and looms over the town giving an indication of how powerful it must have looked when originally built. There are also some pretty walks through the town (I was there in Feb. and I assume it's even more interesting in warmer weather with flowers blooming and all of the outdoor dining spots open).
Why choose? If you plan right, you could do both depending on how long your friends will be in V and how much time you want in Chartres. The train to C will be from Gare Montparnasse. Upon return you could hop on Metro line 13 to get up to St. Denis.
Why choose? If you plan right, you could do both depending on how long your friends will be in V and how much time you want in Chartres. The train to C will be from Gare Montparnasse. Upon return you could hop on Metro line 13 to get up to St. Denis.
May 8th, 2012, 04:48 AM
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Since you have not been to Chartres, I would definitely choose that option. The cathedral is amazing and the town is charming. If you can take the Malcolm Miller tour, you will learn an incredible amount. I'm not sure he still conducts tours, however.
If you are especially interested in French royalty and their burial places, St. Denis is worth a visit. However, it is not really a day trip and can be done in an hour or two.
If you are especially interested in French royalty and their burial places, St. Denis is worth a visit. However, it is not really a day trip and can be done in an hour or two.
May 8th, 2012, 05:25 AM
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Though the basilica of St Denis is often claimed to be the first substantial Gothic building, it feels more Romanesque (and to my mind Germanic) than the much lighter NW European Gothic abbey churches and cathedrals that proliferate in France and England. Chartres is much more like what most of us have in mind when we think of a classic Gothic church.
Though St Denis is of huge importance in the history of architecture and of France, it's much more engaging intellectually than aesthetically: there isn't, to my mind, anything there than takes your breath away when you look at it (which there most certainly is in Chartres) - and the town of St Denis is breathtakingly charmless.
Both of them can easily be fitted into other journeys in France. It's not too great a detour to drive or get a taxi to St Denis en route from central Paris to CDG, or while driving from Paris or Northern Europe to SW France.
Depends what you're interested in. At some stage, you can't really say you've visited France unless you've been to both and you'll want to see the other, and I'd go back to either before subjecting myself to the tasteless ostentation of Versailles . Well worth trying to do both in the same day.
Though St Denis is of huge importance in the history of architecture and of France, it's much more engaging intellectually than aesthetically: there isn't, to my mind, anything there than takes your breath away when you look at it (which there most certainly is in Chartres) - and the town of St Denis is breathtakingly charmless.
Both of them can easily be fitted into other journeys in France. It's not too great a detour to drive or get a taxi to St Denis en route from central Paris to CDG, or while driving from Paris or Northern Europe to SW France.
Depends what you're interested in. At some stage, you can't really say you've visited France unless you've been to both and you'll want to see the other, and I'd go back to either before subjecting myself to the tasteless ostentation of Versailles . Well worth trying to do both in the same day.
May 8th, 2012, 05:27 AM
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Chartres.
St Denis impressed me as just a big building with some dead royalty in the basement. It's not that it is uninteresting; it's just that if you must choose, it loses in my opinion.
Chartres is an architecturally interesting building with great glass.
St Denis impressed me as just a big building with some dead royalty in the basement. It's not that it is uninteresting; it's just that if you must choose, it loses in my opinion.
Chartres is an architecturally interesting building with great glass.
May 8th, 2012, 06:16 AM
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Chartres. And while there pay a visit also to La Maison Picassiette:
http://www.chartres-tourisme.com/en/...cassiette/540/
http://www.chartres-tourisme.com/en/...cassiette/540/
May 8th, 2012, 06:17 AM
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Well you can't argue with unanimity! Chartres it is.
Should I buy a train ticket in advance? Gare Montparnasse is within walking distance of my hotel.
In case I wind up with some free time during another day, how long would the transport to St. Denis take? Denfert-Rochereau stop area.
flanner, Versailles was a mosh pit. I appreciated the gardens, but have enjoyed many other buildings much, much more.
Should I buy a train ticket in advance? Gare Montparnasse is within walking distance of my hotel.
In case I wind up with some free time during another day, how long would the transport to St. Denis take? Denfert-Rochereau stop area.
flanner, Versailles was a mosh pit. I appreciated the gardens, but have enjoyed many other buildings much, much more.
May 8th, 2012, 07:36 AM
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We visited St Denis on our last trip to Paris. It is about a 30 minute metro ride and the Basillica is very close to the metro stop. As someone mentioned, about an hour is all that is needed. If there is any charm in the area I must have missed it. Interesting though to look around a bit to see another side of Paris. Definitely train to Chartres if you must decide between the two.
May 8th, 2012, 07:47 AM
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Been to both several times and clearly Chartres is the winner, though I enjoyed St-Denis. It's been awhile since my last trip there, but if I recall correctly, it was about 20-30 minutes to get to the station, then a brief walk to the cathedral and other sites. No need to buy a ticket in advance for either destination.
May 8th, 2012, 07:53 AM
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Is it possible to save money if the OP buys the Chartres ticket early (assuming she knows her date)? When I went I bought my ticket the morning of (believe it was good for any train, RT), and thought it was a bit expensive. I don't remember the price now, but remember thinking I should have planned ahead and tried to save some $$$.
May 8th, 2012, 09:09 AM
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You won't save any money buying your ticket to Chartres ahead of time as it is a fixed price. However, you may want to buy it ahead to make sure you don't get stuck in a long line waiting to buy a ticket and then miss your train. Of course, trains are frequent between Paris and you wouldn't have to wait long for the next one but if the OP's hotel is already near Gare Montparnasse then why not pop in and buy it if you've got a minute. The ticket is valid for 60 days so you can use it on any train at any time in that 60 day time frame. The cost of the ticket each way is 14.60€ (there are no such thing as round trip tickets).
May 8th, 2012, 10:00 AM
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I think I preferred St Denis, actually, but I just found it more interesting in terms of history and the funerary sculpture (and there are some good museums in town).
The ticket to Chartres isn't expensive, it's only 15 euro. You can never get discounts on local trains like that.
The ticket to Chartres isn't expensive, it's only 15 euro. You can never get discounts on local trains like that.
May 8th, 2012, 10:55 AM
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Does Malcolm Miller always conduct the English tours at 12 and 2:45?
I will get the outbound ticket in advance. Since a couple of reviews suggest that people book both tours as they are all different, I am not sure when I want to head back to Paris. The train tickets don't sell out, do they?
I will get the outbound ticket in advance. Since a couple of reviews suggest that people book both tours as they are all different, I am not sure when I want to head back to Paris. The train tickets don't sell out, do they?
May 8th, 2012, 11:23 AM
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s it possible to save money if the OP buys the Chartres ticket early (assuming she knows her date)?>
yes like Mystique says that Chartres train tickets are a flat fare - one ticket can be used on any train that day at least - be sure to validate the ticket yourself before boarding by sticking it in the composteur machines - compost it before boarding or you will be considered to be riding without a valid ticket and could face a steep fine.
Chartres hands down in this case - not only as flanner says much more breathhtaking but the town of Chartres is a sweet regional town as well with other sights (other ancient churches, little venice and Picassiette' House - one of the world's most prominent examples of Art Brut!)
St Denis is historical and monumental but lies in a dicey suburban area that I guess is not as grimy as it was when I last went to Saint-Denis (then there was even grafitti on the actual basilica outside walls!) - just an rather ugly downtrodden area that invites one to get the heck back to the train station ASAP.
Chartres by a million miles in this case. And Saint-Denis is really in Paris - just an RER stop or two over the ring road demarcating central Paris - so treat it like any other Paris sight and not some day trip.
yes like Mystique says that Chartres train tickets are a flat fare - one ticket can be used on any train that day at least - be sure to validate the ticket yourself before boarding by sticking it in the composteur machines - compost it before boarding or you will be considered to be riding without a valid ticket and could face a steep fine.
Chartres hands down in this case - not only as flanner says much more breathhtaking but the town of Chartres is a sweet regional town as well with other sights (other ancient churches, little venice and Picassiette' House - one of the world's most prominent examples of Art Brut!)
St Denis is historical and monumental but lies in a dicey suburban area that I guess is not as grimy as it was when I last went to Saint-Denis (then there was even grafitti on the actual basilica outside walls!) - just an rather ugly downtrodden area that invites one to get the heck back to the train station ASAP.
Chartres by a million miles in this case. And Saint-Denis is really in Paris - just an RER stop or two over the ring road demarcating central Paris - so treat it like any other Paris sight and not some day trip.
May 8th, 2012, 12:34 PM
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http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...com-miller.cfm
Malcolm Miller's eclectic tours of the cathedral make cold old stones spring to life - one of the reasons I'd go to Chartres to take this iconic legendary expert's tour of inside and out of the world-famous Chartres Cathedral - but read the above Fodor's thread as me and others have had disturbing things happen on Malcolm's tours - the way he can poorly treat folks - but not to throw the baby out with the bath water - nabbing Malcolm's spiel will be the highlight of your visit and perhaps the most memorable thing about the cathedral apart from its exqusite stained-glass windows. Note do not mistakenly think the word 'chartreuse' comes from some hues of colors in Chartres' cathedral glass!
Malcolm Miller's eclectic tours of the cathedral make cold old stones spring to life - one of the reasons I'd go to Chartres to take this iconic legendary expert's tour of inside and out of the world-famous Chartres Cathedral - but read the above Fodor's thread as me and others have had disturbing things happen on Malcolm's tours - the way he can poorly treat folks - but not to throw the baby out with the bath water - nabbing Malcolm's spiel will be the highlight of your visit and perhaps the most memorable thing about the cathedral apart from its exqusite stained-glass windows. Note do not mistakenly think the word 'chartreuse' comes from some hues of colors in Chartres' cathedral glass!
May 8th, 2012, 12:52 PM
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>Saint-Denis is really in Paris - just an RER stop or two over the ring road demarcating central Paris
True, but if you're going to the basilica, the Metro station on Line 13, St.-Denis Basilique, is very close to the basilica. The RER station, on the other hand, is a 15-20 minute walk away.
For tickets to Chartres, if you are age 60+ you may request a "découverte senior" ticket. If your train operates during a "période bleue" (off-peak time), you will get a 25% reduction in fare.
True, but if you're going to the basilica, the Metro station on Line 13, St.-Denis Basilique, is very close to the basilica. The RER station, on the other hand, is a 15-20 minute walk away.
For tickets to Chartres, if you are age 60+ you may request a "découverte senior" ticket. If your train operates during a "période bleue" (off-peak time), you will get a 25% reduction in fare.
May 8th, 2012, 12:54 PM
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MaineGG - thanks for the clarification on metro stop vs RER - take the metro by all means - even probably cheaper than the RER. And no reason to wander around this drab area any longer than you have to IMO.
