Where in Jamaica?

Nov 11th, 2003, 04:31 PM
  #1  
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Where in Jamaica?

My daughter works hard, is in her mid 20s and want to relax and have fun for a few days. Where should she go? Shes going with another girl, They're not teens anymore, but not old fogeys either. Any resorts, or sections. Negril, Ohcho Rios, Kingston. Any advice or help will be appreciated. Oh, one more thing, money matters. Thanks
zwho is offline  
Nov 11th, 2003, 07:59 PM
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Frankly, I wouldn't go to Jamaica or encourage them to, either. Unfortunately, Jamaica has become a den of crime and there are too many other beautiful islands in the Caribbean to take the risk. Notice that cruise ships don't stop in Jamaica anymore, which says a lot about its safety.
Boyo is offline  
Nov 12th, 2003, 05:21 AM
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Here we go again. Boyo - where did you get your information that cruise ships dont stop in Jamaica anymore?

As to the original question, I would suggest Beaches Runaway Bay. As for many inexpensive places, she can try Negril. The negril.com site will give her a ton of information on small affordable, relaxing, safe places to stay. Hope this helps.
jray is offline  
Nov 12th, 2003, 08:41 AM
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i love negril. love it.
travel with girls there and never had any problems.
chk negril.com or jamaicans.com
crosbie is offline  
Nov 12th, 2003, 08:49 AM
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I agree with the other posters that said Negril. negril.com or jamaicans.com has a load of info on places and rates.

Boyo: You sound like a clown. Bozo.

TonyHarris is offline  
Nov 12th, 2003, 09:30 AM
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My girlfriend and I stayed at Grand Lido Braco and had a very relaxing time...yes, the beach is rocky, but beautiful. The rooms and service are awesome. BUT it is not cheap. For a less expensive holiday, I would send her to Mexico. More bang for your buck. Just my opinion.
Wednesday is offline  
Nov 12th, 2003, 10:05 AM
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I vote Negril if they want to party at all...Treasure Beach if they don't.

Negril has the best beach - white sand, clear calm water, no rocks or other stuff, the most nightlife that's geared to tourists and easily accessible and it's just over an hour from the airport.

It's also the town younger people prefer.

Boyo, tons of cruise ships stop in Jamaica at Montego Bay, Ocho Rios and when they finish work on the harbor, at Port Antonio as well.

Not sure what budget you have in mind but there are literally hundreds of hotels in Negril at all price levels. The first decision is cliffs or beach. The Beach is the more touristy area, hotels cost a bit more but the live music places are mostly there.

The cliffs are more laid back, somewhat less touristy and quiter...but jumping off cliffs is fun, sunsets are great and you get more for your hotel $$.
liza is offline  
Nov 12th, 2003, 01:49 PM
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Sorry to disagree with you so-called "experts" but I **live** in the Caribbean and closely follow the crime in Jamaica as part of my job. That may sound like I'm a clown to you,TonyHarris (what a rude thing to say), but I believe the advice of a Caribbean resident trumps that of any of you occasional tourists. And zwho, check to see how many cruise ships stop in Jamaica now versus five years ago and you decide who has a command of the facts.

Zwho, avoid Jamaica!!!
Boyo is offline  
Nov 12th, 2003, 02:29 PM
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Boyo,

You lost any credibility you had with me the moment you wrote:

"Notice that cruise ships don't stop in Jamaica anymore..."

A 10 second perusal of a google search titled "Jamaica cruise" brought up this link - among many others.

http://www.cruiseandvacationpackages.com/dest/

What is Number 1 on the list of cruise destinations on this site? Negril, Jamaica. This company represents most of the well-known cruise lines, so I assume they would know what they are talking about.

The job you mentioned wouldn't rely on tourism, and therefore benefit by making unfounded claims about other islands to steer business away from them would it?

By the way, living in an area does not make you an "expert" about it any more than I am an "expert" on where I live.

Back up your claims with some facts please.
Diana is offline  
Nov 12th, 2003, 02:55 PM
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I should add that I realize that Negril is not a port of call, but that it is the favorite destination on the above website - there's a reason for that.

After doing some quick checking out of curiosity, I could not find any major cruiselines that do NOT make stops in Jamaica.
Diana is offline  
Nov 13th, 2003, 01:10 AM
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From one who lives not "in the Caribbean" like crime-researcher Boyo, but in Jamaica, where cruise ships go is irrelevant. In fact, that's exactly why you shouldn't go where they do, even tho cruisers stop daily at MoBay and Ochee and soon, Port Antonio if they ever redredge the harbor. Liza, a long-time JA visitor, puts it spot-on:Negril and Treasure Beach, the latter famed island-wide for the graciousness of its people, let alone freedom from jet skiis, cruise ships, higglers, 'dens of crime' -- and Boyo's.
tivertonhouse is offline  
Nov 13th, 2003, 06:17 AM
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Thanks Diana and tivertonhouse for setting Bozo straight with the facts.
TonyHarris is offline  
Nov 20th, 2003, 10:52 AM
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Yes, thanks for setting me straight. While you're at it could you set the US State Department straight? They use the scare tactic in their Consular Info Sheet (http://travel.state.gov/jamaica.html)that "Crime, including violent crime, is a serious problem in Jamaica". And the CIA? Better set them straight, too, because in their World Fact Book (http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/...k/geos/jm.html) they rudely warn that "Depressed economic conditions have led to increased civil unrest, including serious violent crime." And please don't forget Nationmaster.com, a respected organization that collects data on countries around the world, because they go and list Jamaica as 17th highest *in the world* for murder and 22nd highest for rapes( http://www.nationmaster.com/country/jm/Crime). Yep, we're all just trying to divert tourist business away from poor Jamaica.

By all means, go to Jamaica. Bon Voyage! Just keep this phone number, well, not in your wallet or purse. Just memorize it: 119 -- it's the emergency number for the Jamaican police.
Boyo is offline  
Nov 20th, 2003, 11:26 AM
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Boyo is clearly jaundiced when it comes to Jamaica and apparently can't stand disagreement. Don't listen to someone who just has to be right all the time. You have been out voted here Boyo. Just accept it. Opinion noted, majority disagree. End of story. Move on.
jacketwatch is online now  
Nov 20th, 2003, 11:27 AM
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Boyo, thanks for linking to those sources. A close examination of such objective information is obviously infinitely more valuable than the purely anecdotal "my friend's sister's boyfriend's mom went to Jamaica, and really felt frightened" type of information typical of discussion forums like this one.

Turning, then, to that information, especially the statistics found on Nationmaster.com ... first, it should be said that only per capita statistics are important, not totals. Obviously, the U.S. with its 280 million people will have far greater totals in every crime catagory than Jamaica, with its much smaller population.

As for the individual crime statistics, I would first immediately drop the assault category from consideration, given the likelihood that such a category will be skewed toward domestic violence and the like, not toward tourists. That said, Jamaica ranks 14th, which is below not only the U.S., but Iceland, which one hardly thinks of as crime-ridden. Turning to burglaries, one finds that Jamaica ranks 40th, below such places as Canada and Norway. Turning to robberies, Jamaica comes in 20th, behind Australia and the U.S. As for rapes, Jamaica comes in 7th, behind Australia and Canada, and only two ordinal places higher than the U.S. In all of these respects, I submit that Jamaica is simply not particularly dangerous.

Finally, with respect to murders, Jamaica is third, with a rate more than six times that of the U.S., behind only truly dangerous Colombia and still-struggling-in-the-wake-of-apartheid South Africa. Now this is a disconcerting statistic, and it should not be discounted lightly. However (and unfortunately this brings us back to much less reliable anecdotal evidence), I remember reading the Kingston newspaper when I was in Jamaica last year, and noticing that during only five days there, seven murders were committed; but they were all in Kingston, separated from the main tourist areas by three hours by car and a mountain range. I am sure that most of these murders take place in the slums of that troubled city. The question is: how many? If anyone has the statistics, I'd love to hear about them.
mrwilson75 is offline  
Nov 20th, 2003, 11:30 AM
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I went to all of the threads you suggested and read the articles - even though I knew what I was going to find.

The vast majority of the crime in Jamaica is drug-related and occurs in Kingston. It is primarily due to police corruption and conditions in the poor and over-crowded neighborhoods of the inner cities there.

Jamaica is the 3rd largest island in the Caribbean, and has its problems - no one ever said it didn't, but very few tourists plan on walking the back streets on Kingston.

Travel to anywhere carries with it risks, but they can be minimized by educating oneself as opposed to being an alarmist...
Diana is offline  
Nov 20th, 2003, 12:46 PM
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Boyo, I wonder if you don't like Jamaica mainly because it isn't Saba? Have you ever been to Jamaica?

According to your source (Nationmaster), I am more likely to be raped in Canada or Australia and several other places than Jamaica, more likely to be assaulted in the US, Canada, Finland, Iceland, the UK and a bunch of other places than in Jamaica, more likely to be the victim of fraud in...well...32 countries than in Jamaica, and more likely to be robbed in the US, UK, Mexico, Costa Rica and many other countries than I am in Jamaica.

Thanks for the stats.
liza is offline  
Nov 20th, 2003, 01:02 PM
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Tired of relying on biased generalizations (both ways) and anecdotal evidence, regarding murders in Jamaica, I did a little quick research:

According to the Jamaica Observer, 1,045 persons were murdered in Jamaica in 2002 (7.6 per cent fewer than the 1,132 murders in 2001).

Of these 1,045 murders, 710 of the murders, or approximately 67 per cent, took place in the Kingston Metropolitan Area, which includes the parishes of Kingston and St Andrew and St Catherine -- a region that accounts for under 40 per cent of the country's 2.6 million people.

So... that means there were 335 murders in 2002 that occurred outside Kingston, among the 1.56 million people who live in Jamaica outside Kingston. That yields a per capita murder rate for non-Kingston Jamaica in 2002 of .21 per 1000. Comparing that rate to the rates listed on Nationmaster.com, that only moves Jamaica from third to fourth on the list, now behind Venezuela. Non-Kingston Jamaica still has a murder rate more than four times as high as the United States'. This is indeed surprising and troubling, and not what I would have guessed. Roughly similar numbers in other years suggest that 2002 was not an outlyer year statistically.

(Also note that I am comparing 2002 data for Jamaica to '98-'00 data for the other countries, but I see no reason that should make a significant difference.)

Those who would insist that Jamaica is not dangerous, in terms of murders, outside of Kingston: please provide me a reason this analysis is flawed. One reason it could be, for instance, would be if there is another high-crime area outside Kingston but also not near traditional tourist areas (MoBay, Negril, Ocho Rios) that I don't know about that, like Kingston, skews the numbers.

I really do hope that someone can provide such info - I have enjoyed Jamaica and I might well go back there in spite of this, but from these numbers it appears to me that this is a significant danger that must be factored in to any such decision.
mrwilson75 is offline  
Nov 20th, 2003, 06:13 PM
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To mrwilson: Tourism is Jamaica's bread and butter. If tourists are being murdered I think we would be hearing about it. And it would be front page news. Remember several yrs. ago how several German tourists were murdered in Fla? It was probably world wide news. The rate in Ja. may be high but who are the victims? My feeling is it is probably drug related. Jamaica just has to protect its assests and one big one is tourist income.
jacketwatch is online now  
Nov 21st, 2003, 05:21 AM
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Every time this debate reappears on Fodors (and it's been gone a while -- thanks to registration) the two camps hunker down and start citing statistics. Then someone mentions the travel writer who was killed 6 or 7 years ago as proof that tourists are the recipients of violence.
But, as jacketwatch points out, if there were tourists being murdered, it would be all over the media.
The truth, sad as it may be, is that the murders involve Jamaicans killing Jamaicans. Whether drug related, or politically motivated, or rogue cops -- the why is not material to this thread. The fact is, as Liza describes, you are statistically more at risk in first world countries.
I've been to Jamaica more than a dozen times and will be back again for 2 weeks in April. I've not feared for my well being any time I've been there. And, strange as it may be for many posters to believe, I've never had anyone try to sell me drugs. "Professional women" have never offered me their services. And every vendor and peddlar has left me alone once I've said, "No, thank you, your things here are very nice, but I'm really not interested. Thanks anyway."

zwho: Ocho Rios, Port Antonio, or Negril will be great places for your daughter and her friend. Negril is probably the best fit if some nightlife is desired, but as tivertonhouse says, the Treasure Coast is a great laid back destination if total relaxation is the target.

Kingston, however, is not a tourist destination. She would not find it a relaxing time as it is a city and does not enjoy many tourist facilities.
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