Continuing to follow your great report, Yes. How are you finding the wine prices in Australia? We four who are off to NZ/OZ on Friday were having dinner out in DC last night and speculating about upcoming wines and prices..... Where are you off to next from Melbourne?

Glover- In general everything is expensive, but the US$ strength helps a lot. Australian wine prices seem higher than comparable US and European wine, I'm sure there are reasonably priced Australian wines, but we haven't found them. You will be the 3rd couple we know in NZ right now. The pictures are from there are gorgeous. Have a great trip!

On the bagels, just call them something else. I will say they are normal sized and not the gigantic ones we seem to have these days.

Yes travel - have a chat to the staff at Dan Murphy's. they are a large liquor retail group with lots of branches in every state. I've found the chaps in my local branches to be very helpful.


You could also have a look st their online catalogue to get an idea of their offerings & prices.

There are, of course, specialist wine shops, but are a little more difficult to find when you're breezing through & browsing. I'll ask my friends in the Gold Coast for a recommendation there for you. I think you're House-sitting there?

Glover - keep in mind that the advertised prices in Austrslia & New Zealand are the final prices. Tax is included. And you don't need to tip anyone at all.

Bokhara-will keep an eye out. Don't believe I have noticed any so far. We have enjoyed a Penfold Port that was only ~$14.

dan murphy gold coast

<i> and was thoroughly chewed out by an Aussie Fodorite who told me I should try new things</i>

Mel, I love our Aussie Fodorites but poking a hole in the standard generic bread roll doesn't make it a bagel any more than it makes it a doughnut or a hula hoop. Sounds like you were up for a "new" thing but instead got the same old thing.

I quite like bagels, but have had more indifferent than good ones here. Exception is a cafe in the Eastern suburbs, that has a large Jewish clientele. Their bagels are scrumptious.

CC

I don't know what the heck that emoticon is, meant it to be a smiley for Clifton.

Sorry to hear that about the wine prices, Yes.

Bokhara 2, are you saying that tipping is not a common practice in Aust and NZ in restaurants? or are you just talking about wine stewards, etc......?

You do not need to tip anyone, anywhere, for anything, in Australia or New Zealand.

Some of us tip a small amount occasionally for exceptional service, or round up to the next $ in a cab if paying cash - but it is the exception rather than the more-or-less compulsory 25%+ rule in the US.

Bottom line: The bottom line is the bottom line - even if the restaurant's software produces a "tip" line in the bill/ on the screen, there is absolutely no compulsion or obligation to tip.

We pay proper wages, which is reflected in the prices.

Trying a new thing is quite different from accepting a poor imitation of the original.

I had smoked salmon on a bagel yesterday & ended up just eating the salmon - the bagel was more like brioche

<i>I don't know what the heck that emoticon is</i>

I think it means I'm a space cadet. Probably something to that...


<i>the bagel was more like brioche</i>

Sounds like they really stuffed that up! If it hasn't been formed, then boiled before baking, it might be nice (or not), but it's not a bagel. A bagel always gives a good "thunk" if you rap it on the table. It's never meant to be particularly soft. (I had impromptu bagel making lessons from a customer in St. Louis whose Jewish family had been making them for many years. Or did until Quaker Oats bought them and a number of other US bagelries out.)

It was awful, CC.

Bagelries?

I figured you were speaking urban 'stralian again Clifton, but I googled and discovered we have a "bagelry" right here in Colorful Colorado. Who knew?

Mel, yes actually I've yet to hear that word here in Melbourne. Fish and chippery, yes. Bagelry, no. But I'd heard it every now and then in the States. St. Louis has a pretty good size Jewish population and it seemed like a reasonable term for a place that didn't bake anything else (as most bagel places don't, requiring a different set of equipment).

I have a British friend who absolutely despises the word cidery.

He'll throw a shoe when I casually work "bagelry" into our next convo.

LOL. Tell him you'll take him to an ice creamery when he calms down.

I hate to interrupt this fascinating bagel discussion, but our trip continues...

The Great Grampians

We skipped breakfast at Daisy's and instead stopped in town at Rebecca's. Guess what I had??? Yup, a couple of yoyos and coffee. Gottravel went out to take more photos of the adorable Main Street with architecture reminiscent of 1950's small town America. Then we took off.

The approximately 2 hour drive took us through a flat, dry landscape. It was really the first uninteresting drive of this trip. The aptly named Mt. Abrupt was the first Mountain of the Grampians that we encountered. We continued the drive into Halls Gap where we were to stay for the next 2 nights.

Our wonderful accommodations at DULC Holiday Cabins more than made up for the doleful room at Daisy's. We had a stunning, nicely furnished, 2 story cabin with windows everywhere. The bathroom ceiling was even all glass. At night we could lie in bed and look out at the million stars above. It was fabulous.

For sunset we took a drive up the mountain to Reid lookout and balconies. A stray and apparently tame fox entertained us in the parking lot while we awaited the sunset.

After sunset we returned to the town where we encountered no less than 7 kangaroos doing yard maintenance. We watched for awhile and of course took pictures. Eventually we went into Harvest and bought a bottle of white wine and headed back to our wondrous cabin to watch the stars. I might mention we had the best weather of the trip, warm, sunny and clear skies.

After coffee and muffins at Harvest the next morning we took off to the Brambuk Cultural Center. It is housed in an unusual, award winning structure which represents a cockatoo with its outstretched wings in flight. ( You probably need to see it to get it!). There was no admission, but donations were greatly appreciated. It focused on the history and culture of the indigenous Koori people. It had displays of tools, artwork etc. We highly recommend a visit here when in the Grampians.

It was a perfect day and we headed up again into the rocky Grampians planning to hike to Grand Canyon and onto the Pinnacles Summitt. The Grand Canyon was a small rocky canyon with many interesting formations. As we proceeded towards the Pinnacle, the trail over the rocks became a series of rock steps and then ladders. My knees were still suffering from the steps at Freycinet so we decided to abort the remainder of the hike and try and save my knees.

We continued in the car to the stunning Boroka lookout and also returned to Reid's lookout and the balconies. From there we went back to our fabulous cabin. We liked DULC so much we had a difficult time leaving!

That evening hunger drove us into town and we had dinner at Harvest. You may have noticed a pattern, the only place we ate was at Harvest which had good food and superlative staff.

That night we stayed in the cabin watched a movie and the stars. Had we known how nice the Grampians and our cabin were we would have definitely stayed longer and perhaps risked my knees hiking the sandstone landscape.

Thank you for your excellent report on the Grampians. I must admit, I did not think much about this part of Victoria until I read your report on it this morning. I just did a quick online search and the scenery reminds me very much of the Blue Mountains. I cannot remember if you were headed there when you're in Sydney, yestravel and gottravel, but if so, I would be interested in your comparison.