Kunming
Jun 5th, 2006, 05:35 AM
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Kunming
Hi - thinking of visiting. Not too many references on this site. Would anyone who has been there care to share their thoughts/experiences?
How did you get there, and where did you come from? How did you leave, and where did you go to?
Especially interested in tales of leaving or arriving by road and coming from/going to Vietnam.
Thx loads.
How did you get there, and where did you come from? How did you leave, and where did you go to?
Especially interested in tales of leaving or arriving by road and coming from/going to Vietnam.
Thx loads.
Jun 5th, 2006, 10:22 AM
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Yunnan is a beautiful and fascinating province, but you need to get out of Kunming to really appreciate it. Near Kunming, the most famous attraction is the "Stone Forest". But most travelers now will continue NW to Dali, Lijiang and Shangri-La. Or south to Xishuangbanna. Many ethnic groups also live in various parts of Yunnan.
So, Kunming is just the starting point.
So, Kunming is just the starting point.
Jun 6th, 2006, 04:36 AM
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Thank you, rkkwan. It's sort of a given that I wasn't planning on just visiting Kunming. It is, as I understand it, the hub for exploring that part of China, and that is what I plan to do if I get there. Once there I can suss out the local transport options. What I was interested in is options for getting to Kunming in the first place.
How did you get there?
How did you get there?
Jun 6th, 2006, 05:20 AM
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rkkwan will know all the routes, you can get there in a couple of hours from HK if you want to use that as a route, you can also fly twice daily from Bangkok, Thai or China Eastern, have never been but it is heavily promoted and looks real nice area.
I think there is some special time of year to go for some mass flower festival in the region. It's an interesting option of a side trip from BKK too come to think of it as just a couple of hours flight.
I think there is some special time of year to go for some mass flower festival in the region. It's an interesting option of a side trip from BKK too come to think of it as just a couple of hours flight.
Jun 6th, 2006, 07:15 AM
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There used to be narrow-guage rail connection from Hanoi to Kunming. The line was washed away, and no idea when it will reopen. I am sure there are buses on that route, but I have no information, sorry.
Jun 6th, 2006, 11:47 AM
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In November, 2002, I flew to Kunming from Bangkok (Green Lane Hotel) - visited Stone Forest at Shilin and Western Hills and Dian Lake. Then flew to Dali (Asia Star Hotel - excellent) (must see - visits to Zhouzheng village, Xizhou town, Heishe village plus the Three Pagodas also cruise on Erhai Lake which should not be missed- all Chinese on board with old-fashioned Chinese entertainment) and from there travelled by car with driver to Lijiang (wonderful old town - must see Jade Dragon Snow Mountain with chair lift and Black Dragon Pond, and etc, and visit to the orchestra with ancient instruments which were buried during the cultural revolution). Then on toZhongdean (sorry about spelling). Flew back to Kunming. Then had a car and driver to Hakou on the Chinese/Vietnam border (stayed in hotel for 1 night between Kunming and Hakou) I crossed
the border (had to walk a short way) and then picked up a Vietnamese 4-wheel drive and driver to Hanoi. It was a fabulous drive from
the border (had to walk a short way) and then picked up a Vietnamese 4-wheel drive and driver to Hanoi. It was a fabulous drive from
Jun 6th, 2006, 11:54 AM
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Sorry - pushed the wrong button. To continue my story. Drive from Lijiang was superb (needed 4-wheel drive) saw first bend of the Yangtze at Shigu and Tiger Leaping Gorge (good walk.) From Zhongdian visited Songzhanling Monastery and Bitahai Lake (latter is very cold in late November - really cold!!). Flew back to Kunming. Car and driver from Kunming to Hekou (Fabulous drive) then picked up Vietnamese 4-wheel drive and driver at border to Sapa. Took scenic, mountain route to Hanoi via Lai Chau, Dien Bien, Son La, YUen Chau, Moc Chau, Mai Chau to Hanoi. Can give you more details if you are interested. I just hope things have not changed too much since 2002/3. Pat.
Jun 14th, 2006, 10:35 AM
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Thought you might ask this one!! It took a lot of research before I selected the 2 travel agents.
For the Chinese part of the tour I chose CHINA DIRECT, 109 FERGUSON CLOSE, FERGUSON's WHARF, London E.14 3SJ. Tel. No. 0207538 2840 Fax 020 7536 9088 e-mail [email protected] web www.chinadirect-travel.co.uk Lorimer Poultney (owner) is very helpful and his wife is Chinese. I found my own way to Kunming (I flew in from Bangkok). Then took up my tour from Kunming with China Direct.
I am sure he will still have my name on his file although it was in Nov. 2002 (time has gone quickly). (My real name is Rosemarie Jeffery, England). One thing I forgot to mention - on my return trip from Kunming to Hekou, I stayed one night in Jianshui- if you like something different you can't miss the old mansion I stayed in!!! Can't put my hand on the address but will look it up if you are interested.
I parted with my Chinese car and driver
at Hekou (you have to walk across the border to the Vietnamese side). My Vietnamese driver was waiting for me!!
Be careful here because there is a 1 hour time difference which affects the time of the border closure. If you are still interested, I can give you the route I took in Vietnam.
Name of my Vientamese Travel Agent - FOCUS TRAVEL OFFICE, situated in the Guoman Hotel, Hanoi (Guoman Hotel, 83A Ly Thuong Kiet Street, Hoan Kiem District, Hanoi Vietnam. e-mail [email protected] website www.guomanhanoi.com.vn/) Initially, I wrote to the Manager at the Guoman Hotel to ask him for the Travel Agent's address (I had stayed there the previous year and had 'found' the Agent.) I can thoroughly recommend the Guoman Hotel - excellent position and hotel (a short walk from the Lake). If you would like the address of the actual Tour Co. - please let me know as I will look it up for you. They were excellent - I chose my route and hotels and they arranged it and priced it. I like to stay at 'interesting' hotels!
I loved the Yunnan and Northern (an Southern) Vietnam - also the Mekong Delta and boat trip into Phnompenh by Victoria Boat.
If you need more specific details, please ask. No doubt things have changed but hopefully not too much.
"Pat"
For the Chinese part of the tour I chose CHINA DIRECT, 109 FERGUSON CLOSE, FERGUSON's WHARF, London E.14 3SJ. Tel. No. 0207538 2840 Fax 020 7536 9088 e-mail [email protected] web www.chinadirect-travel.co.uk Lorimer Poultney (owner) is very helpful and his wife is Chinese. I found my own way to Kunming (I flew in from Bangkok). Then took up my tour from Kunming with China Direct.
I am sure he will still have my name on his file although it was in Nov. 2002 (time has gone quickly). (My real name is Rosemarie Jeffery, England). One thing I forgot to mention - on my return trip from Kunming to Hekou, I stayed one night in Jianshui- if you like something different you can't miss the old mansion I stayed in!!! Can't put my hand on the address but will look it up if you are interested.
I parted with my Chinese car and driver
at Hekou (you have to walk across the border to the Vietnamese side). My Vietnamese driver was waiting for me!!
Be careful here because there is a 1 hour time difference which affects the time of the border closure. If you are still interested, I can give you the route I took in Vietnam.
Name of my Vientamese Travel Agent - FOCUS TRAVEL OFFICE, situated in the Guoman Hotel, Hanoi (Guoman Hotel, 83A Ly Thuong Kiet Street, Hoan Kiem District, Hanoi Vietnam. e-mail [email protected] website www.guomanhanoi.com.vn/) Initially, I wrote to the Manager at the Guoman Hotel to ask him for the Travel Agent's address (I had stayed there the previous year and had 'found' the Agent.) I can thoroughly recommend the Guoman Hotel - excellent position and hotel (a short walk from the Lake). If you would like the address of the actual Tour Co. - please let me know as I will look it up for you. They were excellent - I chose my route and hotels and they arranged it and priced it. I like to stay at 'interesting' hotels!
I loved the Yunnan and Northern (an Southern) Vietnam - also the Mekong Delta and boat trip into Phnompenh by Victoria Boat.
If you need more specific details, please ask. No doubt things have changed but hopefully not too much.
"Pat"
Jun 15th, 2006, 04:07 AM
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Well thx - all very useful info - but seems my post has been hijacked by people who have a car and driver to take them everywhere - which wasn't the point at all.
Isn't there anyone out there who just busks it, and gets on a bus or a train sometime without it all being booked for them in advance?
Obviously not - and don't point me to the TT - been there, done that.
I just live in hope that this site which clearly caters to the older folk might one day turn up someone who doesn't need it all laid out for them.
Happy travels, all.
Isn't there anyone out there who just busks it, and gets on a bus or a train sometime without it all being booked for them in advance?
Obviously not - and don't point me to the TT - been there, done that.
I just live in hope that this site which clearly caters to the older folk might one day turn up someone who doesn't need it all laid out for them.
Happy travels, all.
Jun 15th, 2006, 04:25 AM
#11
fuzzy - the lonely planet board might be more to your liking - you'd probably get more help there. I read it for ideas sometimes, but it's less to my liking. Yup, I AM older and yes I DO prefer most things taken care of in advance! Does that make me a bad person? I hope not! Are YOU a bad person for wanting to wing it? No. All of us are different - isn't that what makes for an interesting world? And isn't accepting differences what can make for a nicer world?
Jun 16th, 2006, 04:55 AM
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Agree Althorn - but you see a value judgement in my post where I see none.
Where exactly do I say that booking everything in advance makes you a bad person? I can't find it.
As I said, know and love the TT. But look to Fodors too. There must be other folk out there who are looking for a middle way. I'd have thought there'd be some on this site.
Where exactly do I say that booking everything in advance makes you a bad person? I can't find it.
As I said, know and love the TT. But look to Fodors too. There must be other folk out there who are looking for a middle way. I'd have thought there'd be some on this site.
Jun 16th, 2006, 05:10 AM
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Chill. Threads get hijacked all the time, on all bulletin boards. Sometimes mine get hijacked, sometimes I hijack others'. No big deal.
Most visitors just stick to Kunming and Lijiang. Therefore not that much information about surface transport to Vietnam. We don't have to have experts about every corner of the world.
Anyways, China is a relatively place to travel on ones' own. To do things like surface transport between Vietnam and China, you basically just have to arrange after getting there. No one will pre-book bus tickets online or otherwise.
Give yourself some extra time, prepare to pay a little more cash, and you will have no problem travelling anywhere (or just about anywhere) in China.
Most visitors just stick to Kunming and Lijiang. Therefore not that much information about surface transport to Vietnam. We don't have to have experts about every corner of the world.
Anyways, China is a relatively place to travel on ones' own. To do things like surface transport between Vietnam and China, you basically just have to arrange after getting there. No one will pre-book bus tickets online or otherwise.
Give yourself some extra time, prepare to pay a little more cash, and you will have no problem travelling anywhere (or just about anywhere) in China.
Mar 30th, 2008, 09:18 AM
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sorry. I meant to ask about Kunming...would this be an interesting city to spend a few days in before moving on to Lijiang, etc? I am starting to do some preliminary thinking for a possible trip at the end of this year, or early next. Considering beginning in Hong Kong but am open to other ideas....(flying from NYC area) Is it possible to reach Kunming by very comfortable direct train from HK/Shenzhen?
Mar 30th, 2008, 09:38 AM
#16
Hi eks - I spent some time in and around Kunming in 2004. The town itself was pleasant enough (nice and warm after chill rain in Chengdu!), although swathes were being rebuilt in glass and concrete. I don't remember any especially interstign sights, but I mostly used it as a base.
I arrived by train from Chengdu and left by train to Nanning (on the way to Vietnam since the direct line was still out). I did a southern loop by bus to Tonghai, Jianshui, Gejiu and back via the Stone Forest (see www.wilhelmswords.com/rtw2004). I had a great time doing that, but aside from the Stone Forest none of them are main tourist destinations.
Then I flew to Lijiang, returning by bus and train via Dali. I would have loved Lijiang but it was totally overrun by tour groups, and instead of spending much time there I took a local bus up to Dazu at the far end of Tiger Leaping Gorge. Gorgeous scenery, but only recommendable if you're prepared to seriously rough it. I would love to hike the Gorge itself, but neither my shoes nor I were in great shape at the time, and I was hesitant to hike it alone.
I arrived by train from Chengdu and left by train to Nanning (on the way to Vietnam since the direct line was still out). I did a southern loop by bus to Tonghai, Jianshui, Gejiu and back via the Stone Forest (see www.wilhelmswords.com/rtw2004). I had a great time doing that, but aside from the Stone Forest none of them are main tourist destinations.
Then I flew to Lijiang, returning by bus and train via Dali. I would have loved Lijiang but it was totally overrun by tour groups, and instead of spending much time there I took a local bus up to Dazu at the far end of Tiger Leaping Gorge. Gorgeous scenery, but only recommendable if you're prepared to seriously rough it. I would love to hike the Gorge itself, but neither my shoes nor I were in great shape at the time, and I was hesitant to hike it alone.
Mar 30th, 2008, 09:41 AM
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We have been to Yunnan twice, including Kunming twice. The first time we went from Bangkok & flew to Kunming (stayed at Camelia Hotel, good and simple with much softer beds than Holiday Inn Kunming where we started off). Then by bus to Dali, we stayed in Number four guest house in town & this ia a very simple place. From here we went by bus to Lijiang - stayed at Lijiang Grand Hotel and from there with another couple to Tiger Leaping Gorge and in town there caught another bus to Zhongdian. From Zongdian we flew back to Kunming then onto Jinhong. From Jinhong we took a bus to Jianshui. We also stayed in Zhu Family Garden in Jianshui (I think this is the one Rosemarie is also thinking of). From there we went back to Kunming, via swallow cave and stayed one night at Shilin stone forest. This is all do-able on your own, but needs good planning. Have a look at
http://www.chinatrekking.com/destina...unnan/jianshui (change last place name to get other links eg.
http://www.chinatrekking.com/destinations/yunnan/dali). We love Yunnan there is so much to see there. We did this section as part of 3 mths we spent in China, there was little at that time on this area & at that time I found this Bradt guide the most useful and informative in planning http://www.bradt-travelguides.com/details.asp?prodid=47.
http://www.chinatrekking.com/destina...unnan/jianshui (change last place name to get other links eg.
http://www.chinatrekking.com/destinations/yunnan/dali). We love Yunnan there is so much to see there. We did this section as part of 3 mths we spent in China, there was little at that time on this area & at that time I found this Bradt guide the most useful and informative in planning http://www.bradt-travelguides.com/details.asp?prodid=47.
Mar 31st, 2008, 04:16 AM
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Thanks..the reports from both of you had piqued my interest in Yunnan in the first place!! I am trying to work out a vague circle that would include Lijiang and Xishuangbanna and maybe Dali. I am thinking of entering via Hong Kong..and would like to include one overnight train.. Then, where to depart China from???
Kunming to Chinag Mai? Back to Hong Kong?
(I have all but eliminated Guilin because of the comments here about it being overrun.)
I just bought the Lonely Planet SW China so will come back with more questions..
Also: I have just started a new book, linked below, by Fuchsia Dunlop which tells of her time in Sichuan and southern China. She is now a recognized authority on Chinese cooking and first went to Chengdu as a student..highly recommended:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...n_page_id=1826
Kunming to Chinag Mai? Back to Hong Kong?
(I have all but eliminated Guilin because of the comments here about it being overrun.)
I just bought the Lonely Planet SW China so will come back with more questions..
Also: I have just started a new book, linked below, by Fuchsia Dunlop which tells of her time in Sichuan and southern China. She is now a recognized authority on Chinese cooking and first went to Chengdu as a student..highly recommended:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...n_page_id=1826
Mar 31st, 2008, 08:45 AM
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EK -- I would not rule out Guilin too quickly, the landscape is exquisite and mesmerizing, very different from Yunan. Unless you get off the regular tourists' path, it is not much more overrun than Lijiang.
Mar 31st, 2008, 09:08 AM
#20
eks - so pleased to hear that! BTW, some of my photos from that trip are up at kwilhelm.smugmug.com/Travel/287618, don't know if you've already seen them.
I have Fuschia Dunlop's "Land of Plenty" which is mostly recipes, I'll have to look for the new book.
If you are going north to Lijiang you could consider continuing north to Chengdu, maybe visiting the Tibetan grasslands to the west, if things have settled down by then. Chengdu has nice parks and temples, and is a base for pandas, the Leshan Buddha, and sacred mountains. Or didn't you like Hanoi? (Although I really can't recommend the train from the Chinese border to Hanoi, lol!) I would love to be able to follow the old "Burma Road" into Myanmar, but I think that's still either closed or pretty difficult.
I have Fuschia Dunlop's "Land of Plenty" which is mostly recipes, I'll have to look for the new book.
If you are going north to Lijiang you could consider continuing north to Chengdu, maybe visiting the Tibetan grasslands to the west, if things have settled down by then. Chengdu has nice parks and temples, and is a base for pandas, the Leshan Buddha, and sacred mountains. Or didn't you like Hanoi? (Although I really can't recommend the train from the Chinese border to Hanoi, lol!) I would love to be able to follow the old "Burma Road" into Myanmar, but I think that's still either closed or pretty difficult.
