jtpj777

My neighbours in Nice (although I might not know them) will generally say, "Bonjour" etc on passing. Same in the local shops. The French are being polite, it doesn't mean that they want to be friends.

PS I have limited experience of Switzerland but still remember being told by one of its citizens: " Why don't you go and do this (activity) in your own country"! I know that that might have been exceptional; however, I haven't felt endeared to the Swiss since.

PalenQ

The French are being polite, it doesn't mean that they want to be friends.>

same with Americans!

One thing in Belgium I did not like was that bike shops I and my tour groups went in often were met with the question:

"What do you want?"

And when responding "oh I'm just looking"

the shopowners' retorts often were "if just looking there's the door"

happened several times and we Americans could not understand why?

We often find sales people or cashiers in stores not being friendly- don't bother me and I rather like it -here every little clerk has to say "How Yah Doing" or "How's your day going", etc - some stores force this actually- my Kroger here says each cashier but say thank you and good bye to all customers.

I prefer the more perfunctory duty-like attitude of European cashiers but many Americans may think it rude.

StCirq

<<I prefer the more perfunctory duty-like attitude of European cashiers but many Americans may think it rude.>>

There's not a single store we go into in these parts, whether it's a big supermarket or small specialty shop, where the cashiers don't greet you with a big smile and a "Bonjour, M'dame, M'ssieur!" and once the transaction has been completed say "Bonne journée. Au revoir." It isn't perfunctory or duty-like. It comes across as just the ways things are here....pleasant and polite. I can't imagine anyone thinking it rude. What's rude is not to engage in the very same pleasantries with every person you encounter.

And I find it ever so much more pleasant than the scripted American "Have a nice day! Can I have your Zip Code, please?" while the cashier is buffing her fingernails.

sundriedtopepo

I think sometimes our perception is a bit skewed when we are travelling. Canadians come back from the US and say, I love Americans, they're so friendly. OTOH we hear Americans saying how friendly Canadians are.

I think more than anything, this saying a greeting or not is a matter of culture, because deep down we are all the same, we all need social engagement.

PalenQ

What's rude is not to engage in the very same pleasantries with every person you encounter.>

I assure you that the Carrefour I went to for years had none of that -I gather that it is not a recent development but yes in smaller stores I've gotten greetings.

and wait people in restaurants do not do the excessive groveling for tips as ours - I am many and even most of the French I know think they can be rude at times -I have personally witnessed that with them several times -literally throwing plates and cups on tables -that is fine with me too = they have a hard job and I like the fact that unlike our wait staff they are not on you every second "Is everything all right" etc. (though I don't mind that either just find it contrived.

kerouac

A Carrefour or an Auchan or a Leclerc hypermarket, even in "the middle of nowhere" as they often are, does not qualify as a village setting, and it is usually the urban codes that apply in such places (i.e. "silent indifference"). On the other hand, in a small town, people usually know most of the employees in the local supermarket or at least recognize them, and different courtesy codes apply.

nukesafe

Greeting each other is not only a regionally distributed activity in France, it happens (or used to) in the States, as well. I recall, as a small boy in the 1930's, we moved from the big city of Chicago to a tiny Missouri town. My Father came home after his first day at work to find my mother in tears. "Oh, Fran", I recall her wailing, "I went shopping for groceries, and this crazy man accosted me in the street! I'm afraid to leave the house!".

On further questioning she reveled this chap had smiled at her and said, "Why good morning Mam', how are you and your little boy doing on such a fine day?"

She was only 19, and had lived a quite sheltered life in Chicago, where such an "confrontation" would have never happened, so it took some convincing for her to be comfortable with all that threatening small town friendliness.

PalenQ

(i.e. "silent indifference").>

great wording -that's perfect silent indifference -couldn't care less 'how you are today' or saying merci -just shoving your goods into one chute and getting to the next person in line.

In Holland don't even dare go into a supermarket just before closing time or get frowns from staff eager to get going. And the Dutch cashiers literally just throw the stuff down and go on to the next customer before you even have time to collect your stuff.

I don't care if they say hi or bye or dank u wel but I do not like the hurried 'get the H out of here' attitude after being cashiered.

But many Americans I think would think the lack of at least a thank you to be rude - and it is not or they are rude even to fellow countrymen- which is what my French born and bred son always says when Americans tell him they thought the French were rude- he says that's the way they are to each other too.

He has some real horror stories about trying to get service in some cafes in Paris for example- waiting long time whilst waiter chatted away on the phone, etc.

menachem

In Holland don't even dare go into a supermarket just before closing time or get frowns from staff eager to get going. And the Dutch cashiers literally just throw the stuff down and go on to the next customer before you even have time to collect your stuff.

How long since you've been in NL, PalenQ?

bilboburgler

Being asked for your zip/post code.

It still happens in the UK occasionally that we get asked for our post code or our email address, which is met with granite like "why?" which normally stops the process straight away, if the answer is "marketing" we ask to talk to them......

Still I understand the answer in Starbucks to the question "whats your name?" is "Starbucks doesn't pay enough tax"

WoinParis

Menachem that is not the right question but rather where did he go to ? Same for bikes in Belgium.
Maybe you come with 10 guys looking like real bad boys and everyone wants to see your back PQ ?

Nikki

In small shops in France, including big cities, I never know how to get out the door. There is a whole ritual of greetings upon entering and exiting, and I never know who is supposed to say the last thing. Bonne journee. Merci, aurevoir. Non, c'est moi qui vous remercie.

I find the "have a good day" of Americans no more insincere than the "bonne journee" of the French or the "buona giornata" of the Italians. We all have our greeting rituals. They oil the mechanisms of social interaction and generally leave people with a pleasant feeling.

As far as smiling and laughing, I have read here that people in Europe think Americans look like idiots when they smile a lot. I smile a lot and laugh too much, I know it but there doesn't seem to be much I can do about it. If people think I am an idiot I will have to live with that.

WoinParis

'If people think I am an idiot I will have to live with that.'

Been living with that for quite a time already ;-)

I think people everywhere appreciate people who smile. Just my impression.

kleeblatt

Of course, Europeans look at each other quite stereotypically too.

The Germans are harsh and over-exaggerate their qualifications.
The French only like the French and all things French.
The Brits are either bloody courageous or stupid, depending on how Brexit works out.
The Scandinavians are too far away to really have an opinion about except that they're usually tall and the women are beautiful.
The Austrians are warm and hospitable.
The Italians are loud, chaotic but make great food.
The Swiss are cold but efficient.

and on, and on, and on.

kerouac

Those are just the most general stereotypes. There are many more incredibly specific ones, and I'm sure you know that they also concern people from other parts of the same country.

Don't know where you got that stereotype about the Austrians, though, unless it was just in comparison to the Germans. To most of Europe, Germans and Austrians are pretty much identical.

frencharmoire

I am not going to read this entire thread, but in case no one corrected the second post, there are street markets in the US. My favorite happens to be the Italian Market in Philadelphia.

fuzzbucket

You can't just waltz merrily along into the local Prefecture, the Office of Immigration, the American Embassy, or any other government building without making an appointment.
Making an appointment can take days, weeks or even months to accomplish - especially around the holidays.
But just try telling that to an American.

frencharmoire

Not to put too fine a point on it, but the politics of Western Europe & the US have become nearly indistinguishable from each other recently, and this seems more overwhelmingly important to bridging understanding (and solving human problems all the advanced capitalist economies have in common) than whether pizza gets eaten with a fork or people say hello or goodbye to strangers. European life (and I think of the US as being in the family of Europe) is fast moving toward a very different reality than the one most of us grew up with, and if Le Pen should get to join the new Putin-Trump-Farage alliance (with same nasty Poles and Hungerians etc linking arms with that illiberal bunch), Europeans and Americans who wish to preserve different values and open societies will need to find each other and work together to outflank the mean-spirited and inhumane.

frencharmoire

Just eyeballing one more post in this thread:

People who do not vote in America have been encouraged NOT to vote. This is not an accident. The people who do vote have been encouraged to think of themselves superior, and to heap insults upon those who don't (by the very same people who want to make sure turnout in America is not full participation.) It is NOT wanted, and it is fully part of the American system, and designed to be that way. So don't be ignorant of the system.

Interestingly, the most recent US election was an anomaly in that Donald Trump recognzied that the only way he could beat the system was to encourage non-voters and those outside the system to vote, and vote against the system. Both parties are still reeling from the upset, and the Democrats in particular are loudly trying to restore the equilibrium by insulting voters to drive them back out of the elections. But I don't think the status quo can be restored, and Democrats will have to learn some other tactic, ending the campaigning-by-insult, and encouraging voter participation by offering them a positive vision & reason to vote. Tall order after all these years of thinking that a panoramic attitude of insulting everybody but your suburuban neighbors (and even them in private) was always going to win & make you secure. Game over.

bilboburgler

Looking at famiy members and friends I've visited with Germans are normally very nice sensible people. Many Austrians are either odd or just creepy. Serious note: (the Austrian who took me into see his art gallery taken off Jews to enable them to cross the border was by far the worst).

Just for a moment then I understood why Boris made the Prosecco comment.

To all, everywhere, especially Austrians and Belgians, have a great weekend.