I really don't think this forum is the place for the immigration debate - most NZders love NZ but it is a small country with few people and there is more money and a wide world to see out there.

And BTW it is not half a million out of 4 million. It is half a million out of about 5-6 million. Cos there is 4.1 million living in NZ and at least 500,000 in London where I am.

I love my country but I do not live there. One day I will be back for good (after seeing the world, with pounds stuffed in my back pocket itching to breathe clean air again and eat fresh food).

So stop kiwi bashing. (BTW I get this every day at work from Australians so I am a tad sensitive - who are also NOT living in their country).

wilees, I agree that you're being a tad sensitive. Where exactly is this "Kiwi-bashing" happening? Some honest opinions, pro and con, have been aired about the merits or otherwise of both countries, and have stimulated some debate. Nobody, as far as I can see, has verbally assaulted anybody. Nearly all the shots I've heard exchanged between Australians and Kiwis have been good-humoured - although I have to say that we eventually got a bit tired of it while we were in NZ, so I suppose it's understandable that Kiwis do too. Just acknowledge, though, that it's a two-way traffic, and there's nothing to stop you lot deploying poddy calf jokes in retaliation for our sheep jokes. In fact I can donate my favourite boundary-rider joke to you as a kind of starter kit if you like.

500,000 Kiwis in London? Where did that figure come from? It seems remarkable that there should be twice as many New Zealanders as Australians pulling beer in the Old Dart. Good Lord, this has the potential to affect the vowel movements of all south-east England!

AND the bowel movement I would think! I would sure give me the sh...

wilees, i think you are a little sensitive. I don't think that this was an immigration debate and I know I made my comments tongue in cheek in response to the post that noone has ever said they wanted to go back to australia. it certainly wasn't kiwi bashing and I don't think the other posts on the forum were either!

as for your kiwi bashing workmates, if you can give as good as you get you'll do fine. surely kiwis should understand by that it's the aussie way of showing affection.

Loved Rome
Loved Macchu Pichu
Loved the galapagos ( on boat)
Loved Sicily
Loved bicycling across France and UK
Loved Mexico
Loved Japan
Loved Vancouver Montraeal and Victoria
Loved Thailand
Loved SF Santa Fe Los Angeles, Chicao NYC and Santa Barbara
Loved India
Loved North Africa
Loved Turkey
Loved Egypt
Loved Australia (don't miss Stuart's Well w/Dinky the world famous singing and piano playing dingo)

AndrewDavid

Wow, AD - only "Africa", China, Russia, South America, Pakistan, Bangla Desh, most of SE Asia, most of Europe to go.

Oh, and Antartica, too ..

Big place, eh, the planet?

Fuzzy, have you been to Antarctica you lucky devil - please give us a report. I am sooooo envious.

sorry fuzzylogic to have been so brief:

also loved: Spain, Greece, Nederlands, Belgium, Hungary, Estonia, Finland, Norway , Sweden, Denmark.Germany, Austria, Andorra, Luxembourg, Ecuador, Colombia, Nepal, Pakistan, and Hong Kong:

this boy lives to travel

But my trip down under was one of the best, especially since I got to meet john_j, margo oz, alan and Pat and Mike ( looking forward to meeting Neil Cammack when he crosses the Strait of Juan de Fuca next month. I hope to be back in Oz in the next few years

Travel : its a great way to see the world, meet interesting folks and eat bugs and crickets, snakes, grubs, etc

cheers

AndrewDavid

LizF - Antartica - no!! - never been - one day maybe but not on the top of my list.

That I think would be Russia - one day I will take the trans-Siberian and travel across miles of empty space; and stop here and there and visit Moscow and see the Bolshoi; and St Petersburg and see the Kirov. Then I think a train to Warsaw. And on through Europe.

Next all those small countries that were once part of the USSR. And then Colombia and Bolivia.

And then there's Iceland, and Chad, and Taiwan, and Canada, and Vanuatu.

And all those places I've been that I'd like to see again - I guess you have some of those too.

It's a big place this planet of ours.

Sorry Fuzzy, I thought that when you mentioned Antarctica you had been there - got it mixed up.
Bye the way St Petersburg is magnificent and needs a good week to 10 days there. Cathrine's Palace just outside Petro ( as the Russians call St Petersburg ) is probably the place most likely to "Blow you away " - I am talking particularly though about the Amber room which was opened again after the WW2 just 2 days before I saw it about three years ago I think. I too was thinking of a trip across Siberia to return. I would place Russia up the top of my want to do again lists but want to do again at leisure with no rushing.

Antarctica used to be close to the top of our list but after Galapagos (because we used Lindblad and they do Antarctica too) we started wondering if the hefty price tag was worth it to see snow, ice and more snow. Could stay home in January and look out the window, I'd have to get some of those inflatable penguins to complete the scene though!

Why is it that if you have all the time in the world to travel you don't have enough cash and if you have the cash you don't have the time??

It's just wrong!

Travellin: that just Murphy's law hitting us between the eyes yet again.
I live about 5 minutes from the Artarctic Research Base so if you need some blow up penguins let me know and I will check it out for you.

"..no one has ever said they wanted to return to Australia."

Funny, considering that every 2nd pommy you meet came here for a holiday and never left!

Perhaps it was you who said it, and not "no-one".

Is OK AussiegalovesUSA its a sandwich short of a picnic situation with that writer - we think she lives in Long Beach Ca and therefore would get too much of the effluent even accounting for the trade winds.

Liz, it looks like one of your posts got zapped by the editors. Whay hypersensitive souls they must think us, delicate flowers who'll swoon at the merest hint of a robust discussion.

Garcon, the smelling salts, s'il vouz plait, followed quickly by a carafe of your best vin tres ordinaire!

Um - I think I'll have to sit down to a nice dish of boiled crow, washed down with that carafe of Chateau Rough Red - I maligned the editors. I just found the post I was thinking of in another thread, where I see the "robust discussion" is still taking place.

Yes Neil, the particular PIA pops up out of the blue at any opportunity and starts her favourite rant. I am still trying to work out the reason for it particularly as it does nothing to advance Australian/American relations nor give accurate travel information. I guess though that people cannot look after the underpriveliged all day and every day and control their moves all the time.