Bordeaux France...Sarlat & Rocadamour...Need advise for trip in September!
Jul 30th, 2009, 04:34 AM
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Bordeaux France...Sarlat & Rocadamour...Need advise for trip in September!
We will be in Bordeaux for 4 days in September... Monday - Thursday noon. We have a flight on Sunday morning at 10:30 am from CDG Airport in Paris. We would like to drive to Rocadamour and Sarlat on Thursday late afternoon...spending Friday and most of Saturday. We REALLY need advise on how to do this...where to stay, good restaurants, what "not to miss," how to arrange our schedule, where to drop the car and catch a train to CDG, etc.
Thanks so much for the help!
Thanks so much for the help!
Jul 30th, 2009, 05:19 AM
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First of all you need to consider how to get back to Paris.
Where were you thinking of dropping the car? Brive la Gaillarde is a possibility, as most of the major rental companies have offices there, and you could then take the train up to Paris.
But ...it is not possible to catch a train that will get you to CDG Sunday morning, unless you are prepared to take an overnight/sleeper train. As someone who lives near Sarlat but has to get back to Canada to see family, I can assure you that we found this out early on. Now we usually fly Toulouse/Frankfort/Toronto, avoiding Paris altogether. If you are already booked from CDG on Sunday morning, that means a train Saturday afternoon and an overnight in Paris. Which means very little time in Sarlat.
Or, as Kerouac says, drive into Paris, getting up very early, or again the night before. Remembering that for a 10.30 flight you need to arrive about 3 hours early, which leaves hardly any time Sunday morning.
Once you figure out how much time you actually have, you can start thinking about how to use it. But you won't have very much - it will take 2+ hours on the autoroute from Bordeaux to Sarlat, 3+ hours on the more scenic route.
You could conceivably spend Thursday night/Friday in Sarlat, and drive into Rocamadour on Saturday morning. It doesn't take a lot of time to see Rocamadour - in fact, the view from above is probably the thing most worth seeing.
Or you could wait till next time and see the area properly, which would probably make more sense.
Where were you thinking of dropping the car? Brive la Gaillarde is a possibility, as most of the major rental companies have offices there, and you could then take the train up to Paris.
But ...it is not possible to catch a train that will get you to CDG Sunday morning, unless you are prepared to take an overnight/sleeper train. As someone who lives near Sarlat but has to get back to Canada to see family, I can assure you that we found this out early on. Now we usually fly Toulouse/Frankfort/Toronto, avoiding Paris altogether. If you are already booked from CDG on Sunday morning, that means a train Saturday afternoon and an overnight in Paris. Which means very little time in Sarlat.
Or, as Kerouac says, drive into Paris, getting up very early, or again the night before. Remembering that for a 10.30 flight you need to arrive about 3 hours early, which leaves hardly any time Sunday morning.
Once you figure out how much time you actually have, you can start thinking about how to use it. But you won't have very much - it will take 2+ hours on the autoroute from Bordeaux to Sarlat, 3+ hours on the more scenic route.
You could conceivably spend Thursday night/Friday in Sarlat, and drive into Rocamadour on Saturday morning. It doesn't take a lot of time to see Rocamadour - in fact, the view from above is probably the thing most worth seeing.
Or you could wait till next time and see the area properly, which would probably make more sense.
Jul 30th, 2009, 06:46 AM
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Hi nc,
Unless you are required to be in Bordeaux, I think that you have 1 too many days there.
You want to be back in Paris Saturday evening.
See www.viamichelin.com for driving routes.
You can drop the car in Brive la Gaillarde, or drive back to Libourne, and take the train to Paris. See www.voyages-sncf.com for trains.
Have you considered staying in the area and visiting St. Emilion, Arcachon, etc?
Unless you are required to be in Bordeaux, I think that you have 1 too many days there.
You want to be back in Paris Saturday evening.
See www.viamichelin.com for driving routes.
You can drop the car in Brive la Gaillarde, or drive back to Libourne, and take the train to Paris. See www.voyages-sncf.com for trains.
Have you considered staying in the area and visiting St. Emilion, Arcachon, etc?
Jul 30th, 2009, 08:29 AM
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There is a 19:07 train from Brive to Paris, if that helps. You can get to Sarlat by Thursday evening. Visit Rocamadour the next day. See Sarlat on Saturday, including its market and take the train back from Brive.
Jul 30th, 2009, 09:55 AM
#6
One of my friends has a house near Gramat, right between Rocamadour and the Gouffre de Padirac. Gramat has two daily trains to Paris-Austerlitz, but I have no idea if they have a place to drop off rental cars.
I can't imagine having to spend 4 days in Bordeaux. I might slit my wrists after just 24 hours.
I can't imagine having to spend 4 days in Bordeaux. I might slit my wrists after just 24 hours.
Jul 30th, 2009, 10:12 AM
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I'm a fan of Bordeaux, but even I wouldn't spend 4 days there. That would be hell on earth, unless you were planning to roam around to Arcachon and Cap Ferret and the Dune du Pylat and perhaps wine country.
And zooming off to Sarlat and Rocamadour (which aren't exactly next door to each other) for one night seems terribly extreme.
Unless this is a business trip where you're forced to be in Bordeaux for that length of time and are just trying to squeeze in a glimpse of the Périgord and Quercy, I think you should go back to the drawing board and totally rethink this.
And zooming off to Sarlat and Rocamadour (which aren't exactly next door to each other) for one night seems terribly extreme.
Unless this is a business trip where you're forced to be in Bordeaux for that length of time and are just trying to squeeze in a glimpse of the Périgord and Quercy, I think you should go back to the drawing board and totally rethink this.
Jul 30th, 2009, 10:25 AM
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I agree with the others about Bordeaux - 1 good day is enough. We spent a day there this past June, then off to the Dordogne for 2 weeks.
If you only have a short time in the Dordogne region - I think I would try to limit my travel time & perhaps skip Rocamadour & just stick with the sites around Sarlat.
Do you have my 20+ page Dordogne itinerary?? I recently revised it. E-mail me at [email protected] if you want a copy.
Stu Dudley
If you only have a short time in the Dordogne region - I think I would try to limit my travel time & perhaps skip Rocamadour & just stick with the sites around Sarlat.
Do you have my 20+ page Dordogne itinerary?? I recently revised it. E-mail me at [email protected] if you want a copy.
Stu Dudley
Jul 30th, 2009, 11:02 AM
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Wow! Thanks so much to everyone for your help...this is so helpful!!! Don't worry...we are not going to be parked in Bordeaux for days ~ we're going to be out in the vineyards!
We are actually arriving in Bordeaux on Sunday afternoon and have a 4 day/3 night Wine/Chateaux tour starting on Monday morning. We're spending just 1 night actually in Bordeaux...then different places each of the next 3 nights...Chateau Marojallia in Margaux, Le Relais du Chateau d'Arche in Sauternes, and Wednesday night at Chateau Franc Mayne in St. Emilion. Our tour finishes on Thursday morning, but we could cut out that morning and head to Sarlat. It looks like such a beautiful town! We've also heard a lot about Rocadamour and how pretty it is...but, if it's too much for this trip, we can always stay around Sarlat and perhaps visit Pergeuex?
What is your recommendations for an itinerary and timing? Where should we stay...we can do the same place for 2 nights or different places each night? How far is Bordeaux from Sarlat...Sarlat to Rocadamour...Pergeuex? Or are there other town/villages you would recommend? We just love the medieval and quaint areas! And lastly, the car and train. I think that the drive from this area to CDG Airport might be too ambitious for us on Saturday...isn't it about a 6-7 hour drive? Since the train goes directly into the airport...and we're staying at the CDG Sheraton that night, we were thinking that it would be the best way to go...Bordeaux has a direct train at 2:22 pm, but it seems crazy to drive all the way back if there is another train station closer to Sarlat.
Lots of questions, but I really appreciate the help!!!
We are actually arriving in Bordeaux on Sunday afternoon and have a 4 day/3 night Wine/Chateaux tour starting on Monday morning. We're spending just 1 night actually in Bordeaux...then different places each of the next 3 nights...Chateau Marojallia in Margaux, Le Relais du Chateau d'Arche in Sauternes, and Wednesday night at Chateau Franc Mayne in St. Emilion. Our tour finishes on Thursday morning, but we could cut out that morning and head to Sarlat. It looks like such a beautiful town! We've also heard a lot about Rocadamour and how pretty it is...but, if it's too much for this trip, we can always stay around Sarlat and perhaps visit Pergeuex?
What is your recommendations for an itinerary and timing? Where should we stay...we can do the same place for 2 nights or different places each night? How far is Bordeaux from Sarlat...Sarlat to Rocadamour...Pergeuex? Or are there other town/villages you would recommend? We just love the medieval and quaint areas! And lastly, the car and train. I think that the drive from this area to CDG Airport might be too ambitious for us on Saturday...isn't it about a 6-7 hour drive? Since the train goes directly into the airport...and we're staying at the CDG Sheraton that night, we were thinking that it would be the best way to go...Bordeaux has a direct train at 2:22 pm, but it seems crazy to drive all the way back if there is another train station closer to Sarlat.
Lots of questions, but I really appreciate the help!!!
Jul 30th, 2009, 11:21 AM
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I guess you're into wine. That's ok, but boy, for someone who professes to love medieval quaint areas, you're totally missing out on the pretty bits.
I would skip Rocamadour. Do you know that it's the "deuxième site de France" after le Mont-St-Michel for tourism and is completely packed with tourists most of the year? I wouldn't call it pretty, either. At least not in comparison with about 5,000 places in the Périgord.
I would get out of whatever wine château town you're in at the first possible moment and head to Sarlat or nearby (Domme, Cénac, La Roque-Gageac, Beynac, St-Cyprien, Le Bugue....). Périgueux (note spelling) wouldn't be my choice of venue for a first-time visitor to the area. Don't even go there. You don't have time. Nor do you want to stay in two places (you can't - you have only one night there - Friday - see my comments below). The entire area you want to visit (which you honestly don't have even close to enough time for) is small.
You'll only have Friday to visit if you're planning to leave from CDG on Saturday (what time is your flight). In fact, you should plan to take the latest TGV from Brive to Paris on Friday (do NOT plan to get from the Dordogne to Paris on the day of your flight!) - or slow train from Périgueux to the Gare d'Austerlitz.
I don't know what to suggest for someone who has essentially a day in the prettiest area in all France. Tour Sarlat and drive around, I guess. It's all gorgeous. Slap yourself silly for having decided to hang around boring wine châteaux 90 miles away.
I would skip Rocamadour. Do you know that it's the "deuxième site de France" after le Mont-St-Michel for tourism and is completely packed with tourists most of the year? I wouldn't call it pretty, either. At least not in comparison with about 5,000 places in the Périgord.
I would get out of whatever wine château town you're in at the first possible moment and head to Sarlat or nearby (Domme, Cénac, La Roque-Gageac, Beynac, St-Cyprien, Le Bugue....). Périgueux (note spelling) wouldn't be my choice of venue for a first-time visitor to the area. Don't even go there. You don't have time. Nor do you want to stay in two places (you can't - you have only one night there - Friday - see my comments below). The entire area you want to visit (which you honestly don't have even close to enough time for) is small.
You'll only have Friday to visit if you're planning to leave from CDG on Saturday (what time is your flight). In fact, you should plan to take the latest TGV from Brive to Paris on Friday (do NOT plan to get from the Dordogne to Paris on the day of your flight!) - or slow train from Périgueux to the Gare d'Austerlitz.
I don't know what to suggest for someone who has essentially a day in the prettiest area in all France. Tour Sarlat and drive around, I guess. It's all gorgeous. Slap yourself silly for having decided to hang around boring wine châteaux 90 miles away.
Jul 30th, 2009, 11:37 AM
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Thanks for your recs...and the slaps...wish I could change it, but my husband is really excited about the vineyards...are they really not worth the time?
We can leave for Sarlat on Thursday morning...and our flight from Paris is on Sunday morning...so we have Thursday afternoon and evening, all day + evening on Friday, and Saturday until whatever time we catch the train. I know it's not ideal, but I'd like to plan something realistic and at least get a taste of this wonderful area. This is just the first trip there and we will definitely be back in the spring!
Given that we have 2 days...how would you use it and where would you stay?
Thanks a million!
We can leave for Sarlat on Thursday morning...and our flight from Paris is on Sunday morning...so we have Thursday afternoon and evening, all day + evening on Friday, and Saturday until whatever time we catch the train. I know it's not ideal, but I'd like to plan something realistic and at least get a taste of this wonderful area. This is just the first trip there and we will definitely be back in the spring!
Given that we have 2 days...how would you use it and where would you stay?
Thanks a million!
Jul 30th, 2009, 11:56 AM
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I agree with everything that StCirq said about timing, etc., except that I'll let her do the slapping.
I can understand the Bordeaux wine thing - my husband would love to do that someday, but if he did, I'd probably spend that time in the Dordogne area without him.
With the time you have, find a hotel in or near Sarlat - search the board here for great suggestions. We stayed at a B&B right on the main square in Sarlat. Might be too noisy for some, but I loved it, and the owners were very gracious. On another trip, we stayed in Domme, a smaller town nearby.
From either location, your days will be more than full visiting castles (most dating from the Hundred Years' War) and prehistoric sites. And enjoying the incredibly beautiful area. And eating. And eating. And drinking too.
On getting back up to Paris, after much research on the different options presented by other Fodorites, we drove to Brive, dropped our car there, and took the train from there. We took the train into Paris, however, and spent several days there. I can't give any advice about taking the train from Brive to CDG.
With the amount of time you have, I would agree with StCirq to skip Rocamadour - we've visited it, but we had more time in the area, and were visiting some nearby caves.
Enjoy!
I can understand the Bordeaux wine thing - my husband would love to do that someday, but if he did, I'd probably spend that time in the Dordogne area without him.
With the time you have, find a hotel in or near Sarlat - search the board here for great suggestions. We stayed at a B&B right on the main square in Sarlat. Might be too noisy for some, but I loved it, and the owners were very gracious. On another trip, we stayed in Domme, a smaller town nearby.
From either location, your days will be more than full visiting castles (most dating from the Hundred Years' War) and prehistoric sites. And enjoying the incredibly beautiful area. And eating. And eating. And drinking too.
On getting back up to Paris, after much research on the different options presented by other Fodorites, we drove to Brive, dropped our car there, and took the train from there. We took the train into Paris, however, and spent several days there. I can't give any advice about taking the train from Brive to CDG.
With the amount of time you have, I would agree with StCirq to skip Rocamadour - we've visited it, but we had more time in the area, and were visiting some nearby caves.
Enjoy!
Jul 30th, 2009, 11:59 AM
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I can see one or two wine châteaux, but 4 days worth? Yes, that's definitely boring, at least in that area. The châteaux of course are all pretty, but the area is blech, at least compared to what you'll see around Sarlat. I know Bordeaux wines are the bomb and all that, and I've spent 20+ years in the area, but I really hope your husband is a serious oenophile (if he were, wouldn't he have planned around the harvest?), because otherwise....this was not the best idea.
What's your budget? Can't help with where to stay without knowing that.
Very relieved to hear you'll be going back in the spring.
What's your budget? Can't help with where to stay without knowing that.
Very relieved to hear you'll be going back in the spring.
Jul 30th, 2009, 12:01 PM
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>>where would you stay>>
Sarlat.
There are hundreds of things to do in the region. However, many things like cave tours will consume a lot of time (getting tickets, driving to the site, waiting for the guided/scheduled tour to start, etc).
If you stay in Sarlat, you can visit Sarlat in the early mornings or late afternoons - that's the best time to visit it anyway.
I would just concentrate on the short stretch along the Dordogne River from St Cyprien to Domme, so that you minimize your travel time. This area is beautiful. Take a boat trip from either Beynac or Roque Gageac to get a gloroius view of some of the prettiest villages in France (Beynac & Roque Gageac), and several majestic Chateaux. I would wander through Roque Gageac, Beynac, Domme, Castealnaud Chateau, Ch Milandes, and take the scenic drive from Belves to Castelnaud that I described in the itinerary that I sent you.
Saturday morning is market day in Sarlat. Get there early and visit it. Then head out to Collonges la Rouge, visit, head to Brive (10 mins from Collonges), dump the car, and take the train to Paris. Like I mentioned in the e-mail I sent you - don't stay Sat night at the Sheridan (sp) at CDG - what a letdown after a wonderful week in France. Instead, spend Sat night in Paris & take a taxi to CDG the next morning. There will be almost nobody on the road between Paris & CDG on Sunday morning.
You'll return to the Dordogne.
Stu Dudley
Sarlat.
There are hundreds of things to do in the region. However, many things like cave tours will consume a lot of time (getting tickets, driving to the site, waiting for the guided/scheduled tour to start, etc).
If you stay in Sarlat, you can visit Sarlat in the early mornings or late afternoons - that's the best time to visit it anyway.
I would just concentrate on the short stretch along the Dordogne River from St Cyprien to Domme, so that you minimize your travel time. This area is beautiful. Take a boat trip from either Beynac or Roque Gageac to get a gloroius view of some of the prettiest villages in France (Beynac & Roque Gageac), and several majestic Chateaux. I would wander through Roque Gageac, Beynac, Domme, Castealnaud Chateau, Ch Milandes, and take the scenic drive from Belves to Castelnaud that I described in the itinerary that I sent you.
Saturday morning is market day in Sarlat. Get there early and visit it. Then head out to Collonges la Rouge, visit, head to Brive (10 mins from Collonges), dump the car, and take the train to Paris. Like I mentioned in the e-mail I sent you - don't stay Sat night at the Sheridan (sp) at CDG - what a letdown after a wonderful week in France. Instead, spend Sat night in Paris & take a taxi to CDG the next morning. There will be almost nobody on the road between Paris & CDG on Sunday morning.
You'll return to the Dordogne.
Stu Dudley
Jul 30th, 2009, 12:41 PM
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All of these suggestions are so terrific!!!
We will head to Sarlat early on Thursday morning and will definitely plan a train on Saturday afternoon from Brive to Paris...spend our last night in Paris...and catch a cab early Sunday morning to the airport!
Concentrating on the Sarlat and "the short stretch along the Dordogne River from St Cyprien to Domme..." is a terrific suggestion and will allow us to really appreciate this little taste of the region! We will back in the Spring and will have a lot more time to do it the right way!
As far as budget for places to stay...we don't really have a limit...we are more interested in quality, charm, and a memorable stay. We would love to hear about any favorite and special places to stay!
Thanks again for the helping us with this trip...this is just wonderful!
Nancy
We will head to Sarlat early on Thursday morning and will definitely plan a train on Saturday afternoon from Brive to Paris...spend our last night in Paris...and catch a cab early Sunday morning to the airport!
Concentrating on the Sarlat and "the short stretch along the Dordogne River from St Cyprien to Domme..." is a terrific suggestion and will allow us to really appreciate this little taste of the region! We will back in the Spring and will have a lot more time to do it the right way!
As far as budget for places to stay...we don't really have a limit...we are more interested in quality, charm, and a memorable stay. We would love to hear about any favorite and special places to stay!
Thanks again for the helping us with this trip...this is just wonderful!
Nancy
Jul 30th, 2009, 12:50 PM
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La Madeleine in Sarlat, for an old-school feel right in the heart of town (also right in the heart of the Saturday market)
Hôtel Clos le Böetie, Sarlat
La Belle Etoile in La Roque-Gageac
Le Relais des Cinq Châteaux, just outside Sarlat
L'Esplanade in Domme, 10 minutes from Sarlat
Hôtel Clos le Böetie, Sarlat
La Belle Etoile in La Roque-Gageac
Le Relais des Cinq Châteaux, just outside Sarlat
L'Esplanade in Domme, 10 minutes from Sarlat
Jul 30th, 2009, 01:53 PM
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I'd really be interested to know how Sarlat has become the 2nd tourist site after Mont St Michel - very much doubt it.
Might have been the recent article which mentioned Sarlat as an upcoming World Heritage Site, and suggested eating at the Centenaire in Les Eyzies, which has been closed for two years!
Might have been the recent article which mentioned Sarlat as an upcoming World Heritage Site, and suggested eating at the Centenaire in Les Eyzies, which has been closed for two years!
