Psquare

I have read several reviews on both St Thomas-Ritz and St. John-Caneel Bay. Has anyone stayed at BOTH of these facilities that can offer a review or comparison for each. My wife and I will be celebrating our 20th anniversary and I want it to be the best possible for her. We currently have what I consider a good deal at the Ritz (7 nights, ocean view room, 2 meals pp/pd, Lady Linnsey, 2 massages, water crafts, etc…for $300/day), that they advertised on the net. After reading some of the comments about St Thomas, I’m second-guessing myself and I’m wandering if I should try to get something at Caneel Bay. I’m sure my wife would enjoy the accommodations at the Ritz, but the reviews I’m reading on the forum seem to indicate that the St Thomas beaches are not as nice as St Johns’, and that St Thomas is somewhat unsafe. <BR> <BR>We aren’t really into the nightlife scene other than enjoying a good meal and taking a stroll. <BR> <BR>Does anyone have any positive comments on an on-line travel agent they have used for Caneel Bay? Are the rates advertised on there web page ($400 ocean view) what I should expect to pay, or do you think I could get a discount going through a travel agent. <BR> <BR>PS: We will be going in late July. <BR>

Mike

Most people will disagree with me, of course, but Caneel Bay, although billing itself as "understated" is actually, in reality, a DUMP! On the other hand, the Ritz is pure elegance and luxury all the way! If you've ever been to ANY Ritz-Carlton then you'll know what I'm talking about! I personally do NOT like St. Thomas but the location of the Ritz is also superb and the beach in front of the hotel, while rather smallish, is actually very nice, indeed! I can't comment on any of the other beaches because I did not visit them as I just did not want to leave the property! If all you're interested in is "a good meal and taking a stroll," then this definitely is THE place for you!

Psquare

Thanks Mike, <BR> <BR>You sound very convincing about the Ritz, and I will probably keep our reservations at the Ritz. <BR> <BR>To visit the beaches at St Johns, I understand it’s a ferry ride over. My question is when you get to St Johns, what is the best method to visit the beaches there? Taxi? Bikes? Other?…. <BR> <BR>Also, what should we expect for taxi rates, tips, baggage handlers, concierge services, and the like. <BR>beaches, rental car? Taxi? Other?...

Mike

The only thing I can tell you at this point is BEWARE of the "taxis" on St. John! They are not "real" taxis at all, but rather more akin to a flatbed truck (and they MOVE like one, too!), open air (but covered) with long, wooden benches to sit on that I'm sure your wife would really appreciate! And DON'T expect to hail one very conveniently or quickly either! There are, however, REAL cabs (or vans) on St. Thomas, all nicely air-conditioned, of course!

Mike

Actually, after you take the ferry over from Red Hook (near the Ritz), I think you should just rent a car for the day and go explore the well-known beaches surrounding Caneel Bay (Trunk, Hawksnest, etc.). However, quite frankly, I did NOT like St. John that much either and felt that being at the Ritz was quite sufficient! And be advised -- and no one ever tells you this -- that many of the neighborhoods in the surrounding hills are slummy and scary! [Just a sidenote: Keep your eyes open for the new Ritz-Carlton on Grand Cayman in 2002 and a new Four Seasons on Great Exuma in the Bahamas around the same time -- or earlier!]

x

Mike, you seem to be a big advocate of large chain hotels. Why is that? Just wondering.

Nancy

I disagree with Mike's characterization of both St. Thomas and St. John and particularly of Caneel Bay Resort. It is certainly not a dump. <BR> <BR>I realize that different people prefer different vacation experiences, but to go to either St. Thomas or St. John and never venture off your hotel's property, particularly the Ritz's very small man-made beach, seems a waste. Both islands have so many wonderful beaches, restaurants, and sights to see. <BR> <BR>If Mike stayed put at the Ritz as he claims, I would hardly consider him an expert on either island. <BR> <BR>In addition, to discourage a traveler from visiting St. John because the taxis are open air trucks without air conditioning demonstrates his inflexibility as a traveler. Most people day trip to St. John to visit the beach and traveling on these vehicles is lots of fun and since you are in your swim suits, why would it matter. <BR> <BR>If the sole purpose of your vacation is to stay within the boundaries of your all inclusive resort, then it really doesn't matter where you stay so why not save the air fare and stay at a "pampering" resort state side. <BR> <BR>St. Thomas and St. John are beautiful mountainous islands with breath-taking views from almost every location. Your decision between the Ritz or Caneel Bay should probably be based more on the Island location and less on the Resort. Both of these resorts get rave reviews (regardless of Mike's opinion) but life on the two islands is very different. <BR> <BR>We are dedicated St. John fans, but stay in a private villa and except for daily beach runs, we hang at our villa's private pool. This is the life for us! St. Thomas's traffic, development, etc. has no appeal. <BR> <BR>However, there are others who would be bored on St. John and really enjoy St. Thomas' activity (shop to you drop). <BR> <BR>I think that both the Ritz and Caneel Bay are wonderful resorts. Caneel Bay's advantages would be its location on the noth shore of St. John with 7 fabulous beaches and the close proximity to many more. If you are a "beach" person and are looking for a prisitine island with less development, then St. John is your island and Caneel is sure to please. <BR> <BR>If you prefer more activities and services, the Ritz on St. Thomas can certainly provide this. However, even though the meal plan seems like a good deal, there are so many good restaruants on St. Thomas that it seems a shame to be so confined. I think that all inclusive resorts make sense in locations where there are not many services available or where venturing off the resort's property is not recommended for saftey reasons. Neither of these apply on either St. Thomas or St. John. <BR> <BR>If you decide on St. Thomas, do risk the un-air-conditioned taxis on St. John and day trip to one of the north shore beaches (Hawksnest is my favorite). But be careful, visitors who do this find themselves planning for their next vacation on St. John--it is addictive. <BR> <BR>Have a wonderful trip. <BR>

Mike

Note to "x" -- I am not necessarily an advocate of large, chain hotels as you state, but rather, am a fan of large, truly 5-star luxury hotels, whether as an independent or a "chain" as you call it! And I absolutely will NOT apologize for that! Why should I? If many people prefer less luxurious quarters, that's just fine -- to each his own! I feel that, at this point, the Ritz-Carlton is the ONLY 5-star luxury resort in the Virgin Islands! <BR> <BR>Note to Nancy: You actually sound like you're a paid spokesperson for the Virgin Islands Tourist Board, and I must say, you've done an excellent job! First of all, Nancy, don't you think it's rather strange that you NEVER see any photos of the actual units of Caneel, either in brochures or on the Web? And why is that? Well, I'll be more than happy to tell you -- because they look like old barns and are a total embarrassment to the vacationing public, that's why!! In a word -- a DUMP, in MY opinion!! (Are you listening very carefully, FROMMERS?!?) <BR> <BR>And DON'T disparage the Ritz's "very small man-made beach" as you call it. Did you see the one at the Westin? Now THAT is what "man-made" is all about and is absolutely DISGRACEFUL!! You certainly can't even tell that the beach at the Ritz is man-made, if it truly is at all (why should we believe YOU?)! But it really doesn't make any difference one way or the other: the sand is soft and white, the location is ideal, the water is clear, beautiful, warm and delightful, and the views across the bay looking directly at St. John are stunning!! What more could one possibly ask for?!? A flatbed truck posing as a "taxi"?!? <BR> <BR>And believe me, I AM an expert on the island! It didn't take that long!! I had one VERY LONG ride from the airport to the hotel, and from what I saw of the island, it doesn't take too long to become an expert and form a very strong opinion!! First impressions are usually quite accurate, don't you think? <BR> <BR>As for those delightful "taxis," again, to each his own, but to my mind, it definitely is NOT first class travel by any means! If you enjoy touring the island in such a primitive, chug-a-lug contraption, be my guest! Even a speedy golf cart would be preferable to that ancient mode of transportation! <BR> <BR>I am only forced to stay within the "boundaries" of my resort when there is absolutely ZERO reason to venture forth OUT of said resort!! There is absolutely NO REASON to tour St. Thomas! Ever been to Hawaii? Now THERE's a place that's difficult to stay put, I guarantee you!! Also, I don't choose to stay stateside because the white sand beaches and gorgeous Caribbean water are quite irresistable in SOME places (there, I said something positive!)!! <BR> <BR>I'm certainly happy for you that you're enjoying your wonderful private villa on St. John! Granted, it IS much less populated than St. Thomas, but in my opinion, just as unattractive as well! Breathtaking views from almost every location, you say? Hardly! But again, to each his/her own! <BR> <BR>Once again, I hope your employer at the Virgin Islands Tourist Board gives you a most deserving and generous raise!! <BR> <BR>Message to "Psquare": Kindly post a trip report upon your return in July, even if you DO happen to fall in love with St. John! Thanks! <BR>

Michelle

QUIT SQUABBLING! IT"S A VACATION! I have been to St. Thomas, St. John, and Virgin Gorda (Which I actually prefer the privacy and luxury "understated Elegance" of Little Dix Bay in Virgin Gorda (same owners of Caneel Bay) which was NOT A DIVE by any means. Note, one usually cannot compare a 5-Star Ritz to much else. But try not to consider just your hotel for any trip - anywhere. I would overwhelmingly opt for St. Johns or Virgin Gorda. I prefer safety and serenity to the over-populated and Touristy St. Thomas. Mike is right to pick St. Thomas, IF you only, and I mean only, stay at the Ritz. But You miss out on SOOOOOOO much by not trying St. John!!!!! Better snorkeling, water...

cheryl

Sounds like angry Mike NEEDS a vacation. I'm so relieved that it won't be on St. John!!! By the way, I have exchanged mail with Nancy and I'm QUITE sure she doesn't work for the Tourist Board -- she's just a well-informed traveler without an axe to grind. You go, girl! Your postings are quite helpful!

Barbara

Well, Mr. Rockefeller preferred St. John, and I do too. Has anyone thought to mention that it is a National Park and that preservation has served it well into the age of dvelopment? <BR> <BR>BG

Debra

Psquare- If you are going to the USVI for beautiful beaches and peace and quiet you will not be dissapointed in St John. Last June I stayed on St Thomas at the Marriott Frenchman's Reef and took the ferry over to St John. We rented a jeep and explored all day. It is breathtaking. Mike sounds like he is a little to high in the clouds to vacation with us common folks. How can he not like St John- it is one of the most well preserved islands in the carribean. Nothing fancy but beautiful. Check out Francis Bay while you are there. Wonderful snorkeling and a well kept secret from most tourists. Next time we will stay on St John in a private villa. I do agree that St Thomas did look alittle scary in some locations but if you take taxis and stay in well populated areas you will be fine. We played hard every day and at night we stay at our resort just because we were so tired from fun and sun. We were glad the Marriott had several restautants. You will love it whether you stay at the Ritz or at Caneel Bay. Either way don't stay at your resort or you may as well go to Florida and save your money. (Destin Fl beaches are prettier than the Carribean but the water is no match.)

Karen

Actually Mike sounds like an unhappy Ritz employee!!! LOL ... Maybe he gets a commission for each person he sends their way! LOL ... wonder why he did not take the Ritz's ever present recommendation to eat at Romano's ... just one of the good restaurants on St. Thomas? True, most places the Ritz is hard to beat ... didn't find that true in Hawaii tho nor in STT ... and wouldn't even consider it on PR because of the "beach" ... and I do enjoy the consierge floor when staying at one stateside ... that can't be beat! I think you will be happy at the Ritz ... especially the Friday nite Seafood Buffet ... but if you want to check out Caneel, go over on Sunday for brunch and take a swim on one of the seven lovely beaches (there is a very nice changing room behind the gift shoppe). Do not distain the "public ferry" ... $3 pp and 15 minutes and then take one of the open taxis or you can choose one of the closed ones and head to Caneel. You might want to check out Hawksnest or any of the other north shore beaches as well. Just enjoy! And let us know all the details ... good, bad and ugly (if there are any) when you get back!

Lucille

I just returned from Caneel Bay and although it is one of the most beautiful resorts with the most beautiful beaches, do not make the mistake we did!! CHILDREN are now encouraged at Caneel Bay and they are everywhere. (Even on the "Romantic Sunset Cruise"!) My idea of the dream vacation is not getting woken up every morning at 6:45am to someone's crying child. This is not an exageration! Everyone one we spoke with had the same complaints. <BR> <BR>In my opinion St. John is much more quiet and remote than St. Thomas and I would have rather stayed on St. John but would not pay the ridiculous rates at Caneel to put up with other people's children!

Scott

Lucille, <BR> <BR>May I ask what type of room you stayed in while there, since Caneel has promised me that there would be no young children in any of the premium rooms. They also said that the children would be limited to two beaches, so I'd be interested in hearing your opinion on that. Also, I'd be interested in knowing if you went during a time when many kids were on vacation from school. <BR> <BR>Thanks

Deborah

My recommendation is St. Croix. St. Thomas is too busy. St. John has beautiful beaches, but lots of mosquitos . We stayed in a villa overlooking the popular harbor and found it very noisey. Couldn't even take a walk at night because of the steep hills. Everyone is different, but St. John wasn't our bag, neither.

John

We are thinking of going to the US Virgin Islands in late August and were thinking of renting a villa for part of the time and go to a resort for part of the time. We have two daughters, 13 and 8, so we wanted a mixture of quiet familhy time and activities. I'm curious if anyh of the people posting on this board could recommend a resort on any of the three islands that would be good for kids and a villa? And what's all this about the MOSQUITOS? Are they that bad in the summer?

Deborah

We went in April and the mosquitos were really bad. Even on the beaches during the day. If you have kids, I wouldn't recommend any of the villas on the hills overlooking Cruz Bay. They have some beautiful resorts in St. John. It took all day to get to St. John and wouldn't rush back there. Cayman Islands are beautiful and they have 7 mile beach where any villa would be nice.

amber

In my opinion, St. Thomas is just nasty. Never been to St. John. You should look into Tortola, British Virgin Islands. You have to take a ferry from St. Thomas to get there but it is so much nicer than the US Virgin Islands. There is not much nightlife, it is very quiet, clean, & very laid back. Check into either Long Bay Beach Villas or Fort Recovery. I have been there 3x so far & am going back in June.

Robespierre

Just to throw my 2 cents in, I personally loved St. John and am coming back in a few months. I am also glad Angry Mike doesn't like it because that means he won't be there when I am. The last thing I need is to have people like him ruining everyone's good time.