vp_singh

I did notice the train journey, a sleeper class, to Udaipur in the month of January?? You must be joking!

CaliNurse

Mr Singh--i am curious what you mean about the overnight train. Is it cold at that time of year? Is the train uncomfortable? I'd like to know in case i ever do an overnight journey in India. Arent the sleeper cars climate controlled?

Rinda, yes, I am near Hayward, and would love to meet some time the week of 7/26, if you still have time. I will phone you !! YOU are smart to get other estimates for a trip to North and South. Every one of them will help. ANd you're wise to start planning this early.

CaliNurse

http://www.indiarail.co.uk/nasis.htm

http://tours.indiatoursonline.com/north-to-south.html

above are links to two other companies' "North and South" itineraries. in a three week time space. HOwever, they do not include some of your "must-do" places. As
with other recommendations..it is just to give some idea,for comaprison, things to include or rule-out etc--along with thefeedback help from Fodorites

Good thing you're starting your research early!!

CaliNurse

lol, "comaprison." Should be "comparison."
Typos can be fun--especially the ones made at 1:30 am!

CaliNurse

Another idea:

http://www.indianmoments.com/close-c...d=15&keytype=2

Someone else on Fodors(I think--or another forum) is booking with this company. Although he hasnt done the trip yet, he is quite positive about his experience thus far with them. To me it seems quite expensive--not the price is per perso, not per couple. But with the flights and trains, i guess a lot is added to the price of trip to India.

dilen

Just my opinion. We enjoyed both the evening and morning boat trips in Varanasi. They were different. The evening was about the cremations and the morning focus was the bathing and laundry. Also, we loved Orchha. The Amar Mahal was lovely and the restaurant was very good. It's very close to the cenotaphs (tombs) which were interesting. The town was small and the market and palace were really nice. No high pressure selling, which was a relief. We gave a tip to the caretaker at the palace and he showed us some nice paintings on the walls & ceilings. We had the place to ourselves. We enjoyed the drive to Agra. Lots to see. The small villages, farming, ladies working in their colorful saris, animals and children everwhere. We also liked the Howard Park in Agra. Good luck with your planning.

Rinda1

This is Ajays suggested tour:
Day 1: Welcome and go to hotel(Svelte Personal Suites)

Day 2 Delhi including: Mahatma Gandhi Memorial; Cycle Rickshaws to visit Chandni Chowk, Kariba Kalan, Kinari Bazaar, Paranthe Wali Gali, Khari Baoli; Jama masjid; Red Fort;Mausoleum of Emperor Humayun; Qutab Minar; Gurudwara plus a dinner with an Indian Host Family

Day 3: Fly to Varanasi (Hotel Ideal Towers) In evening visit the Ghats to witness the Deepmala Ceremony- (A special prayer is organized for you at the ghats were a thousand earthen lamps are loated on the waterr- the purpose is my well being and prosperity). Ride on a boat towardds the Harishchandra Ghat where credmation rituals are performed. Then back to the main Ghat -The dasvmdeha Ghat in time to see the start oif the Grand Deepmala ceremony. On the way back take a Rickshaw Ride through the bazaars. Car & driver available to take us to dinner
Day 4: Varanasi; Early morning boat ride on the Ganges-5 different Ghats and ends on Rah Ghat. Walk from Harishchandra Ghat through the old part of the city. AFter lunch day tour of Varanasi including a tour of Sarnath. Later a Musicians Home for Tea and Short Sitar Performance. After getting up at 5, I may skip the Sitars.

Day 5: Fly to Khajuraho (Hotel Usha Bundela) See Western Temples. Light show in evening

Day 6: Visit Eastern Group of Temples and leave by surface? for Jhansi. Enroute visit Orchha. Take the Express Train from Jhansi to Agra

Day 7: Agra (Howard Park Plaza Hotel) sunset visit to the Taj Mahal

Day 8: Agra/Jaipur (Shapura House)
Sunrise visit to Taj Mahal. Drive 6 hours to Jaipur and visit Fatehpur Sikri enroute. Visit the Biria Temmple in evening to witness the arti ceremony.

Day 9: Jaipur - City tour, Amber Fort, Elephant ride,-lots of bazaars and the Monkey Temple

Day 10 Jaipur-we requested a day for business to look for semi precious stones in Jaipur. They will furnish a car and driver

Day 11: Jaipur/Shahpura 4 Hour drive (Shahpura Bagh-Deluxe Room) Look at arts and crafts in Shahpura

Day 12: Shahpura/Udaipur (Hotel Jagat Niwas)
Boat ride on Lake Pichola

Day 13: Udaipur
Excursion to Ranakpur and Jain Temple complex. Lunch at Maharani Bagh Orchard Retreat. After return to Udaipur there is some free time

Day 14: Udaipur/Mumbai (Hotel Godwin in Mumbai)
City tour of Udaipur and fly to Mumbai
Walk around Colaba market with guide

Day 15: City tour markets, ghats and British stuff
Dinner at Trishna (direct payment but they will drive us there)

Day 16: Mumbai/Aurangabad Fly to Aurangabad (Taj Residency Executive Room) Tour Ellora Caves and return to Aurangabad

Day 17: Aurangabad -excursion to Ajanta Caves and return to Aurangabad

Day 18: Auangabad/Mumbai/Madras(Chennai)/Covelong (Ideal Beach Resort)
Fly to Mumbai and connect to Madras then drive to Covelong Beach. Excursion to Mahabalipuram. See turtles

Day 19: Covelong
Excursion to Kanchipuram. Then drive to Chennai and visit the Madras City

Day 20 Covelong/Chennai/Madurra (Hotel Germanus) Madurai's Meenakshi Temple and a Spectacular Evening arti ceremony.

Day 21 Madura
Excursion to Chettinada. Lots of bazaars Lunch at the Bungalow

Day 22 Madura/Mumbai Fly to Mumbai, connect Delhi to London and LA

Please give me your thoughts, ideas and suggestions.

Marija

The first 17 days are similar to ours, except that we didn't have to stay in Mumbai to connect to Aurangabad. We didn't do any dinners/musicians, etc., although my husband did have a consultation with an astrologer who assured him that he would have a healthy life and die in his 90s while drinking tea. What's not to like about that? Looks like they've added some touristy stuff like "special ceremonies." The connections worked well. You can read more about it here:
http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...o-to-india.cfm
Overall we were very pleased with yatrik.

Nutella

Marija, I can't help but ask - Given what the astrologer said, does your husband plan to drink tea when he's in his 90s???

Rinda1

Marija- Thanks for the link to your tour. I enjoyed it and found it most informative.
I am having a hard time deciding on which tour operator to use. I have contacted a couple and still have many more recommendations from Fodorites who highly recommend their tour. I am sure all of the recommended tours are good at organization. They can all book good hotels although yours are more expensive than we had planned on using. I imagine a good guide is important but it is difficult from afar to tell if you have a good one. How did you decide to use the one you chose?

Marija

Rinda1--I chose yatrik based on recommendations from Bostonharbor on Fodor's and comparisons with other agencies that submitted proposals. It's not true that all tours are good at organization: compare the yatrik itinerary to the Indian Panorama itinerary. <b>You </b> have to decide how much time you want to spend at the different destinations and how much time you want to devote to getting from one place to another.

Nutella--my husband prefers more potent and more healthy beverages that deliver more antioxidants per gulp now (eg. red wine), but perhaps when he's 90 he'll switch to tea...

CaliNurse

Hi Rinda. What is the price difference between these two itineraries? I wonder if the recommendation of trains in the first one, is based on your stated financial limits? Did Yatrik work with the same set of budget guidelines?

Many of the visited places are the same. (e.g.Note the feedback above about going to Chennai for example) with a few differences.

Re: the disorganized and chaotic-sounding first itinerary--my itineraries, from Indian Panorama as well as other agencies, both "rough draft" and final version, never looked like that!!! To see what they did look like, if interested, check Indianpanorama.in webstei adn the presented sample itineraries. I suspect Rinda, in an excited rush, "summarized" utilising run-on sentences, cut off sentences, mysterious spellings ("grown"?) one long paragraph spanning two different timed posts, etc..That adds to the exhausting feel of it.

A lot is fit into a short time, but presented this latest itinerary in a much more orderly fashion. Thank you!!

As I wrote before, i totally understand your desire to fit in as much as poss in three weeks. We need to respect that as your travel choic, which inevitably is going to sound--and be-- rushed . But your trip will also be very exciting and like nothing you've ever experienced before!!

MArija, i read your trip report. Fantastic!! And as an example of the different services different people expect, I probably would n be upset with an agent that had organized a trip with as many snafus as you experienced at first. The "icing ion the cake" is the non-comp (sounds like nincompoop) mgr at The Imperial. Did you chose that place, or was it part of your itinerary organized by your travel agent? If the latter, i would be equally angry with him, for putting his good name on an itin that included a hotel--n mater ow famous--with such terrible customer service.

Rinda1

I actually cut and pasted the emails to the 2 tour leaders. They had the same info specifically and average of $100 a night for hotels. I asked for a train ride and Ajay suggested against it, but Faith put in 2 overnights. I received 2 pages from Faith and 16 pages from Ajay which may have given a different look to the itns. By the way, the word (grown) referred to getting up at sunrise. It was not part of the tour.
I guess what I have learned is that any reputable tour leader can give me what I want in a tour so since I am already working with recommended ones, there is no real reason to ask another tour leader for his idea of a tour.
I have received a price from Faith and am expecting one from Ajay tomorrow. Since Faith put in 2 overnights, hers will probably be somewhat less expensive. After much discussion about the fact that the sleeper is a 4 person cabin, I think we will pass on the overnight trains. I am sure Faith can make this change.
One thing that I particularly like about what I have heard about Ajay is that he supplies you with a cell phone so you can call your driver Brilliant!!
CaliNurse- Were you supplied with a cell phone? Also, I am in Gilroy for the weekend, and will be going to Hayward on Monday, and would dearly love to get together next week or at least talk to you on the phone.

CaliNurse

Hi RInda,
Yes, i planned to phone you over the weekend! I am free several evenings while you are in Hayward and would love to meet.

Thanks for the clarfications. Grown--ok, now i understand--groan!! LOL. Me too (-;

But...We got up to get to Taj Mahal at sunrise and it was soooo wortj it-- we had the place almost completely to ourselves for the first hour, and it was magical. Once the trains from Delhi, etc, arrive into with tourists (like us!) Agra, the crowds descend.

I am curious if the second itin costs much more . If not--wow!! Great! In my experience and research, IP's prices were very reasonable compared to most.

We did not receive a cell phone, but i agree , that is a BRILLIANT idea of Ajay's company. I'll have to ask for that next time! I can guess that would come in very useful. We were able to use our drivers' cellphones (no extra fee) on both trips with IP, to make calls out (including out of the country) but that was when we were with the drivers.
I never thought about it, but i guess that would seem a mystery--how do you contact your driver? Amazingly, it never came up as a problem. Either the hotel desk or doorman would phone for us--the first thing we were handed is a business card with driver's contact number, 24 hour help number. The drivers we had (and i think most reputable tour company drivers) have this mysterious way of pulling up to the lobby door just as you need them!! It's one of the enigmas of travel in India (When we meet, remind me to tell you about hte Indian Tourist Telegraph) Or we would retire for the night and tell our driver what time we wanted to lv in the a.m. (or not). SInce like you I dont like to wake early (groan,indeed!) knowing we had a specific time to be honored, was a great way to get ourselves out of bed--especially in the early jet-lagged days.

Yes, Faith or any very good tour planner should be flexible according to YOUR wishes. As i said in my answer to your orignial post, she (and any good tour planner) will work hard to make sure to you get YOUR travel needs met.

YOu were very smart to cut and paste the identical enquiry to each travel planner.

I decided agains overnighter trains early in my India research (before contacting agents) for the same reason as yours--i didnt want 4 (or 6 ) people around me overnight, with only a little curtain for privacy, and having to disturb everyone for several toilet trips. I think some of the Indian trains have private sleep compartments--now THAT would be do-able. But i prefer my very own toilet at night time!

SIXTEEN page answer from Yatrik? Amazing!!

520

I'll just add to the ongoing discussion--although I've reported elsewhere--that although I have NOT yet been to India (going for 17 days on Thanksgivin), I decided to work with Ajay because of the many excellent reports about him and Yatrik on this forum, and during the many alterations of our agenda and he has been consistently and immediately responsive (without being overbearing!), helpful, and innovative in his suggestions.

My itinerary is concentrated in the north and one or two other posters have a very similar one--and, I think, are using Yatrik, also. Cali, your agent sounded excellent also, once I started working with Ajay (having already contacted a few here in NY w/India partners) I decided to work with him.

CaliNurse

520, have a great time planning!!!!

Personally, I find the Yatrik website a bit odd, difficult to navigate, and short on specifics, but considering all the great reviews here, i will definitely get a $ estimate and itinerary proposal from Ajay for next India trip--2011, unless i just cant stand to that long!

There's a whole politics to the tourist industry India: lots of interconnections, subcontracting , relationships, etc. So it's especially important for tour planners to have a good firm hand on it all! Sounds like you are in excellent hands!!

You will love India,520!!!

dogster

Hey Cali - you are being incredibly helpful to rinda. I was just looking for a trip report or something from you about your trip to India, but it looks like you've been away from these forums for a while. I'd love to read it. Do you have a report posted somewhere? When did you go? You seem to know a lot about it all. How many times have been? Where did you go? For how long?

I didn't really understand this bit: <i>There's a whole politics to the tourist industry India: lots of interconnections, subcontracting , relationships, etc. So it's especially important for tour planners to have a good firm hand on it all! </i>

I'd love it if you'd elaborate. What is 'The Indian Tourist Telegraph'?

CaliNurse

LOL, Dog! the Indian Tourist Telegraph is what I call the amazing mystery of how when you arrive in a place, the people at shops, etc seem to know immediately how long youve been there, where you've from, etc.

Here's an example: At Taj Mahal in June, i arrived with my daughter just before sunset, with our guide (who was fantastic, incidentally--name avail to all on request)) . At this time of year, there were very few out-of-country tourists--it was mostly Indian families,as school vacation had just started. Of course, we were stared at, smiled at, greeted (nothing nicer than someone saying "Welcome to our country") etc. MY daughter is in her early 20s, very petite, and lovely, and looks quite different than I.

As the day wore on, more and more families arrived. We were enchanted with the place, couldnt tear ourselves away, despite the every growing crowds, which--youve been there, Dogster and others, so you know--numbered in the hundreds at least, It was very hot (100F plus) and i started to feel faint, even despite omnipresent water bottle. Dtr and guide continued to wander round; i needed to sit in the shade outside, away from crowds, seeding privacy and calm and quiet . Then a very pleasant worker appeared. I;d not seen him or conversed with him previously. There were any families there.Of course we stuck out, but didnt think about it. Then he asked, "Hello, how are you?" "Fine, thank you." "But WHERE is your daughter?" Out of the blue. I wanted to ask.."How do you know i have a daughter?" than i remembered... the "telegraph"!!

My friend who has been to India ten times, and I , laugh about this and similar situations--it is so typical of a trip there! Her take is that Indian people love to talk, are fascinated bh family relationships and whose who, and have great imaginations! (NO offense to anyone, I hope--i LOVE that@) and she envisioned a scene where as we entered the gates to the Taj area, one family saw us, and the "Where's the husband? Why is the husband not here? Is she a widow? Maybe not related? Two women alone. Is that the daughter? Oh yes, she called her Mommy. Must be the daughter. But they don't look alike! Why then did they come this far? Maybe Aunty (ie old lady!) is her guardian, isnt' it?" etc etc. ANd the surmising spread...allthe way to the curious and friendly worker on the grounds.

Re on the tourist industry--it's what I've learned and observed from personal experience and talking and asking lots of questions of assorted people: Folks India Mike who have traveled there numerous times, or live there, a travel planner i've used has told me this in explaining the "politics"of requesting a guide who may not be part of the agency your travel planner knows and usually works with; relationships of trust that have been built over yrs. Many know each other, have worked together then branched out to make their own company--and the reasons for that. The driver and guides have their own little underground shared knowledge network. I find the whole system fascinating, and have learned, as with so much in INdia, there are these mysterious (to us Westerners) ways of doing business.

You'r right; rare trip report. I've done few "offoical"ones (You can see one of mine on the Caribbean forum (St John) and there was one from i think 1999--back in the day before i was Calinurse-- and maybe one for Hawaii) Yes, i visit Fodors on and off. In the course of planning last two trip to India, i found other sites to be more helpful. This one gets relatively little traffic and many of the travelers seem to prefer, and are able to afford, much higher end hotels than can I. The lack of TR's i admit is often due to laziness or lack of time--next thign i know, it's a yr later! So i answer questions in what i hope is a helpful way, if i know anything about the topic.

As for my experience: India three times. First, in the 70s (how embarrassing!) for 6 weeks. Yearned to go back, "life "intervened, and finally, decades later, in financial position to do so.
Dec 2008 for three weeks in the South: parts of Kerala, Karnataka, TN. June 2010 for three weeks in the North--Delhi/Amritsar/McLeod G/Pragpur/Manali/Shoja/Shimla
I have learned from both my experience and from lots of talk about Imdia with friends whove been and lived there. (I try to diffeentiate when giving asked-for advice)

Dreaming always of return trips: Calcutta/Assam/Sikkim; Chennai and down the coast, into Madurai and back into Kerala (which i loved) and maybe back into hill stations (loved Coonor--havent been to KodaikanaL) ; and especially Rajasthan--never been!! Am currently "gobbling up" all i can about places to stay and visit in that state.Also am eager to see New Delhi in its post COmmonwealth games new neatness.
Wow, i have strayed pertty far from Rinda's OP!! Apologies for the diversion. Dogster, great questions. If you would liek to see some of my photos, i will gladly share them--feel free to email me at [email protected]. Daughter does NOT want her pix shared publicly, and havent yet figured out how to separate out .

ANd i wanna be a passenger on your love boat!!

CaliNurse

Oooops-- i meant we arrived at Taj Mahal before sunRISE.
Speaking of TM --,I hope you all have seen "The Namesake" one of the greatest movies ever, IMHO. The scene where the family stands together in awe at makes me cry, every time i see it.

nalijo

CaliNurse

I'm happy taking notes for my second trip to India, this time will be the South East.
OMG!!! I love that movie too... I found it so beautiful that I bought it for my grandchildren...