dogster

Yup, Marija, big time. But, like I say, one has no choice but to file it away. I found the whole evening left a tremendously nasty taste in my mouth for ages - but for a number of reasons - not the least of which was my horror at finding myself in the 'dirty old man' situation. That's when I spun out - because that's exactly what I looked like. So there was much food for thought at the prurient nature of some of my explorations in India. Like Craig says: No need to top yourself, this time...

Yes, thursday, it was only once the kids came into the equation that I spun out. There was no warning. Then the Devil sprang into sudden focus - and I sprang into focus. Whoa! Get out of here, right now! If Ifte had had his way, we would have jumped ship in the street of whores.

I can enter into all these situations with complete impunity once it's established that I'm not buying. I recognise they have every right in the world to sell - but I'm not buying. It's as simple as that.

Everybody loves to talk about themselves and love it when someone is actually interested. They are rarely interested in my life once we've established I'm not a customer - but they will sit and chat about theirs. Everybody does in India.

I do confess that my Fodor's enthusiasm has led me into some odd situations. The odder it is, the more interesting to write about. So I've been reflecting on Craig's choice of 'sordid' to describe the story. It hadn't occured to be to use that word, although it's entirely appropriate. 'Sordid' seems to imply a sense of my moral superiority and I don't go into that zone when I'm in India.

I never thought it was sordid, but of course, it was. I realise that I don't think of anything as sordid any more. lol. Oh dear. There are quite a few things in this world that I really would rather not know about, quite a lot that I don't want to do - but I can't bring myself to judge anymore. Not in India, anyway. I have no trouble judging in my own culture but I'm so aware that, in India, there is layer after layer of stuff that I can only guess at making my ability to judge entirely suspect.

How am I to unpack my thoughts with the little boy at the end? It's a total no-win.

Yup, Kathie - that's why I took time to get to the crunch. Hopefully, the last part puts the others in perspective. I really did have a great hijra-fixer. He undertook to show me the hijra - and he did.

The Devil showed me the seven ages of a hijra life. From reject in the villages to child princess in the city. From princess to chelo to hijra; beggar or dancer or whore. From hijra through castration to nirwaan hijra, guru, bully, Queen Bee.

None of them chose their path... yet each of them had a special strength because of that AND a special sadness. I think, with some people, that can fuse into a bitter melancholy, a rare force that corrupts everything it touches. Maybe that's the truth of the hijra curse.

offwego

There are so many things I want to say to this, but keep typing and deleting, so nevermind.

I'll just say being a full time anthropologist is a tough job. I hope you are home getting some rest from your vacation.

travelaw

You went to the heart of darkness dogster. Pure evil. It is not every day that you see it so boldly on display. And, like you, once I see it affecting children, I see nothing but red. I've been exposed to lots of bad people doing lots of bad stuff (in court, of course), but when the bad stuff is perpetrated upon a child, I will stop at nothing to see the perp punished to the fullest extent possible. Using and abusing children for lust, revenge, or merely to make money, is the lowest of low.
My heart breaks reading this. The poor little lambs ~ God love them.

Gpanda

The existence of evil is a disturbing reality. Our western "What goes around comes around" and "Things always work out for the best" are naive concepts fostered by our sheltered lives. Bad things happen. Bad people exist. Darkness has no heart.

indianapearl

Sexual abuse of children is not restricted to India or any other developing country. It happens right here in the good old U. S. of A. and every other first world country, every day and every hour. Poverty is the driving factor. Everyone has to make a buck-rupee to live. If we can work to tackle that problem, perhaps someday there will a reduction in such atrocities. Until then, it will continue. My son is an elementary school teacher in an inner city school is a big city. The stories he tells us about the lives of his students breaks my heart, but he recommits every day to be kind to them and to teach them. I couldn't possibly do what he does.

LAleslie

Wow, this makes "Slumdog Millionaire" look like a Disney story. It's the background of a novel. I've just finished reading "White Tiger" and thought it really captured a slice of India, but this is closer to the aforementioned "Bangkok 8" for well, yes, sordidness. (I haven't heard of "City of the Djinn", Amy, but I'm headed straight for it.) The sex-trade business in these wretchedly desperate countries knows no bounds. Of course, as a woman I don't find emasculation of the physiological kind any more horrifying than what's done phisically and mentally to little girls. It's still about stealing souls.
It's fascinating to hear how intepid travelers like yourself get into scary circumstances and try to figure out how to extricate themselves.
Good thing someone with a camera phone didn't stumble on you and the boys in the alley or your perverted mug might be on the Internet now! (Sorry, I needed a little comic relief.)
You're a gifted storyteller, my friend. I'm guessing you're a pro.

dogster

'Good thing someone with a camera phone didn't stumble on you and the boys in the alley or your perverted mug might be on the Internet now!'

My thoughts entirely. That's when I lost it - if I'm to be honest, not because of the growing realisation that I was in the presence of evil, but because I felt in danger - of exactly that.

I'm with trav: lock 'em up and throw away the key. So, I ask myself, confronted with our imaginery dirty Dogster picture, just what would trav do? There aren't many words that could explain THAT image away. Travelaw would do just like me - make every effort to bag the perp.

indianapearl is exactly right: sexual abuse of children is endemic everywhere - but this particular situation, mixed as it is with superstition, hijra curses, ceremony and fear, I think, is peculiarly Indian. Perhaps others know differently.

LAleslie makes the point that as a woman, she is not as concerned with the castration part of the equation. I can assure you that, as a MAN, this topic has a certain piquancy.

As all women know, man have a certain fondness for their little appendages. For Ifte the single most horrific thing about the night was the destruction of the 'manhood'. I can see where he's coming from, lol. Little Dogster and I have been firm friends for years. To think of him being cut off... arghh-h-h-h. So bear with me, LA on that topic. It's a man thing.

But your basic point is 100% correct. 'Stealing souls...' How perfectly put.

I like Gpanda's point: there IS no heart in that darkness. I hadn't thought of that. Maybe that was Joseph Conrad's point.

'It's fascinating to hear how intepid travelers like yourself get into scary circumstances and try to figure out how to extricate themselves...' LAleslie

Substitute 'stupid' for 'intrepid'.

It's all anthropology to me - but like offwego says: it's hard work being an anthropologist sometimes. There's a cut-off point. After this little experience I decided not to go on any more adventures to the dark side.

Of course, I comprehensively failed...

live42day

That is exactly what I was thinking LAleslie as I was reading this, that the tv show 20 20's 'To Catch a Predator' or similar could have set up a sting operation.
I was feeling sick to my stomach reading this, but none the less it was very well written and thanks for having the courage to write and post it Dogster.

dogster

Thanks Live - I'm glad somebody thought it was brave. I thought long and hard before committing this to the internet. Even when I was half-way thru I was uncertain whether to put the last chapter in this post. I could have stopped it as we were leaving Bloody Mary's house - none of you would have been any the wiser and we could all have walked away...

Except I can still hear that kid at the end...

'Uncle, ple-e-e-ease...'

LAleslie

Why would you NOT post this experience? We need to know more of the world, not less. To gloss over reality is cowardly. I, for one, seek fewer romantic trip reports.
I just got back from a 35-day cruise, Hong Kong to Athens. It was almost as weird, in an entirely different way, as dogster's experience. A MISTAKE that you won't read on Cruise Critic, or this cruise forum, or elsewhere.
But as we sailed away from Mangalore, all I could think of was, "These poor wretches who were doomed to be born into these circumstances."

dogster

Well, LAleslie, then you are going to enjoy my next [but one] story - all about my fabulous 24 day cruise on the Azamara Quest - Singapore to Athens - departing April 7. Were you on that too? Probably not, as you mention Mangalore - but we have had similar recent experiences, I see.

I found it so weird, so relentlessly peculiar, that I didn't quite last the distance... but I'd love to hear ALL about your adventure. Your words: 'To gloss over reality is cowardly. I, for one, seek fewer romantic trip reports.' Why not write it?

Dunno about the 'those poor wretches bit...', though. You know, in the midst of all of this, there's a billion Indians, full of love and life and energy - it ain't all poverty, abuse and horror. There's a huge swathe of Indian people, largely invisible, who live perfectly good lives - it's just that, as a visitor/tourist one tends to see the horrible bit first of all. Those are the hustlers, the hasslers, the Jimmys and the beggars. They are in your face - and it takes a while to focus and get past that.

Sometimes in India I think WE are the poor wretches...

indianapearl

William Dalrymple writes eloquently about India and Pakistan. I was reading "The Age of Kali" when Benazir Bhutto was assassinated -- gave me a shiver about his prescience. I have "The City of Djinns" on the waiting list at the local library.

Have any of you heard about the devidasas? They are usually low caste girls who, when they reach puberty, are "married" to a god, actual ceremony, with the priest(s) fulfilling the role of the bridegroom. They then become basically temple prostitutes, although the priest may reserve her for a rich patron. Another instance of religious sanctioned child abuse. It's forbidden by the government, but no doubt is still practiced in rural areas, especially Andrha Pradesh.

dogster

Thank you indiana: you provided me with the very word I've been trying to remember for weeks. Serendipity. I have a mysterious devidasi story coming up in a while. Murder most foul. I think the plural is devidasa [no 's'] and the singular is devidasi - but Dogster is famously wrong on most things Hindi.

Craig

Okay, I have sufficiently recovered from the shock of the last tale. So now Dog, since you have given us a little tease with the cruise reference, please continue on with with your next installment.

indianapearl

The devidasa (?) do benefit in many ways. They never will become widows (with all its negative connotations) because the god to whom they are married is eternal. They are not required to serve the families of their spouse. Any children they bear are theirs and not those of the patron. One reference said that this practice is a remnant of the treatment of Buddhist nuns from the period after Hinduism reasserted itself in India when Buddhism waned, that they were a financial burden for the temples they served and had to earn their living.

dogster

lol Craig - what a ssssensitive fellow you are. I'll try and come up with something jolly for you.

I'm writing the tribal piece now - but remember, my friend, these things take a little time. Sometimes I have to get to the end before I know what the piece is actually about - then I have to go back to the beginning.

I can find hardly anything in Google about the devidasa, indiana. What source are you using?

Marija

Dogster, thank you so much for letting us tag along with you on your travels. Your extraordinary writing transports us from the routines of our daily lifes to exotic places where we never know what awaits us--tears, laughter or just plain old disbelief. You do have a nose for sniffing out adventure...

Marija

An interesting piece on devadasa from the New Yorker:
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...fact_dalrymple

Many references at the end of the wikipedia article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devadasi

MaryW

Hi Dogster, I'm going to miss you stories for a couple of weeks - I'll check in when I can but will save up for a good read by the camp fire when I'm back. I'll be lurching there in spirit.

indianapearl

"Maya," a film by Digvijay Singh made in 2001 or so, was shown at a film festival in NY shortly after it was made. Although I didn't attend the film festival, I did rent the film a couple of years ago. At the time, I did some Google searches. Some Indian Hindus were quite upset about the film, others supportive of the film makers.