Family Trip to Thailand September 2011...Novice & Need Advice
Nov 25th, 2010, 06:05 AM
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Family Trip to Thailand September 2011...Novice & Need Advice
My husband has a conference in Phuket in September, 2011. At first we planned on just the two of us going, however, after studying up on Thailand, I think we would regret it if we didn't bring our kids. I have been out of the country once (Switzerland) and our kids have never left the country (we live in Wisconsin) so I feel completely overwhelmed by figuring this trip out. I have been "glued" to the forums here on Fodor's, as well as many other sites/sources. I have an enormous amount of information in my head but I don't know how to compile it into a trip that would work for our family. As a result, I am asking for your advice on how to split our time. Our first step is to figure out plane tickets and from there figure out the other details.
Here is what I know so far....
- We are a family of 5 (kids will be 12, 9, 6)
- Looking to spend 8-10 days in Thailand (not including travel days)
- Saturday, September 10 would be the earliest we could leave home (We possibly could make Sept. 9th work)
- Conference is from Wednesday, September 14 until Sunday, September 18 at the JW Marriott in Phuket (we can add days before/after at a corporate rate if needed). The meetings are mainly just in the mornings so my husband will have afternoons free. I know it is rainy season but we can not change this part of the trip.
- Our kids love animals (definitely want to see elephants)
- Interested in doing tour(s) with Tong.
- Currently thinking of splitting our time between Bangkok and Phuket. I have also read up on Chiang Mai but thinking with our time constraints and keeping the expenses down 2 locations might be more realistic.
My Main Question: I don't know the best way to split our time. From my husband's experience, the time change/jet lag is pretty rough when you arrive. From the research I have done, we are most likely to get into Bangkok a little before midnight. I don't know if it would be best to get all the way to Phuket right away and rest up on the beach or if we should spend a few days in Bangkok first? Any input you have would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance!!
Tara
Here is what I know so far....
- We are a family of 5 (kids will be 12, 9, 6)
- Looking to spend 8-10 days in Thailand (not including travel days)
- Saturday, September 10 would be the earliest we could leave home (We possibly could make Sept. 9th work)
- Conference is from Wednesday, September 14 until Sunday, September 18 at the JW Marriott in Phuket (we can add days before/after at a corporate rate if needed). The meetings are mainly just in the mornings so my husband will have afternoons free. I know it is rainy season but we can not change this part of the trip.
- Our kids love animals (definitely want to see elephants)
- Interested in doing tour(s) with Tong.
- Currently thinking of splitting our time between Bangkok and Phuket. I have also read up on Chiang Mai but thinking with our time constraints and keeping the expenses down 2 locations might be more realistic.
My Main Question: I don't know the best way to split our time. From my husband's experience, the time change/jet lag is pretty rough when you arrive. From the research I have done, we are most likely to get into Bangkok a little before midnight. I don't know if it would be best to get all the way to Phuket right away and rest up on the beach or if we should spend a few days in Bangkok first? Any input you have would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance!!
Tara
Nov 25th, 2010, 06:35 AM
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first of all you will have to spend the first night in bkk... the novotel at the airport is the best place... i would do that and then take a late morning or noon flt to phuket....thai air, air asia are the best bets for the flt..
i had lunch monday at the jw marriott and have previously stayed there... its terrific... it is however about a 45 min ride into patong, the main tourist ctr... but the good news is that you never need to leave the hotel id you don't want... they have a great kids club for your young ones and fantastic pools... the beach waves might be too much for them...
there are excursions to see elephants from there i believe..
i would then fly back to bkk for at least 3-5 days... i would stay at the marriott resort and spa.. it has a fantastic pool--the best in bkk... it is on the river which is prime... the royal orchid sheraton is an alternative...
or one of the marriott serviced apartments... i just stayed in a teo bedroom teo bath unit at the marriott sukhumvit park and it is fab, and a good location too with a nice pool...that way you could all be in the same room... full kitchen and washer dryer in unit too...
sorry to tell you sept. is the worst weather month--lots of rain..
do some more planning and then come back for more help
i had lunch monday at the jw marriott and have previously stayed there... its terrific... it is however about a 45 min ride into patong, the main tourist ctr... but the good news is that you never need to leave the hotel id you don't want... they have a great kids club for your young ones and fantastic pools... the beach waves might be too much for them...
there are excursions to see elephants from there i believe..
i would then fly back to bkk for at least 3-5 days... i would stay at the marriott resort and spa.. it has a fantastic pool--the best in bkk... it is on the river which is prime... the royal orchid sheraton is an alternative...
or one of the marriott serviced apartments... i just stayed in a teo bedroom teo bath unit at the marriott sukhumvit park and it is fab, and a good location too with a nice pool...that way you could all be in the same room... full kitchen and washer dryer in unit too...
sorry to tell you sept. is the worst weather month--lots of rain..
do some more planning and then come back for more help
Nov 25th, 2010, 06:22 PM
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My thoughts and suggestions are as follows:
1. If the most you have is 10 days, and if 5 of those days must be spent in Phuket with the conference, then you don’t have enough time to do 3 places. (See my thoughts below on Phuket generally). If you and the kids can leave the DH on his own a bit, and spend less time in Phuket, and do 3 days in each place, then it is possible to do Bangkok, Phuket and Chiang Mai. But I don’t know that I would recommend it, as it is a lot of moving around. Adults could do it if they wanted, but perhaps with 3 kids it is too much. Look at flight schedules and see what you think. If you only have 8 days, then doing 3 places really is tough, as you seem to realize.
2. I agree with your thought that you should spend some time in Bangkok first rather than just arriving late at night and rushing off next morning to another flight. I am guessing your husband’s conference begins on the afternoon of September 14, so a morning flight on September 14 is probably possible, leaving more time in Bangkok. If you can leave on September 9, arriving the evening of September 10, that would give you 3 full days in Bangkok. You of course could stay a day or so more with just the kids and meet up with the DH later, esp if you can’t leave until September 10 from the US.
3. I assume you are flying out of Chicago. I see what looks like a very good set of flights leaving Chicago at 1 pm via United non-stop to Hong Kong, a 1-hour layover there, and then going via Sri Lanka Airlines on to Bangkok. You would arrive into Bangkok at 8 pm, which means you would be at your hotel by about 10 pm, in time to actually get to sleep. The flight duration is 19 hours, which is better than many of the other routes (like via Seoul) which take 22-23 hours. If you are not tied to a particular airline for miles, then those might work well. (I would put in a vote for spending time in Hong Kong, but you only have a short visit, and September is fairly rainy in Hong Kong as well.)
4. As rhkkmk has mentioned, and as you know, September is the rainy season in Phuket. And I don’t mean the odd rainy day. I mean it could pour rain <i>continuously</i> for your whole time there. Look at sites like weatherbase.com where you will see that the average amount of rain for Phuket in September is 16 inches. Wisconsin gets about 30 inches all year (in the heaviest rainfall moths, this still is only 3-4 inch per month), so 16 inches in one month is a <i>lot</i> of rain. If it is not raining, chances are it will be quite overcast with heavy clouds. The other thing with the monsoon season is that surf is rougher, due to the winds, which can be a real issue at the JW Marriott where surf is rough to begin with. (Have the kids stick to the pools for swimming.) Can also be an issue if you take a kayak trip. Finally, snorkeling is not as good due to a combination of wind and overcast conditions. Of course you could luck out and get great weather for your time there, but the odds are against you. If it pours rain for 4 days, which is quite possible, your kids are going to be bored out of their minds – on top of jet lag. (Adults can read books, shop and drink, not so much for the kids.)
Do bear in mind that Bangkok and Chiang Mai are going to have a fair bit of rain as well, but as it is not a beach, this is not as much of an issue, IMO.
5. Therefore I am going to suggest that you strongly consider skipping Phuket as far as you and your kids are concerned. I would just let the DH go and you could take the kids elsewhere. Sounds crazy perhaps, and I know you want a family vacation, but it may really be the best thing to do. You could take the kids to Chiang Mai, and then your DH could join you there or meet up with you in Bangkok. If you want a beach, then while DH in is Phuket, you could go to Hua Hin or Koh Samui, on the east coast which is drier in September. While 3 kids on your own may be not your idea of a fun vacation, I would think that 5 days in the pouring rain with bored kids is not really an attractive alternative…
6. Another thought is for you to fly out separately with the kids <i>after</i> your husband’s conference and meet up in Bangkok or Chiang Mai. You would all then have 8-10 days in Thailand. Perhaps the thought of taking 3 kids on a long flight on your own is daunting, but this may work very well. I don’t know what your kids school schedule is, but if you could move the trip out by about a week to September 17-27 that might be a good way to do this trip as a family.
7. Another alternative which may work is to go to Chiang Mai first as a family rather than Bangkok first. There is a Thai Airways flight from Bangkok to Chiang Mai which departs at 9:30 pm, and I think you would be able to make that if you take the flight via Hong Kong mentioned above. This may take some mental fortitude to board your third flight in 24 hours or so, but may be workable. The flight is only about an hour, so no long-haul issues. I believe you could make this connection time-wise, but can’t guarantee it. If you do this, you would have 3 days in Chiang Mai with the DH, and he could go to Phuket, while you perhaps stay on 1-2 days more and then go to Bangkok. You could meet up in Bangkok; your husband would have a shorter time there but should be OK. You could of course go to Chiang Mai first and then Phuket together, skipping Bangkok entirely.
8. From what I have seen in Phuket, the elephant rides are very canned. The elephants were imported only for the tourists, as to the best of my knowledge, they were never used as work animals on Phuket. Your kids may find them a bit grim and disappointing. Perhaps others have better experiences to relate, but that has been my experience with elephants in Phuket. IMO going to Chiang Mai or Chiang Rai would make more sense if elephants are a priority.
9. Otherwise, if you go to Phuket with your DH, bring a lot of board games, DVDs and have plenty of alternative (indoor) activities in mind. I would not stay there any longer than the conference is planned to last, but would go to other (drier) places quickly.
1. If the most you have is 10 days, and if 5 of those days must be spent in Phuket with the conference, then you don’t have enough time to do 3 places. (See my thoughts below on Phuket generally). If you and the kids can leave the DH on his own a bit, and spend less time in Phuket, and do 3 days in each place, then it is possible to do Bangkok, Phuket and Chiang Mai. But I don’t know that I would recommend it, as it is a lot of moving around. Adults could do it if they wanted, but perhaps with 3 kids it is too much. Look at flight schedules and see what you think. If you only have 8 days, then doing 3 places really is tough, as you seem to realize.
2. I agree with your thought that you should spend some time in Bangkok first rather than just arriving late at night and rushing off next morning to another flight. I am guessing your husband’s conference begins on the afternoon of September 14, so a morning flight on September 14 is probably possible, leaving more time in Bangkok. If you can leave on September 9, arriving the evening of September 10, that would give you 3 full days in Bangkok. You of course could stay a day or so more with just the kids and meet up with the DH later, esp if you can’t leave until September 10 from the US.
3. I assume you are flying out of Chicago. I see what looks like a very good set of flights leaving Chicago at 1 pm via United non-stop to Hong Kong, a 1-hour layover there, and then going via Sri Lanka Airlines on to Bangkok. You would arrive into Bangkok at 8 pm, which means you would be at your hotel by about 10 pm, in time to actually get to sleep. The flight duration is 19 hours, which is better than many of the other routes (like via Seoul) which take 22-23 hours. If you are not tied to a particular airline for miles, then those might work well. (I would put in a vote for spending time in Hong Kong, but you only have a short visit, and September is fairly rainy in Hong Kong as well.)
4. As rhkkmk has mentioned, and as you know, September is the rainy season in Phuket. And I don’t mean the odd rainy day. I mean it could pour rain <i>continuously</i> for your whole time there. Look at sites like weatherbase.com where you will see that the average amount of rain for Phuket in September is 16 inches. Wisconsin gets about 30 inches all year (in the heaviest rainfall moths, this still is only 3-4 inch per month), so 16 inches in one month is a <i>lot</i> of rain. If it is not raining, chances are it will be quite overcast with heavy clouds. The other thing with the monsoon season is that surf is rougher, due to the winds, which can be a real issue at the JW Marriott where surf is rough to begin with. (Have the kids stick to the pools for swimming.) Can also be an issue if you take a kayak trip. Finally, snorkeling is not as good due to a combination of wind and overcast conditions. Of course you could luck out and get great weather for your time there, but the odds are against you. If it pours rain for 4 days, which is quite possible, your kids are going to be bored out of their minds – on top of jet lag. (Adults can read books, shop and drink, not so much for the kids.)
Do bear in mind that Bangkok and Chiang Mai are going to have a fair bit of rain as well, but as it is not a beach, this is not as much of an issue, IMO.
5. Therefore I am going to suggest that you strongly consider skipping Phuket as far as you and your kids are concerned. I would just let the DH go and you could take the kids elsewhere. Sounds crazy perhaps, and I know you want a family vacation, but it may really be the best thing to do. You could take the kids to Chiang Mai, and then your DH could join you there or meet up with you in Bangkok. If you want a beach, then while DH in is Phuket, you could go to Hua Hin or Koh Samui, on the east coast which is drier in September. While 3 kids on your own may be not your idea of a fun vacation, I would think that 5 days in the pouring rain with bored kids is not really an attractive alternative…
6. Another thought is for you to fly out separately with the kids <i>after</i> your husband’s conference and meet up in Bangkok or Chiang Mai. You would all then have 8-10 days in Thailand. Perhaps the thought of taking 3 kids on a long flight on your own is daunting, but this may work very well. I don’t know what your kids school schedule is, but if you could move the trip out by about a week to September 17-27 that might be a good way to do this trip as a family.
7. Another alternative which may work is to go to Chiang Mai first as a family rather than Bangkok first. There is a Thai Airways flight from Bangkok to Chiang Mai which departs at 9:30 pm, and I think you would be able to make that if you take the flight via Hong Kong mentioned above. This may take some mental fortitude to board your third flight in 24 hours or so, but may be workable. The flight is only about an hour, so no long-haul issues. I believe you could make this connection time-wise, but can’t guarantee it. If you do this, you would have 3 days in Chiang Mai with the DH, and he could go to Phuket, while you perhaps stay on 1-2 days more and then go to Bangkok. You could meet up in Bangkok; your husband would have a shorter time there but should be OK. You could of course go to Chiang Mai first and then Phuket together, skipping Bangkok entirely.
8. From what I have seen in Phuket, the elephant rides are very canned. The elephants were imported only for the tourists, as to the best of my knowledge, they were never used as work animals on Phuket. Your kids may find them a bit grim and disappointing. Perhaps others have better experiences to relate, but that has been my experience with elephants in Phuket. IMO going to Chiang Mai or Chiang Rai would make more sense if elephants are a priority.
9. Otherwise, if you go to Phuket with your DH, bring a lot of board games, DVDs and have plenty of alternative (indoor) activities in mind. I would not stay there any longer than the conference is planned to last, but would go to other (drier) places quickly.
Nov 25th, 2010, 10:09 PM
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In 6 trips to Phuket over the past 12 years, all of which have been in the rainy season, from August to October, for time frames from 1-4 weeks, I have only had one day completely ruined bt rain. There have been many heavy shower's, some lasting half a day, some an hour or two, but these days have also been interspersed with plenty of sunshine. The bulk of the precipitation comes down hard and quickly. My wife has never come home without a "killer" tan.
I have kids the age of your 2 older ones and have been there with them 4 times. We never run out of thing for them to do. Both my boys, however, are not big fans of Bangkok. They cant wait to get away and get to the Islands and happy kids make for a happy holiday.
Perhaps, for the wildlife experience, you could get Tong to take you for a day trip to Kachanuburi. Read my previous trip report...http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...-of-smiles.cfm for a run down of the day (Day 1:June 1st) that my kids still say was one of the best days of their lives.
After that, maybe one more day in Bangkok and then straight to Phuket. Your time frame doesn't lend itself to any more than this, you will spend too much time travelling.
Take the kids Sea Kayaking through Phang Na Bay, one of the Natural Wonders of the world. You can do a half day to Coral Island for a spot of snorkelling, or if you can afford to charter a speed boat, go to Phi-Phi for some fabulous snorkelling in the surrounding reefs, I would avoid the mass transport Phi-Phi day trips as they are too crowded and rushed.
As well as this, Phuket has movie cinema's, bowling alleys and amusement parlours that will keep the kids occupied if the weather turns nasty. My kids love doing things like this in Thailand as they get amused by some of the "quirky" little differences that this activities have from doing them at home.
You could consider moving beaches after the conference and spending some time at Kata Beach, which tends to be a little more protected from the worst of the monsoon swells. This is a lovely place that is lively enough, without all the bustle and sleeze of Patong and it will have fabulous deals on accomodation at that time of year. It is alos close to Kok Chang Elephant Safari, by far the best place to ride these beasts whilst in Phuket, but not as good as the Elephant Baths near Kachanuburi.
If you have any other specific questions, I am more than happy to help.
I have kids the age of your 2 older ones and have been there with them 4 times. We never run out of thing for them to do. Both my boys, however, are not big fans of Bangkok. They cant wait to get away and get to the Islands and happy kids make for a happy holiday.
Perhaps, for the wildlife experience, you could get Tong to take you for a day trip to Kachanuburi. Read my previous trip report...http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...-of-smiles.cfm for a run down of the day (Day 1:June 1st) that my kids still say was one of the best days of their lives.
After that, maybe one more day in Bangkok and then straight to Phuket. Your time frame doesn't lend itself to any more than this, you will spend too much time travelling.
Take the kids Sea Kayaking through Phang Na Bay, one of the Natural Wonders of the world. You can do a half day to Coral Island for a spot of snorkelling, or if you can afford to charter a speed boat, go to Phi-Phi for some fabulous snorkelling in the surrounding reefs, I would avoid the mass transport Phi-Phi day trips as they are too crowded and rushed.
As well as this, Phuket has movie cinema's, bowling alleys and amusement parlours that will keep the kids occupied if the weather turns nasty. My kids love doing things like this in Thailand as they get amused by some of the "quirky" little differences that this activities have from doing them at home.
You could consider moving beaches after the conference and spending some time at Kata Beach, which tends to be a little more protected from the worst of the monsoon swells. This is a lovely place that is lively enough, without all the bustle and sleeze of Patong and it will have fabulous deals on accomodation at that time of year. It is alos close to Kok Chang Elephant Safari, by far the best place to ride these beasts whilst in Phuket, but not as good as the Elephant Baths near Kachanuburi.
If you have any other specific questions, I am more than happy to help.
Nov 25th, 2010, 10:40 PM
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I agree that it is possible to have good weather in Phuket in September. I would certainly hope that would be the case for the OP if she chooses to go there. But for every good story you have, I can tell you one where it rained every day....that is the problem with the rainy season. It is unpredictable, as opposed to January when you know it will be lovely every day. If this were my trip, and it were September, I would not go to Phuket.
Nov 26th, 2010, 11:59 AM
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We've stayed in Phuket twice in late August and had fine wwather with some afternoon showers - no days rained out. We've stayed once for the New Year and had a totally rained out day and several days with some ran. You can't count on the weather regardless of time of year. And if it rains it's not really a big deal IMO.
The JW Phuket has some very good activities. Circus and trapeze for kids are outstanding. They also offer walking on water at the adjacent Marriott Mai Khao - golf carts will drive you over if you like. The kds club offers some interesting crafts too, that adults can also do. For adults they have a good gym, yoga, bicycle rentals... Huts on the beach offer ok massage at a fraction of the cost of the spa.
The thing about the JW, and perhaps the only thing about it, is that the prices they charge for everything are very high. Even with a great off season room rate, bring lots of money for food and bev and activities (circus, trapeze, crafts all are charged). BreakfAst, if not included, was 650 baht per person in 2009. Circus and trapeze I think were 1000 baht per person per session. Tuna sandwich 300 baht. It will add up fast with 5 of you. A low budget holiday destination it is not.
There is a small supermarket in the nearby Turtle Village shopping center. The Coffee Club restaurant and Bill Bentley pub there offer decent food for about 1/2 the price of the resort. There are some shops, including a Jim Thompson.
The beach is beautiful, but unsafe for swimming for much of the year, including September. There will be red flags and swimming in the sea should be avoided because of dangerous rip tides. Collecting shells and walking on the beach is nice, and there is a little place on the beach that sells cheap drinks and a small variety of food.
The hotel grounds are huge and beautifully landscaped and cared for. The three pools are also beautiful. Yout kids might really enjoy the novelty of eating their lunch in the water at the sweim up bar in the blue pool.
There is a lot to do, even if the weather isn't perfect. The resort, aside from my issues with prices, really is very nice, especially if Your kids participate in the circus activities - that really is the only reason we went, both times, and it really is outstanding. If your kids don't have interest in that, the kids club has a pool table and ping pong, movies, video games, a pretty good play area for younger kids. Be aware that supervision is loose, and Even if you sign your kids in (optional) they can still leave without you even though they shouldn't be able to... Maybe a case of too many kids in and out and too few staff to keep track of who is free to cone and go and who is supposed to stAy until picked up. It's a good club, just don't count on them for keeping track of your youngest.
The JW Phuket has some very good activities. Circus and trapeze for kids are outstanding. They also offer walking on water at the adjacent Marriott Mai Khao - golf carts will drive you over if you like. The kds club offers some interesting crafts too, that adults can also do. For adults they have a good gym, yoga, bicycle rentals... Huts on the beach offer ok massage at a fraction of the cost of the spa.
The thing about the JW, and perhaps the only thing about it, is that the prices they charge for everything are very high. Even with a great off season room rate, bring lots of money for food and bev and activities (circus, trapeze, crafts all are charged). BreakfAst, if not included, was 650 baht per person in 2009. Circus and trapeze I think were 1000 baht per person per session. Tuna sandwich 300 baht. It will add up fast with 5 of you. A low budget holiday destination it is not.
There is a small supermarket in the nearby Turtle Village shopping center. The Coffee Club restaurant and Bill Bentley pub there offer decent food for about 1/2 the price of the resort. There are some shops, including a Jim Thompson.
The beach is beautiful, but unsafe for swimming for much of the year, including September. There will be red flags and swimming in the sea should be avoided because of dangerous rip tides. Collecting shells and walking on the beach is nice, and there is a little place on the beach that sells cheap drinks and a small variety of food.
The hotel grounds are huge and beautifully landscaped and cared for. The three pools are also beautiful. Yout kids might really enjoy the novelty of eating their lunch in the water at the sweim up bar in the blue pool.
There is a lot to do, even if the weather isn't perfect. The resort, aside from my issues with prices, really is very nice, especially if Your kids participate in the circus activities - that really is the only reason we went, both times, and it really is outstanding. If your kids don't have interest in that, the kids club has a pool table and ping pong, movies, video games, a pretty good play area for younger kids. Be aware that supervision is loose, and Even if you sign your kids in (optional) they can still leave without you even though they shouldn't be able to... Maybe a case of too many kids in and out and too few staff to keep track of who is free to cone and go and who is supposed to stAy until picked up. It's a good club, just don't count on them for keeping track of your youngest.
Nov 26th, 2010, 07:34 PM
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since kim has been there the property has now added 2 more hotels a renaissance and an anantara, plus there are at least two sections of marriott timeshare there.... it is a busy place but never do you feel it is too busy..
i had lunch there at the deli last week and there were only 3 or 4 groups in the deli... it is expensive, but not outrageous... plus it is all quality food..
i had lunch there at the deli last week and there were only 3 or 4 groups in the deli... it is expensive, but not outrageous... plus it is all quality food..
Nov 26th, 2010, 08:04 PM
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We were last there in August 2009. The Anantara and Mai Khao were open. You can see menu prices for the restaurants there on the website. The prices are very high, more than the Peninsula in Bangkok. For me and 2 twelve year olds, over five days we spent $1500 in addition to room charge with breakfast included....on activities, lunch and dinner. No alcohol. No excursions. That's $100 per person per day. That's a lot for light lunch and not special dinners and circus stuff. It would be very, very easy to spend more per person by adding cocktails and fancier meals.
It's not a bad place. It is an expensive place, and it does bother me that their pricing is so far above local pricing and beats out prices at true luxury hotels. They have a captive audience and milk it for all they can, and Im not crazy about that business model. It is a really fun place for kids though.
It's not a bad place. It is an expensive place, and it does bother me that their pricing is so far above local pricing and beats out prices at true luxury hotels. They have a captive audience and milk it for all they can, and Im not crazy about that business model. It is a really fun place for kids though.
Nov 27th, 2010, 07:49 PM
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It bothers me too Kim. I try not to stay anywhere that is too isolated for that very reason. I know that it is still cheaper than 5 star resort food at home, BUT when I can have a fantastic Thai feast for less than 500 baht for the 4 of us at a little "Mum and Dad", Hole-in-the-wall type place with plastic chairs and buckets of charm, why would I consider paying 300baht for a Tuna Sandwich? I would also prefer to wash it down with a 60baht beer rather than one at 3 times that price!!
It is not just the hole that it puts in our holiday budget, but I also prefer to support and partronize locally owned businesses rather than being fleeced by multi-nationals. There are so many nice hotels that are located nearby dozens of these inexpensive eating choices that I will always make it an absolute priority that where we stay is positioned in such a way.
It is not just the hole that it puts in our holiday budget, but I also prefer to support and partronize locally owned businesses rather than being fleeced by multi-nationals. There are so many nice hotels that are located nearby dozens of these inexpensive eating choices that I will always make it an absolute priority that where we stay is positioned in such a way.
Nov 28th, 2010, 06:02 PM
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Thanks for all the information. It definitely has my husband and I thinking and doing more research. As a family, we do want to stick together for the entire trip so we will all be going to the JW Marriott in Phuket. The good news is that the company provides at least 2 meals per day for us during the conference so that helps with our budget. Any additional info that you have on local restaurants and activities (I know we are in a rather remote location) would be appreciated. The meals we are responsible for we would like to eat off of property and support the locals (I share your frustrations with high prices at resorts). After our stay in Phuket we will be heading up to Bangkok for a few days (yet to deterine how many...probably 4 1/2) so I would also welcome your ideas on things to do up there, restaurants and hotels. I did a little checking on hotels recommended - the marriott sukhumvit park apartments look great (nice to have kitchen and laundry).
Thanks to everyone!!
Tara
Thanks to everyone!!
Tara
Nov 28th, 2010, 07:09 PM
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Non-resort restaurants within walking distance are few. There are the two I mentioned in the Turtle Village and the single place along the beach. The other resorts are options but priced the same. We ate at the Marriott Mai Khao one day and were able to charge to our room. There is a place about 5 minutes drive that a woman who used to be a chef at the Thai restaurant at the JW - the first time we stayed she was our cooking class teacher - anyway it is supposed to be quite good and about half the price of hotel dining. You need a car or taxi. Short trips were charged at 1500 baht last year when we were ther, making a rental car a good option to consider if you plan on going out a lot.
The John Gray Sea Canoe trip is one we enjoyed very much a few years ago. We were staying in Khao Lak at the time and they picked us up there so I can't imagine pickup from the JW Phuket would present any trouble. My daughter and I went horseback riding on the beach in the Laguna area. There is only one place but I forget the name. They had free pickup and dropoff for us. The horses were nice and appeared to be well cared for. I was a serious rider when I was young but my daughter had very limited experience. They catered very well to both of us.
In Bangkok, we have enjoyed Koh Kred, the floating market (we enjoyed this far more with Tong than on our own), the Jim Thompson house, klong tour on a longtail boat, the Grand Palace, amulet market, wandering through Chinatown...there is a lot to do. If you are shoppers (we are not) you will find plenty of that.
The John Gray Sea Canoe trip is one we enjoyed very much a few years ago. We were staying in Khao Lak at the time and they picked us up there so I can't imagine pickup from the JW Phuket would present any trouble. My daughter and I went horseback riding on the beach in the Laguna area. There is only one place but I forget the name. They had free pickup and dropoff for us. The horses were nice and appeared to be well cared for. I was a serious rider when I was young but my daughter had very limited experience. They catered very well to both of us.
In Bangkok, we have enjoyed Koh Kred, the floating market (we enjoyed this far more with Tong than on our own), the Jim Thompson house, klong tour on a longtail boat, the Grand Palace, amulet market, wandering through Chinatown...there is a lot to do. If you are shoppers (we are not) you will find plenty of that.
Nov 28th, 2010, 07:18 PM
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Sorry to high-jack this thread, but when I read posts like "support locals, don't eat in hotels", the lack of understanding reflected in such a statement almost demands a response. "Locals" work in hotels as well. The waiter, the cook and they guy who cleans the dishes are all locals. The guy who runs, and the guy who installed, the computer system which tallied your bill or processed your credit card payment is a local. And of course the suppliers of the food are all local as well.
They depend on those wages. And hotel wages are generally better than what could be earned elsewhere. And they often have benefits like health care which they would not get elsewhere. Local people <i>line up</i> for those jobs.
It is also important to note that those "multi-nationals", like Marriott, don't own the hotels which operate under their brands. They only manage them for a fee. The owners are "locals", just like the owner of the neighborhood restaurant. So you <i>are</i> supporting "locals" when you eat in a hotel restaurant. You may not like the prices, but those are charged even by hotels which are not part of big chains (like Mom Tru's Boathouse) andy by more upscale independent restaurants.
The notion of going to an independent restaurant, rather than a hotel restaurant, in the hopes of supporting smaller, family-owned business rather than large Thai corporations is a bit more supportable by the facts. But as both employ locals, I am not sure one is really better than the other. Thai corporations employ “locals”. Those which are publically-owned offer value to their shareholders, virtually all of whom are "locals". And of course many Thai corporations, and Asian corps generally, are actually owned and controlled by a single family, so who is to say you are not supporting a family business by eating at the Banyan Tree. And virtually all of thoese "multi-nationals" like Marriott are also publically-owned, and provide jobs, as well as shareholder value, to people where you live (and possibly to your 401K). By eating in a hotel restaurant, you may in fact be helping your neighbor in the US who works for Hyatt. Talk about supporting locals…..
They depend on those wages. And hotel wages are generally better than what could be earned elsewhere. And they often have benefits like health care which they would not get elsewhere. Local people <i>line up</i> for those jobs.
It is also important to note that those "multi-nationals", like Marriott, don't own the hotels which operate under their brands. They only manage them for a fee. The owners are "locals", just like the owner of the neighborhood restaurant. So you <i>are</i> supporting "locals" when you eat in a hotel restaurant. You may not like the prices, but those are charged even by hotels which are not part of big chains (like Mom Tru's Boathouse) andy by more upscale independent restaurants.
The notion of going to an independent restaurant, rather than a hotel restaurant, in the hopes of supporting smaller, family-owned business rather than large Thai corporations is a bit more supportable by the facts. But as both employ locals, I am not sure one is really better than the other. Thai corporations employ “locals”. Those which are publically-owned offer value to their shareholders, virtually all of whom are "locals". And of course many Thai corporations, and Asian corps generally, are actually owned and controlled by a single family, so who is to say you are not supporting a family business by eating at the Banyan Tree. And virtually all of thoese "multi-nationals" like Marriott are also publically-owned, and provide jobs, as well as shareholder value, to people where you live (and possibly to your 401K). By eating in a hotel restaurant, you may in fact be helping your neighbor in the US who works for Hyatt. Talk about supporting locals…..
Nov 28th, 2010, 10:35 PM
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I wonder if the "Turkish" Chef at the Olive restaraunt in the JW Marriott in Kho Lak is a "local". Or how about the American GM at the same hotel that Bob has been staying at. I wonder how their wages compare to Thai waiter or kitchen hand. How locally produced is the New Zealand Grain Fed Beef being served there? How much of the Marriott "management fee" go's back into the local economy.
I "understand" how things are Cicerone and do realise that these Hotels do provide employment and investment but I still choose to eat, primarily, at small, owner/operated businesses. Just because I disagree with something you say gives you no right to talk down to me.
I "understand" how things are Cicerone and do realise that these Hotels do provide employment and investment but I still choose to eat, primarily, at small, owner/operated businesses. Just because I disagree with something you say gives you no right to talk down to me.
Nov 28th, 2010, 11:32 PM
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Out of a hotel which probably employs 300-500 people, to pick 1 or 2 are even 10 who may not be Thai nationals is a little disingenuous as well as misleading. It’s a very small number out of all the people employed.
Of course a chef de cuisine or a GM are paid more than a waiter or a housekeeper; but that has nothing to do with their nationality, it is their skill set. That is true in any country. There are Thai head chefs and Thai GMs (and Thai accountants and Thai lawyers, etc) who are paid a similar wage as the foreigners are. In some cases, a truly skilled expat may get some other benefits, like housing, but in today’s economy hotels and other multi-national businesses can’t afford to hire large numbers of expats, nor do they need to as the local skill set is good. (And don’t discount the notion that is the local owners who require an American or European GM, as they want to put an international “face” on their hotel.) And of course those people pay income taxes in Thailand, as well as rent and living costs, so they support the local economy just as much as an other resident. (And the ones from the US also pay US income tax, so they support <i>two</i> economies.)
And I agree that New Zealand grain-fed beef does not support the local economy in Thailand any more than it does anywhere but NZ. I would first say you that should take a good close look at where the beef in that local restaurant has come from, it may surprise you. And of course you can’t compare a hotel steak house with a small Thai restaurant, as the cuisine is quite different (as are the expectations of the customers). You can perhaps compare a Thai restaurant in a hotel with a Thai restaurant operated independently. The main difference you most likely will find there is price (and perhaps quality).
I don’t know how much of a management fee made by Starwood or other hotel management companies is spent locally. They certainly pay Thai income tax on it. What else they do with the profit I would think would be up to them. The notion that a local Thai owner is somehow going to be more altruistic is not supported by evidence that I have seen. It is the multi-nationals that have the community programs for the most part, not the independent restaurants (Cabbages and Condoms notwithstanding).
I agree that everyone should be free to do whatever they feel comfortable doing in terms of what business they may choose to patronize. My point is that I don’t believe the facts support any kind of belief that locally-owned hotels operated by multi-nationals don’t support the local economy.
Of course a chef de cuisine or a GM are paid more than a waiter or a housekeeper; but that has nothing to do with their nationality, it is their skill set. That is true in any country. There are Thai head chefs and Thai GMs (and Thai accountants and Thai lawyers, etc) who are paid a similar wage as the foreigners are. In some cases, a truly skilled expat may get some other benefits, like housing, but in today’s economy hotels and other multi-national businesses can’t afford to hire large numbers of expats, nor do they need to as the local skill set is good. (And don’t discount the notion that is the local owners who require an American or European GM, as they want to put an international “face” on their hotel.) And of course those people pay income taxes in Thailand, as well as rent and living costs, so they support the local economy just as much as an other resident. (And the ones from the US also pay US income tax, so they support <i>two</i> economies.)
And I agree that New Zealand grain-fed beef does not support the local economy in Thailand any more than it does anywhere but NZ. I would first say you that should take a good close look at where the beef in that local restaurant has come from, it may surprise you. And of course you can’t compare a hotel steak house with a small Thai restaurant, as the cuisine is quite different (as are the expectations of the customers). You can perhaps compare a Thai restaurant in a hotel with a Thai restaurant operated independently. The main difference you most likely will find there is price (and perhaps quality).
I don’t know how much of a management fee made by Starwood or other hotel management companies is spent locally. They certainly pay Thai income tax on it. What else they do with the profit I would think would be up to them. The notion that a local Thai owner is somehow going to be more altruistic is not supported by evidence that I have seen. It is the multi-nationals that have the community programs for the most part, not the independent restaurants (Cabbages and Condoms notwithstanding).
I agree that everyone should be free to do whatever they feel comfortable doing in terms of what business they may choose to patronize. My point is that I don’t believe the facts support any kind of belief that locally-owned hotels operated by multi-nationals don’t support the local economy.
Nov 29th, 2010, 02:04 AM
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i agree with cicc.... at both hotels there are hundreds of people, local people, who would be without work if these hotels were not there..
you need not choose these hotels to stay in, there are tons of others.... way cheaper options... some even with no a/c...
but the lux afforded by these hotels, not only in their offerings, but in their manicured beach, their fabulous flowers and flowering shrubs, etc, etc. would not be there for you. the free kids club... the glasses of cold water delivered to your beach chair---all of this costs $$...
i get very tired of the constant beating of the big guy, the expensive guy, the fat cat... most all of this happened because of their personal hard work and drive and dedication---and yes they probably receive big bonuses too...
i wish i had not written any of this but.....
you need not choose these hotels to stay in, there are tons of others.... way cheaper options... some even with no a/c...
but the lux afforded by these hotels, not only in their offerings, but in their manicured beach, their fabulous flowers and flowering shrubs, etc, etc. would not be there for you. the free kids club... the glasses of cold water delivered to your beach chair---all of this costs $$...
i get very tired of the constant beating of the big guy, the expensive guy, the fat cat... most all of this happened because of their personal hard work and drive and dedication---and yes they probably receive big bonuses too...
i wish i had not written any of this but.....
Nov 29th, 2010, 10:49 AM
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My advice to Tara was never designed to discourage her from staying there. Why should she? She is there with her family for a conference staying at a stunning resort with the bulk of their costs being paid for by someone else. She has also stated that she will indeed try to eat away from the resort when given the choice.
What I said was, that given a choice, I will always pick a resort or hotel, regardless of whether it is fully Thai owned or not, in a less isolated area so that I can then choose where to eat and drink. MY choice is then to patronize small owner operated 100% local establishments, where I can ensure you, Cicerone, the beef does not come from NZ. Certainly this is obvious from the prices they charge.
If it is YOUR choice to pay 300 baht for a Tuna Sandwich, then go ahead. If you want to justify this based on 50 or even 60% of this going back into the "local" economy, then that is fine. I prefer to stay somewhere where I can decide not to.
What I said was, that given a choice, I will always pick a resort or hotel, regardless of whether it is fully Thai owned or not, in a less isolated area so that I can then choose where to eat and drink. MY choice is then to patronize small owner operated 100% local establishments, where I can ensure you, Cicerone, the beef does not come from NZ. Certainly this is obvious from the prices they charge.
If it is YOUR choice to pay 300 baht for a Tuna Sandwich, then go ahead. If you want to justify this based on 50 or even 60% of this going back into the "local" economy, then that is fine. I prefer to stay somewhere where I can decide not to.
