JAFA

BTD:<BR>I thank you for your response, and again, respect your opinion. I can only hope your restaurant luck improves during your next trip. I can honestly say we never had a bland pasta in all of Italy on either of our two-week journeys, even when one of us ordered a simple pasta w/ fresh tomato sauce.

BTD

Exactly my point --- to each their own. Everyone's palate is different and this is why i gave a little background about myself (asian, preferring spicey foods, etc) so that others who feel they have similar likes can know what to expect. <BR><BR>I don't mean to make it sound there are no good restaurants to eat at --- but the ones we chose for the most part were not on my A list to return to.

BTD

to the person from Montalcino.<BR><BR>We were there only 3 days - but those 3 days were DEFINITELY cold. The days were okay because of the sun shining, but without that - it was cold enough for the steam to come out with each breath (even inside the hotel room). It was cold enough for the locals to wear heavy sweaters and jackets and shopowners sitting outside in the sun to wear all that and a scarf.<BR><BR>So if you didn't think it was cold - then you're like my mom who has high blood pressure and NEVER thinks it's cold,...not even when it's snowing.<BR><BR>And the restaurant we ate at in MOntalcino was a TINY place with father an daughter waiting the tables. I don't recall the name of the dish but it's a popular stew made with wild boar. I love pork so I thought I would like this dish. It was a meat only stew served on a plate with what looked like white pinto beans (whole). The beans were good but the boar was so salty I couldn't eat it....not even with the bread.

BTD

One more thing I forgot….not a criticism, just a FYI.<BR><BR>EVERY restaurant we went to served bread (we didn’t order it) in a little basket….we ate it and it usually cost 4-5 Euros. It’s not like in California – the bread served with your meal is free….so if you’re used to free bread --- be forewarned and expect to pay for it.<BR>

BTD

<BR>Sorry but one more thing<BR><BR>GETOVER and everyone else hanging onto my towel comments.<BR>If I were going camping, mountain climbing, hiking, etc…. I would not EXPECT fluffy towels. I do expect softer towels when I’m paying almost $200 bucks for a night.<BR><BR>All sarcasms aside about the “expectations” issue --- it is a good point. Expect the worst and you will probably have the best time of your life. <BR>HOWEVER expecting people to listen to the piece of advice is…..well….is expecting too much isn’t it?<BR>

BTD

NOSTAMPSHAHA<BR><BR>I forgot to reply about your comments on Montalcino and Positano Traffic.<BR><BR>Montalcino is open to traffic – how else to people get there? True, not many vespas, but plenty of those (no idea what the name is) Vespas with a camper shell on top. (imagine a meter maid vehicle but much smaller) and producing the same exhaust as a Vespa.<BR><BR>Positano is filled with cars, tour buses and vespas of all kinds. If you’re saying Positano is traffic free – you must be referring to the beach and not the road that gets you in and out of there or where most of the hotels are located.<BR><BR>Yes, I am well aware of the fact that the US pollution is HIGH --- but if you compare Los Angeles to Rome --- Los Angeles is like breathing fresh country air (an extreme exaggeration meant only to be an analogy).<BR><BR>And again, I never asked for full blast heat in my room. But it would have been much nicer to sleep with SOME heat coming out. Again, the last example I can give you of how cold it was….the only difference between sleeping in the room versus sleeping outside is that the room doesn’t allow the wind to blow through. Temperature wise, it’s no different than outside.<BR><BR>The hotels’ lobby was nicer because it had a fireplace. If I could have, I would have slept in front of the fireplace.<BR>

Ruthie

BTD, may I ask, and may you respond, what do you do for a living? Just wondering, because you have a good way of justifying yourself and your conclusions. <BR>Now, try to forget your "bad trip" and enjoy San Francisco again.

Ying

Hi BTD: I truly appreciate people like you, Rex, Bob Little, Eye Spy, Jade, Mina and many others who really take time to share their experiences, giving advices and willing to take the punches. Thanks for such great report. You don't need to apologize for how you feel! Ignor those who just don't get it. <BR><BR>Last Oct. when I was in Castelrotto (Octoberfest), we took a hike in Alpe Di Siusi. To my suprise, the Turkish toilets, yes, the toilet is a hole in the ground, and you squat! Men have it easier. We also encountered the rudest waiters in Stresa who pratically yanked the half eaten soup away from one of the ladies in our group because she was eating a little too slow. When she told him she's not finished, he ignored her and ploped the salad in front of her. This was a 6-course dinner. It was in a nice hotel where we stayed, just across the street from Piazza Marconi (boat dock). Another couple had their landry done from this hotel without asking how much it would cost. When the bill came, it was $78, (tens and tens of thousand of lires last year). It was cheaper to replace them! We just came from Munich, and it cost about $10 to do the same amount of lanudry. The next day when we were in the bus, we all had a good laugh about the Turkish toilets, the rude waiters and the high-priced laundry.<BR><BR>We were in several countries, but Italy was the least friendly. Two ladies got their purse picked. Many got short changed, even myself who is a very cautious traveler, was short changed. Check the restaurant bill twice before you sign the credit card slip.<BR><BR>I am going back to Italy again this Nov. I hope the Euro is easier to keep track than the Lira.<BR><BR>Keep your report coming.<BR><BR>Ying

Open Minded

I can sympathize with both BTD and responders like Anon and Nan, who I previously ripped on and apologize for. One beauty of this thread I see is that thanks to the experiences offered by BTD and the thoughts of posters like Anon, Nan and Get Over, we readers can gain insight into being an "experienced" or "wise" traveller. There is a silver lining to all of this, but if you could indulge me for one minute to express the following.<BR><BR>Imagine planning and paying dearly for a vacation in a perceived paradise months in advance. Researching your destination as much as possible in hopes of appreciating it to the fullest. When that trip finally occurs and despite all the beauty you encounter, the occassional spotty service and other aspects that are less than ideal can creep into the back of your mind and take away some of the luster of paradise, but not to the extent so as to spoil your vacation. This was my honeymoon to Bora Bora and Moorea in 2000--my first real venture out of North America. My feelings re the trip at that time was hovering around 9, but if I went with a more open mind and thick skin, I probably would have felt like I was in heaven (10+) the whole time.<BR><BR>Such prior experience as well as absorbing the wisdom from this Fodors forum over the last several months helped this sarcastic, perfectionist, and often-times critical individual (ME) thoroughly plan and enjoy his last vacation this summer with no ounce of complaint. And now I'm very much looking forward to a trip to Italy in spite of all my research.<BR><BR>Keep these very basic thoughts in mind, and you can't help but share in that ideal vacation experience:<BR>1. The service/quality/amenitites you might expect for the amount you spend will rarely coincide, especially in well-touristed destinations. So get over it quick. If you do come across those rare exceptions, be extremely grateful and then inform me of such places immediately. <BR>2. You're going to a foreign/different environment so appreciate the differences instead of criticizing them.<BR>3. Remember you DO represent Americans (or whatever country you're from) wherever you go so please be respectful to help minimize the "Ugly American" perceptions.<BR>4. POSITIVE attitude and OPEN MIND cures many things, especially a potentially disappointing vacation.<BR>5. Thick skin comes from much abuse to sensitive areas. Toughen up and your perception shapes your vacation, not others.<BR><BR>Don't gloss over maps/guidebooks, hurry towards the next site/museum/train, get wrapped up in the details of your travel so much that you forget the above vital basics.<BR><BR>Sorry for my ramble and not to take anything away from your terrific travelogue BTD, but I thought this thread was an appropriate place to share these thoughts.<BR>

Myer

We don't speak Italian. But we took with "Hello", "Good bye", "Thank You" and "Your Welcome". They go a long way to lighting up a local face.<BR><BR>Granted I'm not part of a visible minority so I can't get into that.<BR><BR>We were in Italy in May (again) and had a great time.<BR><BR>We don't drink and never had a problem not ordering wine.<BR><BR>Some restaurants just bring bread and charge for it. The menu will almost always indicate. When we wanted bread we ate and paid. When we didn't want we told the waiter we didn't ask for it and were not charged.<BR><BR>While we travel once almost every year we are not experts. When we have a problem I spend a few minutes trying to fix it and then roll with it. Don't want to ruin a trip or even a day over something small (and in the end most things are small).<BR><BR>Almost never had a problem with local people anywhere.

Donna

We just returned from our Italy trip last night and had a wonderful time. Of course there were some things we didn't like (like being charged for bread) but...overall still love Italy after our third trip and came home planning our next Italian iternary.<BR>I'll post a trip report asa I get all these clothes washed.

Donna

oops..thats itinerary of course.

Mandy

We too encountered some rude people in Italy while on vacation but the exception was in Sorrento--they were so friendly. There were exceptions in Rome--after we dined at Groppola D'Oro (sp?) in Rome the owner hugged us as we left and told us to come back (my husband speaks a little Italian) and when we asked a lady on the street for directions she walked 2 blocks to show us. Other than that, the further away from the big cities the friendlier. <BR>People were very nice in France once out of Paris, so I have learned to accept each situation and deal with it and to see the sights that I came to Europe to see. But I must say it's the people that often make the difference as to how you liked your vacation overall--not how many towels you got etc. <BR>I do appreciate the candid feedback--it's nice to hear about all opinions.<BR>

traveler

I wonder why people are experiencing rudeness in Italy like we did this summer? I acted the same way in France and Spain and didn't experience it there. For a country that makes so much from tourism it is funny. Are they just getting "touristed out"?

Giovanna

We have been to Italy many times and love it; it is our favorite country. We too live in the SF area, so some conclusions BTD draws should perhaps be similar, but they are not.<BR><BR>To go to a foreign country and perhaps expect it to be somewhat different but the same as the US causes many disappointments. The linen towels BTD so disliked are common in many, many hotels in Italy. The linen in general in Italy is very beautiful and we enjoy using it. Some of the waffled linen towels are as absorbent as terry towels.<BR><BR>Heat and bad showers aren't exclusive to Europe. We've had similar experiences in US motels/hotels, but you cope.<BR><BR>We love the food, but have had bad meals and occasionally a less than friendly waiter, but who cares. We eat our dinner and leave a small or no tip at all.<BR><BR>I guess the thing I find most baffling is that the only discussions we heard about BTD's trip were hotel rooms, shopping, the quest for postage stamps, restaurants and unfriendly people. Didn't you do any sightseeing? The cities visited are veritable treasure troves of art, architecture, history and beauty. That's the focus of most of our trips.<BR><BR>Yes BTD you are entitled to your opinion and I am to mine. I'm afraid I just don't get where you're coming from and why you wasted a great deal of money to go to Italy and then compare it to California.

Ann

To Yang and to BTD: You had better not travel to Asia if you think Italy is challenging. They have those squat toilets and bad service and bad food and whatever also, just like any other place on Earth. <BR>It is a part of travel to have things different than you would at home, that is the point and sometimes these differences are perceived as "good" or "bad" by the tourist. <BR>I think you got caught up in worrying about trivial things and missed the whole point of going there in the first place, if you had a point.<BR>Remember not everyone in Italy is not there to make YOUR trip a fun one, they are living there, it is THEIR home and you are visiting. <BR>So, toughen up before you go anywhere else, or the same experiences will keep happening over and over.

Rose

I think alot of people think the locals are put in the scenery to be tour guides or hosts like at an amusement park. These are people doing their daily jobs in good and in bad moods, they are there every day. <BR><BR>You are the one on holiday, not them.<BR>Bear this in mind and your trip will be happier.

aj

When we were in Rome we experienced the thin linen towels! I loved them. They are so crisp and clean feeling. Italy makes some of the finest linen and cotton towels and sheets in the world. You pay top dollar here in the states at fine boutiques for these "thin towels". I love the "old world" experience of this luxery. I know it is not the same as at home but after all isn't that the reason we leave home? To experience new things?

BTD

Ruthie – I’m not sure how it relates, but I work as a research scientist in the Biotechnology field.<BR><BR>Ying - The Euro is pretty much equivalent to the US dollar and very easy to track. It differs by pennies and changes by the second but not by much.<BR>You can use your credit card and your card company will automatically convert the charges to the US dollar on your statement. It’s very very simple. If you have to have cash, get it at an ATM. <BR>DO NOT use the money exchange booths,…you get charged up the you know what to make an exchange and loose lots more than you do by making an ATM withdrawal.<BR><BR>Open Minded – I completely agree with everything you said.<BR>Your plans for your honeymoon is pretty much what I did for my Italy trip – so I completely understand.<BR>

BTD

<BR>Mandy – I agree – the people you encounter make a huge impact on your impression of a country. I did explain we met many friendly locals and enjoyed those interactions. The language barrier is tough – but they’re willing to read my body and sign language as best as they could and I did the same and somehow we were always able to understand each other in the end.<BR><BR>One example – we were heading to rome by car --- stopped at a gas station just outside of rome and were taking a stretch break. An older man (spoke no English) came up to my husband and started speaking Italian to him and using hand gestures. My husband didn’t have a clue but I could pick out enough words here and there and read his arm waving gestures enough to understand that he was trying to ask us to jump the battery on his motorcycle which had died. So I explained to my husband and we told the man yes (in Italian) and motioned him to bring the motorcycle over, which he did. The rest was easy and after we were done, he showed him appreciation by giving us a huge smile which we returned and waved him goodbye as he rode off.<BR><BR>That’s a memory that I love and will remember more than all my negatives.<BR>