h0b0

Is this doable?
(we have 3 kids who are good travelers - but kids nonetheless)

Overnight train from Barcelona to Cordoba...then:

Andalucia day 1 (day 12 of our trip)
Visit Mosque in Cordoba in AM rent a car drive to Parador Jaen. (mappy says 1h 40m drive) stay overnight Parador Jean (if possible)

day 2
drive to Alhambra de Granada - mappy says 2h 30m drive) - spend day at the Alhambra then drive to Ronda late afternoon (mappy says 2h 30m)
spend night in Ronda (Hotel San Gabriel?)

day 3
putz around Ronda before driving to Sevilla for a three night's stay.

Questions:
Does that seem like a reasonable plan?
Am I trying to cram the Alhambra in? Should I skip it? (I know it's magnificent but I have to be realistic)
Can I rent a car in Cordoba and drop it off in Seville without big penalties? (or should we drive back to Cordoba?)
Alternative routes or other things we should see in the area? (Tony-b has mentioned Carmona - opinions re: Carmona vs. Jaen?)

gracias

lincasanova

check out www.vueling.com or www.iberia.com for one way fares to sevilla from barcelona. then take it frm there.

do not skip the alhambra.

jaen castle parador is great. baeza, next to it, is an interesting town also for a stroll or break.

carmona worth a stop, too. (unless you are "castled out".)

usually no drop off fee within spain.

h0b0

Thank you for your reply! Someone mentioned that we might consider Parador Ubeda in addition to (or instead of) Jaen - what's your opinion? We did try to get a room at the Parador at the Alhambra but could not. (do they all fill up 6 mos in advance!?) Gracias - D

lincasanova

keep telephoning the alhambra directly.. not online. i do think it is easier when talking to them.. they might keep you on a waiting list.my friends here in spain who have gotten reservations even the week before just by calling. maybe they were just lucky, but i have heard it more than once.

a man at registration also told me the same.. that i should call if i wanted a room. (this was 30 years ago!)

don't know when you are going but if it is summer or you probably should be looking at places with pools most of the time for the kids. ages?

ubeda is next to baeza.. but those three towns are quite similar.. you probably don't need to go out of your way to visit all of them.

the castle at jaen is perhaps more spectacular. the interiors of the historic properties are quite similar usually.

h0b0

Thank you! I did just book a night at Parador Jaen.

Kristina

Hi-
I just got back from 10 days in Spain, most in Andalucia.
I think you're in for one loooooong day driving from Jean to Granada to Ronda, especially with kids.
Could you not spend the night in Granada? The Alhambra is going to be a minimum of 3 hours and your plan doesn't include any time for getting lost, or getting stuck behind slow moving trucks on the road to Ronda (believe me, you will). We did the drive from Granada to Ronda and it took us a long time. Then we got lost in Ronda, in a maze of one way tiny streets, trying to find our hotel.
In Granada, there are several hotels right up by the entrance to the Alhamba, which could minimize your car time. We stayed at the Hotel Guadalupe which was very nice and about a block up the road from the Alhambra entrance.
As for the car rental, we did a one way, 3 day rental from Granada to Cordoba from Auro Europe with no penalties and it was just fine.
Have a great trip!

Viajero2

What time of the year is your trip? It makes a huge difference in Andalucia.

I, too, can't make a lot of sense out of touring the mosque in Cordova, get on a car, drive to Jaen to stay at a Parador. I would train Barcelona-Sevilla, from where you can home base and day trip to both, Cordova and Sevilla. Then head out to Malaga/Marbella from where to day trip to Granada. The one reason I suggest Malaga/Marbella as your second home base in Andalucia is the fact that these cities are close to the ocean with plenty hotels with pools, etc... (which brings me back to my original question).

For a change in pace and scenery (literally) consider a day at Doña Donana, Spain's most beautiful and unique national park and located in Andalucia.

h0b0

Lincasanova: Yes, I'll give the Alhambra Parador another try. We will be there in the springtime - early April. The kids are 10, 10 and 12 years old. Thanks for the good feedback re: Jaen.
Kristine: Yes, I know it's really pushing it with the AM drive from Jaen to Alhambra - tour - then drive to Rhonda. We're pretty early risers, so I figure we can leave Jaen by 7 - be at Alhambra by 10 - do as much of a "morning" ticket as possible (until 2:00) - then hit the road for Ronda. It's the only day with that much driving (but I'm sure it's beautiful!) ... we've done loooong drives on other trips and been OK. I just hate to miss out on a relaxing evening in Ronda but I guess, as much as I try, I can't have it all! I may end up adding a day in Andalucia (and taking a day off our time in Paris earlier in the trip)... we'll see. Thanks also for the car rental info.
Viajero: Yes, I understand how it might be more efficient to base in Sevilla, but we will have just come off of several "city" days in Barcelona and will need some "space and fresh air!"... Parador Jaen seemed just right for that. (We spend our last three days in Sevilla anyway). We love meandering in the country - getting lost - finding unexpected pleasures much more than the "tour" thing. Re: Malaga, etc... We live on the beach in California, so "beach" isn't a priority at all - nor are modern hotels - we want some "old world" which there's precious little of here on the West Coast. Amenities are nice but I really want my kids to see something different that what we're used to. It's all really kind of a history lesson for them.
Thanks for the Dona Donana recommendation. I've definitely heard it's a wonderful place!

Muchas gracias - everyone's been really helpful! Donna

lincasanova

why don't you just take the train from barcelona to valencia ( 3 hrs.).. overnight here.. see the science center and aquarium, have a nice meal, then rent a car from here and go to granada and jaen without any backtracking?

plenty to see .. easy good roads.. vlc-granada about 5 hours. same for jaen.

you could see the cave houses in guadix.

whatever you do it will be a nice trip, but try to maximize your visiting time and minimize criss-crossing just to take a certain type of transport. since you will be driving anyway in the end.. not much difference, but a lot more efficient IMO.

Viajero2

h0b0: I still don't get your rationale for Jaen; you want "space and fresh air" after several "city" days, hence, you are allowing one overnight stay in Jaen (?). I have traveled with kids and after a week, they will be seeking some normalcy, hence the recommendation to make the second portion of your trip a more relaxed venture. "Tour" is hardly the way I would describe homebasing in two cities, rather than hoping around 4-5. By the way, if you are traveling during the summer in Andalucia, your kids will be begging for beach/pool; the fact they have one in California is not going to be of a much relevance.

Viajero2

h0d0, I forgot to mention on my last post to visit the Roman Ruins of Baelo Claudia, near Tarifa. See photos at:
http://homepage.mac.com/stkeene/PhotoAlbum19.html

This could be another day trip from either Malaga/Marbella, so as you could note, having limited home bases does not preclude you in any way to explore. As an Environmental Engineer, I have worked and visited many remote places in Andalucia evaluating hydroelectrical power networks and you can drive back/forth some gorgeous places in the mountains from the coast. Just trying to share some Lessons Learned.

lmhornet

"Visit Mosque in Cordoba in AM rent a car drive to Parador Jaen. (mappy says 1h 40m drive) stay overnight Parador Jean (if possible)"

While the parador is very nice, Jaen is a complete zip. Further, getting to/from the freeway to the parador is very difficult and time consuming, in part because there are vitually no signs. I would strongly advise you to just go straight to Grenada and to avoid Jaen. The main sights in Cordoba are all very close, so you can leave in plenty of time to get to Granada at a reasonable hour. As far as the Alhanbra is concerned, if you see only one thing in Spain, that is it. (What mosque in Cordoba? There isn't one as far as I know. Unless you mean the Mezquita, which is a cathredral.)

Having said all that, I suggest you revise your trip. Most people do Analucia in a circle, starting at Cordoba. You are going clockwise -> Grenada -> Ronda -> Seville. It is far better to go counter-clockwise: Cordoba->Seville->Ronda->Granada. I say this because you can easily get the high speed train from Cordoba to Seville. Once in in Seville, you don't need a car. So you've saved yourself a lot of driving and don't pay for a rental while you are in Seville, which is also a horror to drive around.

BTW I envy you. The Hotel San Gabriel is an absolutely terrific place.

h0b0

Viajero: We're travling in April.
The reason we want to start in Cordoba is that we're ending our trip in Sevilla and also have been told to avoid driving in and around Sevilla as much as possible. It seems like it doesn't really matter if we start our circle from Cordoba or Sevilla? (not staying at either at that point) I think it's possible for us to overnight train from Barcelona to Granada - maybe that's better and do a day trop from Sevilla to Cordoba at the end of our trip? Thanks for your opinions. (Jaen says they have a pool - lots of mixed opinions re: Jaen though! - some on LP love it!)
Hornit: My understanding is that the Cordoba site was originally a Mosque and the Cathedral was a later addition. Correct me if I'm wrong though. I will consider skipping Jaen. A stay for 5 at the Parador Granada is 500 euros (two rooms needed, they say) ... I can't do that, so Jaen seemed a good compromise to stay in a historic building. Another person recommended Hotel Guadelupe - any other suggestions near the Alhambra?
Again - how about an overnight train from Barcelona to Granada?
thanks, all!
d

Kristina

Donna-

Here's the website for the Hotel Guadalupe.
http://www.hotelguadalupe.es/plantillas/index.php?l=en
We had nice a nice room for 96 euros with a small balcony. The room next to ours had a large terrace with table and chairs and a fantastic view. There are only 2 other hotels next to the Guadalupe, and I think one is a litte Pension. I noticed that right across from the parador (which is on the other side of the entrance to the Alhambra) there is a small one star hotel called, Hotel America? Not sure....
BTW, you are right about the Mezquita in Cordoba. "Mezquita" means mosque in Spanish and actually it was first a church, then a mosque, then turned into a basillica. It's well worth the visit; it's the most facinating blend of islam and catholicism. If you want to stay in Cordoba, I highly recommend the hotel Maimonedes. Our room was so close to the mezquita, I could practically reach out and touch it from our window.
In Ronda, we stayed at the small Jardines de la Muralla. We walked past the Hotel San Gabriel and it looked very nice. We had a good dinner at the Hotel Don Miguel right on the gorge as Ronda really didn't seem like a tapas kind of town. In fact, as much as I liked it, it was also very touristy with every restaurant's menu in 4 languages.
I'll be posting my trip report here soon, so I'll be able to give you more details then.

lmhornet

"BTW, you are right about the Mezquita in Cordoba. "Mezquita" means mosque in Spanish and actually it was first a church, then a mosque, then turned into a basillica."

Put any spin on it you want, but it is not a mosque.

patg

Early April is too early for swimming pools and beaches, even in southern Spain. So, getting the kids to run off some energy is going to be a little tougher without those two outlets. I like your idea of getting up and out early, then having travel time in the afternoon, when the kids can nap - this fits well with the southern Spanish schedule of light breakfast, large midday meal and rest, light (and late) supper. Don't be afraid to try bars, if they seem family-friendly, for your meals.

I've traveled quite a bit in Spain with kids that age, and they do get tired of churches and museums. Look for playgrounds, concerts and things like Granada's Science museum for a break.

Viajero2

Imhornet and Kristina-- you are both wrong. The Mosque in Cordova is used in ecumenical services (Catholic and Spanish Muslims) on special ocassions per an agreement with the Catholic Church. It is NOT a Basilica, but a Mosque-Cathedral, as it is formally documented in the UNESCO World Heritage Site registry. As a matter of fact, it was the multiconfessional uniqueness of this monument that contributed tremendously to its inclusion as a UNESCO World Heritage Site.

Kristina

Well, I stand corrected. It is not a Basillica.
I have the brochure I picked up at the Mezquita in front of me as I write this.
It says, "Brief Guide to the Holy Cathedral Church. Former Mosque of Cordoba"
Unfortunately, it does not say anything about being a UNESCO site, though I have no doubt that it is. It's truely spectacular.
All that said, I really don't have a problem with her referring to it as a mosque, since everyone refers to it as the "Mezquita".

h0b0

When I put the word "mezquita" into my translator it directly translates to the word "mosque" in English.

Is it actively used as a Catholic Church now?

Can something be both a mosque and a church? (could be an interesting dialogue!)

lmhornet

"Can something be both a mosque and a church? (could be an interesting dialogue!)"

It can't. Look. it's not that complicated. "Mezquita" is just the name of the building and not its function. Obviously, it was once a mosque and that's how it got its name. But it hasn't actually functioned as a mosque since the Spaniards from the Muslins from Cordoba. It is a church or a cathedral, I'm not sure which.

Called the Mezquita a mosque is like called the San Francisco "Cannery" a manufacturing plant for seafood.