We're flying into Frankfurt on June 25, departing on July 9 and need some help with planning our trip. We booked with airline miles, so there's no real flexibility to change the dates or do an "open jaw". In a previous post (see http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34964230 ), I asked about possible itineraries and got some great advice on destinations in Germany. However, my wife, who spent a summer in Germany, doesn't want to spend our whole trip there, and neither do I.

Reading through these message boards, there seems to be a recurring theme of discouraging "overly ambitious" trips to multiple destinations. However, our particular tastes usually dictate that 2-3 days in a city/area is usually enough to get a good feel for it -- we are not the "linger all day in a coffeehouse" or "spend the afternoon reading in our hotel room" type of travelers. Nor to we feel like we need to see every palace or museum in every city -- we are simply big walkers/hikers who love culture and nature and are energized by being on the move.

That said, I am working on potential itineraries and need some good advice. I think we'll probably want to stick mainly to trains this time (we drove 4,500 miles on our last 16-day vacation in the USA!), and the places that intrigue us most are below:
Munich/Bavaria (just for a day or two)
Salzburg & Salzgammerkut region
Switzerland (Bernese Oberland)
Italy (Rome seems too far away, but more northerly areas like Venice and/or Cinque Terre sound wonderful)

Looking at the map, it appears that we could do a "loop" southwest from Frankfurt to Bavaria/Austria, then trains west into Switzerland, then up north to Frankfurt. Or, as an alternate plan, to spend a few days in Northern Italy, we would drop the loop southward, coming down from Austria and then back up to Switzerland (spending less time in each place, obviously). Either option seems geographically logical, but figuring out the actual logistics of train lines, schedules, etc., seems pretty complex.

Other things to note -- we're not opposed to hopping on a cheap one-way flight at the start of our trip, and we would also be open to a night train on any leg of the trip.

Thanks so much -- looking forward to your wise and knowledgable responses!

ttt

I'd say you could indeed start with Bavaria, then visit Salzburg and the Salzkammergut. A detour to Venice is doable. From there you can easily continue towards the Bernese Oberland, but I would break up the trip at the Italian Lakes (possibly Stresa) - the train ride is too long from Venice to one of the villages in the BO. From the BO (Interlaken Ost) they have direct trains back to Frankfurt.

If you like to spend only 2-3 days in each area you'll love this trip. However, I'd recommend to spend at maybe 4 nights in the BO - there is too much to see there (natural beauty AND picturesque towns/villages).

Here's a possible route with sights to choose, off the top of my head from previous experience:

Visit Munich if you want to, but the southernmost part holds some great treasures, such as the Füssen area, which is reachable by train from Munich in just 2 hours, and is the land of the fairy tale castles. Optionally, go southeast from Munich and past Chiemsee with another great castle modelled on Versailles. This will take you straight down to Salzburg and the region (Salzkammergut), where you might want to spend some time in the lovely city as well as visit such sights as the Eisriesenwelt (ice caves). I am not quite sure about train connections, but the autobahn south goes straight over the Hohe Tauern and into Italy, leading easily to Venice in a day. Optionally, you could go by bus over the Grossglockner Hochalpenstrasse (2503 metres highest point), via Lienz and Toblach into the Dolomites region, to Cortina, Venice, then westwards, northwards over the Brenner pass to Innsbruck, again westwards past Liechtenstein into Switzerland and finally the Berner Oberland, where there is a lot to see (Jungfrau, Schilthorn, Gletscherslucht, Trümmelbachfälle, Männlichenbahn w/walks, First/Bachalpsee w/walks etc).

A trip I did in 2004 covers Austria and the Dolomites, while one in 2005 goes past Venice and the autobahn there.
I have a webpage up with these trips, including lots of photos, on http://www.terjenet.com (does not contain viruses which will exchange your food with your dog's).

G'luck and enjoy your trip!

You mean southEAST from Frankfurt and I just don't understand why you've ruled out renting a car. That's the very best way (IMO) to enjoy the towns and scenery of Europe - except in the cities of course.

Your loop could include the Romantischestrasse, a Ludwig castle or two, the Zugspitze, the Berchtesgaden area, the Salzkammergut, the Dolomites, etc, etc.

I wouldn't try to include Venice and the CT on this trip - save it for another time with Italy as the main focus...