I'm with kja - stay overnight in Miyajima!

It has been a while since I posted but after doing more research as you all suggested and after spending the afternoon going over 10 itineraries with my next door neighbor, who is from Japan, here is the final itinerary.

Now we are down to fine tuning for hotels, Ryokan, restaurants, train pass planning (i.e. one 21 day JR or combination). So I am now again at the "critique my trip" stage and nailing down places to stay etc. We tried to do the Hyatt free night at the Park Hyatt in Tokyo but those rooms were gone so we are taking free nights in Kyoto. For now we have a placeholder reservation at the Westin in Tokyo and the Hyatt for our first 3 days in Kyoto but not for our 2nd 4 days after the trip to Hiroshima. Budget wise I am ready to "spend" for the one or two nights in a good Ryokan and would like a balance of rooms b/w $150 and $350 depending on the town, competition and needs. Having been married for 33 years I do know that my Wife's last nights of any long trip should be in comfort so the final 4 nights in Kyoto should be nice. If the Kyoto Hyatt is nice I could move them to my final nights and work on getting the next 2 free nights. I am also trying to keep the one nights stands to a minimum and this plan only has 3 or maybe for 1 nighters out of 17 nights. Thanks in advance.
As you can see, I have also tried to balance my wife's desire for Gardens with other items. So here is the plan:


October 23, 2014
Arrive TOKYO 4:15pm - Westin Tokyo

Friday, October 24, 2014
TOKYO - Hato Bus Tours 1/2 day. Then Rikugien Garden
Westin Tokyo,

Saturday, October 25, 2014
TOKYO - day trip to Nikko
Westin Tokyo

Sunday, October 26, 2014
TOKYO - Do the classis Hakone "round course".
Maybe add an extra night and stay in a Ryokan so Hakone Round course is less rushed? ? - Tokyo or Hakone?

Monday, October 27, 2014
Bullet train to NAGOYA, find hotel and check bag.
Then take train to Ise + also see Hikone Castle and Genkyuen Garden in Hikone

Tuesday, October 28, 2014
Leave Nagoya early towards MATSUMOTO. Get off at Magome and hike to Tsumago, about 4 hours or so.
Then on towards Matsumoto

Wednesday, October 29, 2014
MATSUMOTO - Matsumoto castle

Thursday, October 30, 2014
Go to TAKAYAMA . On the way, stop at Shirakawa-go ? -

Friday, October 31, 2014
Go to KANAZAWA - See Kenrokuen garden)

Saturday, November 01, 2014
KANAZAWA - ?

Sunday, November 02, 2014
Leave for KYOTO - Daitokuji Temple & Zen Gardens
Kyoto - Hyatt Regency

Monday, November 03, 2014
KYOTO - Katsura Imperial Villa & Garden
Kyoto Hyatt Regency

Tuesday, November 04, 2014
KYOTO - day trip to Mt. Koya and/or Daigoji Temple & landscape garden
Kyoto - Hyatt Regency

Wednesday, November 05, 2014
Leave early for HIROSHIMA via Kyoto on bullet train.
Stay in Miyajama (Shukkeien Garden)

Thursday, November 06, 2014
KYOTO - Kokedera (Moss Temple)

Friday, November 07, 2014
KYOTO - day trip tp Nara (Isuien Garden and/or Yoshikien Garden)

Saturday, November 08, 2014
KYOTO - Ryoanji Temple & Rock garden
Sunday, November 09, 2014
KYOTO - Day trip: Osaka Castle / Temmangu Shrine (Nakanoshima) - Minoo Park

Monday, November 10, 2014
Leave for Osaka airport in the morning for 2:30pm flight home"

You'll see some wonderful things!

Some initial thoughts:

If it isn't too late to reverse the order of your trip, you might want to do so -- you might just be able to catch koyo (autumn leaf season) in Nikko:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2014_when.html

Nikko can, indeed, be seen as a day trip from Tokyo. If you want to see Kegon-no-Taki and even a little bit of Lake Chuzenji, it would make for a very LONG day trip. I was glad to spend a night in Nikko, but then, I don't mind moving around a lot.

Which reminds me -- relocating with some frequency is MUCH easier in Japan than in most locations because of its wonderful (and very reliable) baggage forwarding option, see:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2278.html

If I'm understanding your plans correctly, you are planning only the half-day bus tour and one garden in Tokyo itself -- is that correct? Although Tokyo was not my favorite destination in Japan, I'm very glad I visited Asakusa, the Meiji Shrine, and even a small bit of more modern Tokyo. Adding a day would, I think, give you more latitude to appreciate the contrasts between Tokyo and the other places your are visiting.

I believe that Shirakawago is between Takayama and Kanazawa, so it would make more sense to visit it between your stops in those two cities. FWIW, I spent just over 1 full day in Takayama and wish I had more time there. I spent 1.5 days in Kanazawa and wish I had more time there. So this part of your plan sounds rushed to me. YMMV. If your wife loves gardens, then while in Kanazawa, do consider a stop at the small, glorious Gyokusen-en:
http://www.geocities.jp/gyokusen_en/top-e.html

I'm not sure I would attempt a day trip to Koya-san. In contrast, I found my overnight stay at a temple there to be among the highlights of my highlight-filled trip to Japan. As I understand it, one's choice of temple makes a big difference to the experience. I was very pleased with Shojoshin-in:
https://www.japaneseguesthouses.com/...n=Shojoshin-in

I'm not sure I understand your plans for Kyoto. It sounds like you are planning relatively little time IN Kyoto during your stay there, and are instead planning quite a few day trips from Kyoto -- but maybe am I misunderstanding? Too, I assume that what you are listing is your highest priority for the day. Many of the places you list may take only an hour or two. FWIW, do consider finding time for Nijo-jo while it Kyoto -- it stands out in my mind as one of the most beautiful buildings I visited in Japan. And while I'm sure the season makes a difference, my favorite garden in Kyoto was the one at Heian Jingu.

I don't think you'll regret staying in Miyajima!

Hope this helps!

Hi Kja - yes you are right this is not a full itinerary for each day. It's just a start on where we would spend the night and a 1st thought on things to see. Can't reverse the trip. As to Kyoto, we planned on 7 nights but found that Hiroshima worked best by putting it in the middle. We are not locked in to always leaving from Kyoto. An overnight stay in a temple is just not the right fit for me (and my back. Thank you for your thoughts

gf...if you decide to take in the unique Miho Museum, as I suggested, I feel you can fit it in comfortably on the same day you've scheduled the Moss Temple. Miho is a half day affair, morning or afternoon. Preferably morning..you can be back by very early afternoon, ample tme to cover more of your itinerary.
You're in for a superb Japanese orientation. Enjoy.

You could add Hama Rikyu garden to your Tokyo itin. I visited Asakusa then took the boat to Hama Rikyu then went to Tsukiji.

Oct 26 - there is a Hyatt in Hakone. Maybe you can get a free night there.

Oct 27 - That is a busy day. Ise and Hikone are in different directions from Nagoya. I would not go to the hotel, just stash your bag in a coin locker at Nagoya station. Or at Maibara and Nagoya. Or just use takkyubin. This day definitely needs a good plan to make it work. I think it might be doable, but a rush. What is your plan for the day? Your idea for luggage logistics wastes time.

I can recommend the Hilton in Nagoya. There is a shuttle from the hotel to the shinkansen entrance to Nagoya station.

Hikone can be a part-day trip from Kyoto.

Oct 30 - No, Shirakawago is not on the way between Matsumoto and Takauyama. Kamikochi is on the way, if you go by bus. I recommend the Best Western in Takayama as a good Western hotel, close the the station.

A better route would be Tokyo- Matsumoto- Magome- Nagoya- Takayama. Your plan has some backtracking if you go from Matsumoto to Takayama by train. You would have no backtracking if you get to Takayama by bus from Matsumoto.

Oct 31- You should add a night to Takayama or skip it. A second night there would definitely be worthwhile. I would recommend a night in Shirakawago but that would be a futon on the floor.

Shirakawago is on the way by bus from Takayama to Kanazawa.

Kanazawa - I suggest not visiting Kenrokuen on the day you arrive in Kanazawa. Do it the next day. I think it would make for a more relaxing visit to the garden. Wake up in Kanazawa and have as much time as you want for the garden - this is better than cramming in Kenrokuen on a day that you are checking out, traveling, checking in.

The one major flaw in your itin, with an interest in gardens, is that you don't have <b><blue>Korakuen</b></blue> on it.

You have two options for a rail pass.

You would get full use of 14-day JR Pass starting Oct 27 and ending on Nov 9.

A 21-day pass would be 13,000 yen more. Your two airport transfers (from NRT and to KIX) are about 3500 each on JR.

For the trip from Narita Airport: Taking non-JR trains would cost half as much as JR. The Westin is a bit of a walk from Ebisu station. It is an easy flat walk, covered most of the way.

A limo bus to from NRT to the Westin would be about the same price as JR but more convenient. All of the rail options would involve changes of trains and a walk.

A round-trip on JR from the Westin to Nikko would cost about 10,000. That is on JR. Using Tobu Railways trains would cost a good bit less - using their rapid or local trains. The Tobu limited express train costs more, not sure how much.

Getting to Hakone on JR would cost about 4000 one way. Again, the non-JR option (Odakyu) would be about half as much.

So, it is easy enough to justify paying the the cost difference between the 14- and 21-day JR passes, if you use JR for all that travel. I think I would get the 21-day pass and use the limo bus from NRT to the Westin, assuming that there is one and it works well with your arrival time.

There was a very nice cigar shop at the Tokyo Westin when I stayed there a few years ago.

You said "Budget wise I am ready to "spend" for the one or two nights in a good Ryokan and would like a balance of rooms b/w $150 and $350 depending on the town, competition and needs."

Can I draw your attention to Shiraume in Kyoto, I linked to my blog post on Shiraume in a previously reply. It's a traditional but wonderfully comfortable ryokan in the very heart of traditional Gion. The owner speaks fluent English and is mindful of modern travel comforts. The futon (floor) mattresses are thick and comfortable, and the ensuite bathroom in our room was superb. And the food is excellent too. I let her know in advance that I had a bad back, so she gave us a room with back support chairs and foot well, for all our meals. It looked out onto the stream at the front.

I agree that your Shirakawago / Takayama / Kanazawa itinerary seems very very rushed. May be worth dropping something here, or you'll do none of them justice with so little time. Your call, of course!



Re Granvia hotels - we stayed in the Granvia in Kyoto station for a few nights, rooms were standard western hotel room, not huge but not tiny, perfectly comfortable. Food in the hotel was overpriced, we didn't eat there once, but the location was very handy when doing day trips / train journeys in vicinity of Kyoto - such as Arashiyama, Yamazaki etc.