Still Thinking About Japan: Proposed Itinerary
Nov 29th, 2012, 08:01 AM
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Still Thinking About Japan: Proposed Itinerary
I have decided to run with KimJapan's itinerary advice (and HT's enthusiastic endorsement) and have come up with the following, based on the amount of time we have:
Depart USA, Tuesday, October 22nd
Arrive NRT, Wednesday afternoon
3 nights Tokyo (2 full days)
Fly to Komatsu
1 night Yamashiro
3 nights Kanasawa (2 full days)
1 night Shirakawa
5 nights Kyoto (4 full days)
Depart ITM(?) to NRT to USA, Wednesday, November 6
Alternatively, we could do this itinerary in reverse order as mrw suggested. However, I think I'd like to do Tokyo first and have several nights in one place at the end. I assume that Osaka is easily reached from Kyoto and that if we want to visit, we won't have to overnight there? Also, looking for 2 days of Tokyo must-sees for a first-timer. I think we would be disappointed if we did not spend at least some time in Tokyo. It appears that ANA does not release its domestic flights until 6 months prior to departure. So while I am going to book our inbound NRT-IAD-BDL flight next week, I'll have to wait to work out the connection to Osaka (or Kansai?). Hopefully, I am on the right track here - please let me know...
Depart USA, Tuesday, October 22nd
Arrive NRT, Wednesday afternoon
3 nights Tokyo (2 full days)
Fly to Komatsu
1 night Yamashiro
3 nights Kanasawa (2 full days)
1 night Shirakawa
5 nights Kyoto (4 full days)
Depart ITM(?) to NRT to USA, Wednesday, November 6
Alternatively, we could do this itinerary in reverse order as mrw suggested. However, I think I'd like to do Tokyo first and have several nights in one place at the end. I assume that Osaka is easily reached from Kyoto and that if we want to visit, we won't have to overnight there? Also, looking for 2 days of Tokyo must-sees for a first-timer. I think we would be disappointed if we did not spend at least some time in Tokyo. It appears that ANA does not release its domestic flights until 6 months prior to departure. So while I am going to book our inbound NRT-IAD-BDL flight next week, I'll have to wait to work out the connection to Osaka (or Kansai?). Hopefully, I am on the right track here - please let me know...
Nov 29th, 2012, 09:52 AM
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Hi Craig, travelling between Kyoto and Osaka is very easy. There are express as well as local trains running between the two cities, and service is very frequent. And there's a direct train from Kyoto to Kansai Airport, which we used during our trip. Don't recall if there are direct connections between Kyoto and Itami though.
Nov 29th, 2012, 02:08 PM
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Craig,
Osaka is short 30 minute train ride from Kyoto depending on what type of train you take. The shinkansen is only 14 minutes IIRC but you need to transfer into the main JR Osaka station via another train taking only minutes. Sounds more confusing than it really is. Train travel in Japan is very structured and seamless really. Learn how to use this site to plan your trips and to get an idea of travel times between the places you will be traveling to.
http://www.hyperdia.com/
on the search details you would normally uncheck the airport and airport bus options and the Nozomi option because you cannot take the nozomi shinkansen on a JR Pass. If you want to catch a plane then the airport option will show you times from and to your destination.
Places to see in Tokyo are endless and sometimes is tied into where you are staying. A good place to start would be in the Asakusa area to see the Sensoji Temple and the Nakamise Dori that leads up to the temple. Dori means street in Japanese. Nakamise is a very crowded bazaar street that leads up to Sensoji but the stores there are very good and not only have the tourist junk but some very good souvenir shops along with our favorite second hand kimono shop "Fuji" along the dori. Being a larger size I also buy the larger yukatas here. I think Don has bought one here too, the one he wore one year at the Boston GTG. Anyway here are the details:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3004.html
If you are already in this area you might as well visit the newest Tokyo attraction the Tokyo Sky Tree. I have only seen this being built and haven't been yet but its supposed to be a good venue:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3064.html
One stop before Asakusa would put you at the Ueno Park area where you can take in the National Museum if you like and the adjacent Ameyoko street market which is the closest you will get to a Bangkok style street market sans the dirt and heat.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3019.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3012.html
Also on that side of town is Rikugien Garden....one of our favorite in Tokyo city, the other being Shinjuku Gyoen
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3026.html
Speaking of Shinjuku there is the park but you could spend the whole day there(just in the station if you get lost in it lol) exploring all the shopping venues and eating venues. Its here in the Shinjuku(western Tokyo) hotels like the Hyatt, Keio Plaza, Park Hyatt, Hilton, Washington, etc. that you can get a view of Mt. Fuji from your hotel window especially in the fall and winter months.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3034_001.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3011.html
and being on the Shinjuku side of town there is also the infamous Shibuya with its famous crossing streets and shops galore and Meiji Shrine close by.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3011.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3002.html
and if you happen to be in Tokyo on the weekend don't miss nearby Harajuku and its cos players
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3002.html
I could go on and on but will let others tell you of their Tokyo favorites. I would pick a max of three venues a day in Tokyo so to enjoy the site before moving on.
Ohhh, for your domestic air travel. If you fly in via UA Star Alliance, there are special local airfares that you can get explained here:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2364.html
I usually have a JTB travel agent make my domestic air reservations. They are in the larger cities across the US.
http://online.jtbusa.com/
this is another site where you can check hotel, train and package deals.
http://www.japanican.com/index.aspx
Got to get back to work.....
Aloha!
Osaka is short 30 minute train ride from Kyoto depending on what type of train you take. The shinkansen is only 14 minutes IIRC but you need to transfer into the main JR Osaka station via another train taking only minutes. Sounds more confusing than it really is. Train travel in Japan is very structured and seamless really. Learn how to use this site to plan your trips and to get an idea of travel times between the places you will be traveling to.
http://www.hyperdia.com/
on the search details you would normally uncheck the airport and airport bus options and the Nozomi option because you cannot take the nozomi shinkansen on a JR Pass. If you want to catch a plane then the airport option will show you times from and to your destination.
Places to see in Tokyo are endless and sometimes is tied into where you are staying. A good place to start would be in the Asakusa area to see the Sensoji Temple and the Nakamise Dori that leads up to the temple. Dori means street in Japanese. Nakamise is a very crowded bazaar street that leads up to Sensoji but the stores there are very good and not only have the tourist junk but some very good souvenir shops along with our favorite second hand kimono shop "Fuji" along the dori. Being a larger size I also buy the larger yukatas here. I think Don has bought one here too, the one he wore one year at the Boston GTG. Anyway here are the details:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3004.html
If you are already in this area you might as well visit the newest Tokyo attraction the Tokyo Sky Tree. I have only seen this being built and haven't been yet but its supposed to be a good venue:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3064.html
One stop before Asakusa would put you at the Ueno Park area where you can take in the National Museum if you like and the adjacent Ameyoko street market which is the closest you will get to a Bangkok style street market sans the dirt and heat.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3019.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3012.html
Also on that side of town is Rikugien Garden....one of our favorite in Tokyo city, the other being Shinjuku Gyoen
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3026.html
Speaking of Shinjuku there is the park but you could spend the whole day there(just in the station if you get lost in it lol) exploring all the shopping venues and eating venues. Its here in the Shinjuku(western Tokyo) hotels like the Hyatt, Keio Plaza, Park Hyatt, Hilton, Washington, etc. that you can get a view of Mt. Fuji from your hotel window especially in the fall and winter months.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3034_001.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3011.html
and being on the Shinjuku side of town there is also the infamous Shibuya with its famous crossing streets and shops galore and Meiji Shrine close by.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3011.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3002.html
and if you happen to be in Tokyo on the weekend don't miss nearby Harajuku and its cos players
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3002.html
I could go on and on but will let others tell you of their Tokyo favorites. I would pick a max of three venues a day in Tokyo so to enjoy the site before moving on.
Ohhh, for your domestic air travel. If you fly in via UA Star Alliance, there are special local airfares that you can get explained here:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2364.html
I usually have a JTB travel agent make my domestic air reservations. They are in the larger cities across the US.
http://online.jtbusa.com/
this is another site where you can check hotel, train and package deals.
http://www.japanican.com/index.aspx
Got to get back to work.....
Aloha!
Nov 29th, 2012, 02:37 PM
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Practical issues w/flights:
If you're hoping to take the ANA flight to Dulles from Narita, you would need to catch an 8:00am flight from Itami. Do the math, and you'll see that's a really, really early morning for you: the first bus to Itami leaves at 5:50 from Kyoto station and arrives at ITM at 6:40.
Alternatively, the Air Canada flight leaves much later in the day, and you could catch a 3pm flight out of ITM and make the connection (ITM-NRT-YYZ-BDL).
It certainly sucks to have to make these types of choices 10 months or so before the actual trip (which means 8 or 9 months before you really finalize plans of what to do), but them's the reality of using miles.
BTW, were you able to score your AC flights online w/United? (I just got a United CC and likely want to use the 60k miles for a BOS-YYZ-NRT flight.)
If you're hoping to take the ANA flight to Dulles from Narita, you would need to catch an 8:00am flight from Itami. Do the math, and you'll see that's a really, really early morning for you: the first bus to Itami leaves at 5:50 from Kyoto station and arrives at ITM at 6:40.
Alternatively, the Air Canada flight leaves much later in the day, and you could catch a 3pm flight out of ITM and make the connection (ITM-NRT-YYZ-BDL).
It certainly sucks to have to make these types of choices 10 months or so before the actual trip (which means 8 or 9 months before you really finalize plans of what to do), but them's the reality of using miles.
BTW, were you able to score your AC flights online w/United? (I just got a United CC and likely want to use the 60k miles for a BOS-YYZ-NRT flight.)
Nov 29th, 2012, 02:53 PM
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HT - thanks for the links - much more research to do.
Don, I do not believe there is a good connection to Hartford on the later Air Canada flight. I am obviously going to have to figure it all out, but thanks for your sympathy. Maybe I will have to flip the itinerary after all. I did score the AC outbound flight online with United - easy, lots of availability.
Don, I do not believe there is a good connection to Hartford on the later Air Canada flight. I am obviously going to have to figure it all out, but thanks for your sympathy. Maybe I will have to flip the itinerary after all. I did score the AC outbound flight online with United - easy, lots of availability.
Nov 30th, 2012, 11:52 AM
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Okay, I've checked all of the flight possibilities. There is a connection to Hartford from NRT on the later AC flight but availability in biz is like zero for most dates. So, I am not anticipating that this is an option. Don, or anyone else - we are used to just taking a taxi to the airport in Asia. Maybe that's not the best way in Japan. If we do decide to get an early (8 AM) departure from ITM and connect through NRT, what is the best way to get to the airport by 6 AM (with all of our stuff) from Kyoto?
And, - how do the baggage transfer services work? We (or at least, Jeane) tend to travel heavy - I looked at one of the sites and couldn't really figure out the logistics. Can you expound on how we might deal with trains and baggage transfers with the itinerary above?
Thanks.
And, - how do the baggage transfer services work? We (or at least, Jeane) tend to travel heavy - I looked at one of the sites and couldn't really figure out the logistics. Can you expound on how we might deal with trains and baggage transfers with the itinerary above?
Thanks.
Nov 30th, 2012, 12:56 PM
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If you are leaving from Itami at 8:00, I highly recommend spending your last night at the Toyoko Inn Itami. It is literally across the street from Itami and they have a free shuttle bus. You could leave as late as 6:45 AM from the hotel for an 8:00 AM flight. You can get to the Toyoko Inn the train from Osaka (so perhaps you can train it from Kyoto as well). It won't be very atmospheric but you will get some much needed rest before schlepping from the ITM-NRT-IAD-BDL. I have done KIX-NRT-IAD-BOS and know it is no joke.
As for the luggage delivery services, your hotel in Kyoto can figure it out for you. All I know is that in Tokyo, for Yamato Transport (Ta-Q-Bin) our bags needed to be given to them by 3 PM on Tuesday for a 6 PM Thurday flight out of Narita. I did some research and found out that JAL and ANA have services if you are flying on either of those airlines (but not on partners). So I did not look into it further.
As for the luggage delivery services, your hotel in Kyoto can figure it out for you. All I know is that in Tokyo, for Yamato Transport (Ta-Q-Bin) our bags needed to be given to them by 3 PM on Tuesday for a 6 PM Thurday flight out of Narita. I did some research and found out that JAL and ANA have services if you are flying on either of those airlines (but not on partners). So I did not look into it further.
Nov 30th, 2012, 01:42 PM
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You won't find bus class availability on the 5:45pm flight from Toronto to Bradley coz it's an economy-only plane. (Actually, it looks like the plane from BDL to YYZ is econ-only, as well.)
As u-n-i-t suggests, taking a taxi to the airport is often prohibitively expensive in Japan. From Kyoto to either KIX or ITM, it would be at least $150. (It wouldn't be nearly that expensive from central Osaka to Itami.) From Kyoto, most people would take the airport limo to Itami, or the train or airport limo to KIX. For an 8am flight, u-n-i-t's suggestion is a realistic alternative to a taxi from a Kyoto hotel.
In terms of timing for the airport, if you have an 8am domestic flight, especially in business class and even though connecting to an international flight, getting to the airport by 7am is *plenty* of time. Seriously.
As for luggage transfers, your hotels can take care of everything when going between cities. Ask the hotel when you would need to have your suitcase(s) ready for next-day delivery to your next hotel, and leave them at the front desk. Be sure to have the full address of the hotel you're headed to -- if possible, in Japanese. This will probably not work for your final day, as I doubt you could guarantee that your bags would be at the airport for an early-morning check-in.
As u-n-i-t suggests, taking a taxi to the airport is often prohibitively expensive in Japan. From Kyoto to either KIX or ITM, it would be at least $150. (It wouldn't be nearly that expensive from central Osaka to Itami.) From Kyoto, most people would take the airport limo to Itami, or the train or airport limo to KIX. For an 8am flight, u-n-i-t's suggestion is a realistic alternative to a taxi from a Kyoto hotel.
In terms of timing for the airport, if you have an 8am domestic flight, especially in business class and even though connecting to an international flight, getting to the airport by 7am is *plenty* of time. Seriously.
As for luggage transfers, your hotels can take care of everything when going between cities. Ask the hotel when you would need to have your suitcase(s) ready for next-day delivery to your next hotel, and leave them at the front desk. Be sure to have the full address of the hotel you're headed to -- if possible, in Japanese. This will probably not work for your final day, as I doubt you could guarantee that your bags would be at the airport for an early-morning check-in.
Nov 30th, 2012, 02:09 PM
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Takuhaibin or luggage delivery services are explained in detail here:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2278.html
basically you send your bags the morning before except when sending to the airport in which case its two days before. As Don mentions all can be done by your hotel bell desk or ryokan front desk. They will fill out forms for you. You just have to get it to them in time(usually before 9:00am). And yes, have the address and phone number of the place you are sending luggage to so that if they cannot translate your English written address into Japanese they will call your forwarding place to get the address in Japanese. Sounds complicated but all very simple....really. Takes me about 5 to 10 minutes everytime we do this and we do it often while traveling in Japan.
Osaka or Kyoto airports are unlike NRT in Tokyo because taking a taxi service like MK Taxi is not as prohibitive as the taxi's from NRT. This is how I am thinking the Kimball's should be introduced to Japan via taxi and not the train or bus.
http://www.mk-group.co.jp/english/
beware of the airport business hotels as they are a good option if time is a factor but be ready for very small basic but clean rooms. Most still have the washlet toilets
Aloha!
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2278.html
basically you send your bags the morning before except when sending to the airport in which case its two days before. As Don mentions all can be done by your hotel bell desk or ryokan front desk. They will fill out forms for you. You just have to get it to them in time(usually before 9:00am). And yes, have the address and phone number of the place you are sending luggage to so that if they cannot translate your English written address into Japanese they will call your forwarding place to get the address in Japanese. Sounds complicated but all very simple....really. Takes me about 5 to 10 minutes everytime we do this and we do it often while traveling in Japan.
Osaka or Kyoto airports are unlike NRT in Tokyo because taking a taxi service like MK Taxi is not as prohibitive as the taxi's from NRT. This is how I am thinking the Kimball's should be introduced to Japan via taxi and not the train or bus.
http://www.mk-group.co.jp/english/
beware of the airport business hotels as they are a good option if time is a factor but be ready for very small basic but clean rooms. Most still have the washlet toilets
Aloha!
Nov 30th, 2012, 02:11 PM
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Don, I am aware that both YYZ-BDL and BDL-YYZ are econ-only for the connecting flights. Doesn't really matter - they are short. This is occurring more and more with these feeder flights, although I think we will be able to book our flight from IAD in business. Note that you can book a "mixed" itinerary with saver awards on the United website but even with that the AC outbound doesn't show much availability. Will book it if I can. Happy to know we can leave for the airport to arrive at 7 - I can certainly live with that.
So maybe we spend the last day in Kyoto, take the limo to the airport and the shuttle bus to the hotel along with all of our stuff? My queries for luggage were more for in between the other locations and if our hotels can arrange it as you say, everything will work out fine.
So maybe we spend the last day in Kyoto, take the limo to the airport and the shuttle bus to the hotel along with all of our stuff? My queries for luggage were more for in between the other locations and if our hotels can arrange it as you say, everything will work out fine.
Nov 30th, 2012, 02:27 PM
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ohhh....didn't see the part about expounding
morning your leaving Tokyo send your extra luggage to your hotel in Kanazawa taking only a carry on or two(22" rollies) on the train. The ryokan will supply your yukatas for day and sleeping and all toiletries needed(though we always take our own). That way you will only have one small bag each when hopping on and off the trains making life so much easier.
Last morning send your bags from Kanazawa to your Kyoto hotel. Travel lightly through S-Go. If you choose to stay in a gassho zukuri just take what you'll need for the night. Did anyone ever mention to you that most hotels in Japan will supply you with sleep ware(yukata) and toiletries(shaver, tooth brushes with toothpaste, combs, etc.)? I never fit in the yukatas being a larger size but Linda always does so she never has to take sleep ware to Japan(is this too much info).
Take your own luggage to the airport. I don't like having to claim my luggage at the takuhaibin when I get to the airport. To me its just one more thing to do. Hope I made some sense.
Aloha!
morning your leaving Tokyo send your extra luggage to your hotel in Kanazawa taking only a carry on or two(22" rollies) on the train. The ryokan will supply your yukatas for day and sleeping and all toiletries needed(though we always take our own). That way you will only have one small bag each when hopping on and off the trains making life so much easier.
Last morning send your bags from Kanazawa to your Kyoto hotel. Travel lightly through S-Go. If you choose to stay in a gassho zukuri just take what you'll need for the night. Did anyone ever mention to you that most hotels in Japan will supply you with sleep ware(yukata) and toiletries(shaver, tooth brushes with toothpaste, combs, etc.)? I never fit in the yukatas being a larger size but Linda always does so she never has to take sleep ware to Japan(is this too much info).
Take your own luggage to the airport. I don't like having to claim my luggage at the takuhaibin when I get to the airport. To me its just one more thing to do. Hope I made some sense.
Aloha!
Nov 30th, 2012, 02:32 PM
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Yes we have booked MK online for a pick up and also called them from our Kyoto hotel to arrange a trip to the airport. I have never done a round trip because we were either just flying into and once just out of KIX. This trip we may do a r/t transfer.
Aloha!
Aloha!
Dec 3rd, 2012, 10:37 PM
#17
Here are some travel times by train:
Tokyo - Kyoto: 2 hr 40 min
Kyoto - Kanazawa: 2 hr 10 min
Kanazawa - Tokyo: 4 hr 4 min, change in Echigoyuzawa
Not recommending this for a flight on the same day, but:
Kyoto to Narita Airport: 3 hr 32 min, change at Shinagawa
Tokyo - Kyoto: 2 hr 40 min
Kyoto - Kanazawa: 2 hr 10 min
Kanazawa - Tokyo: 4 hr 4 min, change in Echigoyuzawa
Not recommending this for a flight on the same day, but:
Kyoto to Narita Airport: 3 hr 32 min, change at Shinagawa
Dec 6th, 2012, 08:00 AM
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I am happy to say that I scored a Mileage Plus Saver award today for the Osaka (ITM)-NRT-IAD-BDL return flights in business class. With my flights set, I can now start working on the details...
