nomadwoman

Hi Wiselindag, Great trip report. I was wondering if you could give me the location of the Da Dong restaurant and which mall, and where that mall is, for the DTF restaurant. Thanks alot!!

wiselindag

Thank you, Nomadwoman. Here is the information you requested:

There are two Dadong Restaurants.
The address we went to is Tuanjiehu Beikou, Dongsanhuan Road, Chaoyang District,
Phone number - 6582 2892/4003

And there are also two DTF Restaurants.
The address for the one we used is 6th Floor, Shin Kong Plaza, Jian Guo Road 87#, Chaoyang District.
Phone number - 65305888.

I had to check with Violet, since I had no idea exactly where we went... just that the food was good!

I'll try to finish the report this week.

rebecca_in_china

Hi Linda, it seems that you did great shopping in Beijing,how wonderful!
Have you been to the Forbidden City and the Great Wall? I didn't notice that part in your report.I think almost everyone will go there if they are in Beijing.

Violet_1125

What a great report it is! I enjoy it very much.
Yes,this is the address of Dadong Restaurant(for Peking Duck)and DTF(for Dim sum)Restrant we went to.
And there are two Dadong Retaurants and two DTF Restaurants in Beijing.
The address of another Dadong Restaurant is :
1-2/F, Nanxincang International Plaza, 22A Dongsishitiao, Dongcheng District.
Tele:8610-51690329

The address of another DTF Restaurant is :
No.24, Xinyuanxili Middle Street , Chaoyang District. (At the northwest corner of the Yu Yang Hotel)
Tele �F 8610-64624502

wiselindag

Rebecca - We went to the Forbidden City on the first day (Saturday, April 12) and the Wall on Monday,April 13. It's true I didn't spend a lot of time describing these two visits because so many people have been there and described them already.

Violet - Thanks for providing the other locations in case anyone wants to use them. I'm glad you like the report. You did a lot to make sure we had a great time in Beijing.

lynclarke

If we ask the hotel to write the name and address, will taxis know where DTF restaurant is? Is it close to the Jian Guo Mao subway stop? We will be staying nearby in the area.

lynclarke

Why I am at it, here are two more questions. What was the name of Violet's favorite Pearl Market store next to the one that wiselindag likes? And, what was the name of the almond/bean curd dessert at the DTF restaurant? Thanks.

Shanghainese

lynclarke -- I think your subway stop in Jian Guo Men, I don't know if it's close to the restaurant.

Almond milk bean curd is pronounced: xing (4th tone) ren (2nd) dou (4th) fu (2nd).

Shanghainese

I meant IS Jian Kuo Men

wiselindag

Violet - I'll leave the answers to you.

Hi Lyn - Is this your first trip to China? I somehow thought you had already been there from your postings way back when, but maybe I just lost track of your travels.

I don't know the name of Violet's store since I didn't buy anything there. They had lovely pearl items; I just didn't need a single thing and what they had at my price point was pretty much what I have at home. I just wasn't interested in more expensive pearl jewelry.

If the mall is written correctly I would think taxis would know it. It's in the same neighborhood as the Acrobat Show we went to and since we were with Kong Lin, he drove us to the mall and Violet "deposited us" in the restaurant.

Shanghainese - Thanks for the help with the name of the dessert. All I know is that they really wanted us to order it, and given how full we were and how big that dessert was, it was out of the question. Now if it had been chocolate, who knows... I might have had to force myself to eat it!

Shanghainese

Well, I haven't seen that dessert in chocolate but have tasted it once coffee flavored. Since I don't drink coffee, it wasn't attractive to me.

Violet_1125

it is very easy for taxi find DTF If your conceirge write the right name.The one we went to with Linda is at east of Jianguomen,about 3 kilometers,which is at Dawanglu,the other one at south-east corner of Dongsishitiao Bridge.both of them you can take subway to there.Subway line 1 to Dawanglu,Subway Line 2 to Dongsishitiao Bridge.but make sure you have the exactly map for it.
My favorite Pearl Market is Fanghua at Pearl Market.They sell very nice,exquisite pearls but not cheap.I expect to Konglin buy a nice one for me one day.HAHA

marksfour

Glad you used the subways...so much faster than a taxi and so efficient.

the crab uterus!...you're right..who knew? haha

I really wish we had gone to China AFTER your report!

wiselindag

Shanghainese - I didn't mean that particular dessert in chocolate... I meant some other dessert in chocolate! Somehow the thought of this one in chocolate doesn't appeal to me...

Marksfour, I got so much out of your trip report that I'm glad you went first! I'm sure there will be a next time for you (and for me) and who knows, maybe some day we'll all go together... wouldn't that be fun??

Violet - Thanks for posting the answers.

More of the trip report will be up shortly - I'm just finishing the last day in Yangshuo...

wiselindag

Part VI - Yangshuo

Wednesday April 16 � We set our alarm for 3:30 so we would be packed and ready for pick-up at 4:30 a.m. Violet and Kong Lin insisted on taking us to the airport, even though it we had a 7:15 flight. This was our first and only visit to the Beijing airport, and we were glad to hear our flight was leaving from the new Terminal 3, which has been written about quite a lot because of its architectural beauty and which had opened only a few months before our visit.

One thing we learned, as horrible as the traffic can be in Beijing, driving at 4:30 in the morning is a snap � no traffic at all. After a quick and easy drive to the airport we were both amazed when Kong Lin drove up to the terminal, parked the car at the curb, and got out to help us with our luggage. Both Kong Lin and Violet wheeled the bags into the terminal and quickly found the correct line on which to stand (here it was a domestic Air China line as opposed to a specific line for our flight). After we got our boarding passes, we said goodbye. It felt sad to say goodbye to both of them. After only a few days they felt like old friends and we had really enjoyed their company.

We found the airport to be spiffy � new and clean (although actually all the airports we visited were clean and people were always walking around with brooms and mops working to keep it that way). We boarded at 6:45 and were on our way on schedule, off to Guilin, where Lily was waiting for us.

Breakfast on the plane was �Eastern or Western.� This time we both opted for Western and got an omelette and hash browns, a croissant with strawberry jam, a fruit cup and a beverage (from the cart). It sounds better than it tasted!

In Guilin the rain was coming down. Why were we often traveling from sunny places to rainy ones on this trip? I must admit it was a little disconcerting to see all that rain in Guilin including big puddles on the runway. Would this rustic sojourn end up being four days of reading in our room? I couldn�t picture us slogging around the countryside if it was rainy and muddy.

Anyway, we deplaned, got our bags, and there was Lilly, holding up a sign and smiling broadly. She quickly called Mr. Tang to say we had arrived and he brought the car to the front of the terminal for our two hour drive to Yangshuo. We passed interesting scenery on the way to the hotel including a herd of water buffalo on the highway. Lilly explained that the locals take turns �driving� them to the area where they graze for lunch. Every family owns a few to help with the plow, but the lunchtime babysitting is a shared activity. We also passed a town in which they make bamboo furniture. Lilly seemed surprised to learn that we had bamboo furniture on our porch when I was growing up � it could have been a problem in miscommunication� I don�t know, but I think she said she thought they only had bamboo furniture in China.

We arrived at the Yangshuo market area just ahead of the �parade of boats,� which start to arrive about 1:00 p.m. after their morning cruise down the Li River from Guilin. Small buggies were lined up along the road and then the street was filled with ladies setting up market stalls for the hordes of tourists. People strolled, seemingly unconcerned as our driver and various taxi drivers honked their way through the crowd, trying to get past town (or into town) before the crowds arrived from the boats and made the road impassable for several hours.

Lucky for us, we just made it in time and arrived at the Li River Retreat, where we stowed our bags in our room and had lunch on the terrace with Lilly. I tried the pizza and DH had a burger (you can see we had tired of Chinese food, not surprising for DH, but very surprising for me since before this trip I didn�t think I would ever tire of Chinese food!) Lilly stuck with the stir fried vegetables. Lunch with two cokes came to 92 RMB.

As we were eating, the first ships passed below us on the river and I was surprised to learn that over 80 make the trip every day, tooting horns as they pass starboard to starboard (this information from DH who was in the Navy), dropping off passengers and traveling empty back to Guilin. The Passengers take buses back as part of their package after several hours of shopping in Guilin.

Check-in had been quick and easy and we were immediately struck by the lovely welcome we received from Luna and Flora. Over the next few days one of our favorite experiences was spending time with the young staff of the Li River Retreat.

We considered going into town, but decided to relax at hotel. Lilly went back to town and we took a nap after our very early wake-up. Then we read, took a walk, and had dinner on the terrace � the most relaxing day of our entire trip and one that was truly restorative. We loved the terrace dining area. While we were there, the workers were busy adding a two story dining room to the hotel, but we didn�t need to eat indoors. When the lanterns were set out, the terrace became magical. We met a couple from Ottawa who had been traveling around Southeast Asia for six months and chatted with them every day since they were at the hotel for the same four days we were there.

For dinner we had Chicken Noodle Soup with delicious noodles, Sweet and Sour Chicken, Green Beans (spicy!) and Steamed Rice, two Cokes and one Tea. The tab was 82 RMB.

After dinner we went up to the roof to look at the bar (very attractive), had a short session on the computer (free to guests in the lobby) and then had an early night. Our room was huge � we booked the deluxe room with views of the karst peaks on three sides and enjoyed the space and the beauty which surrounded us. On the bed we had a duvet (standard issue in every Chinese hotel it would seem) and single pillows (we asked for an extra set and they were brought up quickly). There were two easy chairs and a couple of tables along with a refrigerator, a safe, and a cedar closet. Although there was a robe and two kinds of slippers (fluffy non-disposable ones and shower shoes), I immediately missed my soft Hotel Kapok slippers.


Thursday, April 17 � We arranged a 9:30 a.m. pick-up with Lilly and thought we had plenty of time for breakfast, but the kitchen was extremely slow on the American breakfasts (the Asian ones came quickly, but we had opted for American set breakfasts which included eggs, toast, bacon, and orange juice costing 72 RMB for the two of us.) When Lilly arrived, she said �no problem, no hurry,� so we ate without rushing and then got ready for our long day.

First on the agenda was the Silver Cave. We trekked through the cave behind an elderly Chinese tour group (which was just about the right pace for us!) Up and down we went, viewing the stalactites and stalagmites illuminated by colored lights.

Then we drove to town and got some good photographs of Moon Hill, which we declined to climb! We were headed for a local farm restaurant favored by Lilly, but it turned out they were closed due to a death in the family. Mr. Tang came to the rescue by recommending the Moon Family Restaurant, a rustic two story eatery with views of Moon Hill. Lilly had recommended eating Beer Fish in the countryside, so this was the perfect time to try the local specialty. We ordered a double order of Beer Fish, Rice and Bamboo with Egg which fed the four of us (and could have probably fed four more) plus two cokes for 114 RMB� a single order probably would have sufficed!)

After lunch we drove to the Dragon Bridge and embarked on a small bamboo raft cruise down the Yulong River. The raft looked a little skimpy, but we sat in the bamboo seats, put on our life jackets, and prepared for the worst. There were lots of people in rafts. I thought, �wow, we have lots of company going down the river,� but it turned out that all of these Chinese tourists were only going as far as the first cataract, and then turned around and went back. When I saw that, I wondered what we had gotten ourselves into.

We were fairly alone on the river after that, but if we saw other people on rafts, we all waved. If the word �cataract� sounds alarming, considering we were in a small, lightweight raft, you�re right � it sounded alarming to me, too, but after our guy (who was poling the raft downriver standing behind us ) maneuvered the raft over the first one, admonishing us to pick up our feet (not sure how since he didn�t speak English, but he did shout �hello� each time we approached another cataract (I guess in case we didn�t hear it or see it, which we certainly had no trouble doing). If we didn�t pick up our feet, we would have had wet feet, so it�s good that we followed directions and stayed dry. At any rate, the cataracts were fairly small (although one was sort of the granddaddy of cataracts for the Yulong and was double the drop of the others) and our boat guy (known to Lilly) was skillful. He even turned the raft around so we could photograph the bigger cataract and get scenery behind us from time to time) and we bumped over each one and otherwise began to relax and enjoy the scenery.

And what scenery it was! We loved the hour and a half ride on the Yulong and would highly recommend it. The view was gorgeous and we felt as though we were in another world. DH said it made him think of �Jurassic Park.� The Karst Mountains were all around us, the water glistened, the meadows on either side of the river were verdant and there was a never-ending array of little rural scenes � small huts, people washing clothes in the river, grandmothers �babysitting� water buffalo on their lunch breaks (the water buffalo�s lunch that is).

When the ride ended, we seemed to be in the middle of nowhere. I was wondering which way to walk when Lilly appeared to lead us back to town. She lead us across rice paddies, past water buffalo on narrow paths (very close encounters with water buffalo!), and along fields where farmers were planting what Lilly called �baby rices.� These were the rice shoots, which were taken out of the frames in which they were grown, and planted in the mud. We arrived at an ancient village and wandered around and then we got to a new village. In all, our walk took about an hour and by the time we got to the car we were tired and sweaty and glad Mr. Tang had air conditioning. Most disconcerting discovery of the walk � the farmers with their water buffalo and ancient farming methods all seemed to carry cell phones!

When we got to Yangshuo we opted for some KFC. This was Lilly and Mr. Tang�s first visit and they enjoyed their wings and fries. Lilly recommended the ice cream, and much to my surprise, it was pretty good. Total for dinner � 66 RMB.

Then it was off to �Impression Liu Sanjie.� Lilly had fixed us up for group discounts, which meant we needed to get our tickets with a group of 18 other people put together by a local agent. Told to stand in a particular area and go with a woman with a yellow flag, we weren�t sure what would come next. While we were standing there we met a nice couple from the Netherlands and chatted about our visit. Then we were all given stickers and marched in following the flag lady. Outside the ticket offices, we waited while someone went in to retrieve our tickets, which were then distributed. The group scattered and I suddenly realized I didn�t know where to go. We followed the crowd and finally I saw a sign that said �Even seats.� Looking at the tickets we had been given, I thought I could make out the numbers designating the seats (it was dark!) and so we went in the �even� direction. When I showed the tickets to the person at the barrier, she walked us down to our seats � Row 6, Seats 40 and 42 � yep, even alright. We got the cheapest tickets (188 RMB) and figured they might not be very good. Both of us were amazed because it seemed as if the entire show was right in front of us. I think the most expensive seats were in the back (on top), but we were in a better position and able to see everything perfectly well. Both of us were surprised by how good the show was � a spectacle involving fishermen on boats, lovely maidens in gorgeous costumes, a love story about a maiden from one of the minority groups (ala Romeo and Juliet) and her beau, and laser lights glowing on the surrounding mountains. It would have helped if there had been an English translation of what was going on (if not in the narration then at least in the printed material considering that many in the audience did not understand Chinese), but aside from that, it was terrific. While we were watching the show I sat there thinking about how great it was to be in Yangshuo. We walked back out and found Lilly and Mr. Tang, who drove us back after our long, exhausting, great day.


Friday, April 18 � Breakfast on the terrace � Another lovely, warm, day�. This time we tried the French Toast and Pear Juice (56 RMB). We chatted with two of the lovely young people who work at Li River Retreat � this morning it was Jasmine and Steve who became our English pupils.

Today Lilly would not be joining us because her son had developed a bronchial infection and needed to spend a few nights in the hospital getting tested and receiving intravenous antibiotics. Mr. Tang would take us for our second river cruise � this time on the Li River.

We left at 11 for Xingping, where we climbed down the rocks and boarded the little bamboo raft. This was a little bigger than the one from the previous day and had a small motor on the back � DH noted that it was like a lawn mower motor (or something along those lines.) Once again there were bamboo seats and life jackets. This time our boatman gave us oranges to munch on. The Li River trip we took was longer than the one on the Yulong and cost slightly more, but both river rides were inexpensive and quite a bit less expensive than the big boats from Guilin (which supply lunch although most people say the food isn�t very good.) We went upriver viewing scenery pointed out by the boatman with more �hellos� to indicate with a finger pointed in the right direction what we should be noting (mostly hills resembling a camel or a turkey or some such).

I can only describe the Li River scenery as idyllic� mountains, trees, grass, crops, little houses, ducks, water buffalo, and cormorant fishermen. At one point we pulled up to a little island where people were frying fish� had I realized it was fish, I probably would have tried it, but since I didn�t know what food was on offer, we passed up the eating opportunities and concentrated on the scenery. More scenery went by including several people washing their clothes in the river. More old people were grazing and watering their buffalo. One wouldn�t drink and the old woman kept prodding him with a stick. Occasionally Chinese people on rafts (some built for four or six people instead of two) went by and we all smiled and waved to each other, happy to be on the river.

At the end of our journey, Mr. Tang was once again waiting to pick us up and ferry us back. At the beginning of the morning and along the way Lilly called Mr.Tang and spoke with us to make sure we were happy with the way the day was going.

We went into the town and had lunch at Kelly�s. I was somewhat surprised to find out that Kelly is a lovely young Chinese woman who runs a great restaurant (and not some Irish guy.) She is very hospitable and although we just met, we were very well taken care of. For lunch we had Sweet and Sour Chicken, Fried Dumplings and Rice with diet soda the total was 57 RMB and we enjoyed the lunch. While we were eating, Lilly showed up and ate some chicken with us. Then she walked us to the Bank of China ATM (there are two in town). A lady tried valiantly to sell DH picture cards. At the end she was happy and DH was happy because he decided to pay her one yuan to look at her pictures. I tried some gelato (not bad.) Some students were on a scavenger hunt for foreign coins and I did my best to find some US money, but the coins weren�t in my bag so they were out of luck. Then we rode with Mr. Tang back to the hotel, where we put our feet up and relaxed with good books.

At this point in the trip I was reading a wonderful book called �Wuhu Diary.� This book, by Emily Prager (who is a college classmate of mine), tells the story of her adoption of a Chinese daughter and the visit she made with that daughter to Shanghai and back to Wuhu, where the little girl was abandoned and taken into an orphanage. It�s a beautiful book and the descriptions of the people and the places enriched my understanding of Chinese culture and customs.

I also spent some time on the computer and hung out for a while with Jasmine and Steve, who were joined by Diana and Summer. It seems that all of them live in a dorm behind the hotel. Diana and Summer work in Alf�s other property, The Buffalo Bar, which is in Yangshuo town. Sometimes Jasmine works there, too. Alf is the proprietor of the Li River Resort and everyone seems to love him. We ran into him a few times and he was always very friendly and welcoming. I also had a very favorable impression of him from the reservation process. When I reserved the rooms I asked about sending him credit card information and he assured me that people are generally trustworthy and no card was necessary. When I did see him, he greeted me by name, although we only met a few times.

We were still pretty full from Kelly�s lunch, so we just had some Spring Rolls, Fried Rice and a soda and some ice cream for DH (48 RMB.) When I checked my email I was happy to find a note from our son, who reported he had won $50 in a college poker contest (with no word on his grades or his courses or anything remotely academic!) Once again we had an early night.

Saturday, April 19 � Breakfast on the terrace was Banana Pancakes for me and the American set breakfast for DH for a total of 55 RMB. I had arranged with Lilly for a 9:45 pick-up from Mr. Tang. Some people walk into town, but it is a fairly long walk and you have to walk past all the ladies setting up their stalls. Somehow I fell into the habit of using Mr. Tang�s services and since he was so reliable (and felt by this time sort of like a friend even though we didn�t speak each other�s language) it was easier to just use the car.

Lilly had arranged a visit for me at a local school. I thought it was going to be a school for small children, so I was surprised to find out it was a school for English Language Learners (The Outdoor Spoken Language School). Simon, the Director and Owner is a very friendly and cheerful fellow, and I enjoyed meeting him and some of his students. I spent about an hour chatting with Chan, Susan, Yoyo, May and Jessica, among others. They were all in their 20�s and had enrolled in this school to enhance their job prospects. Later we were joined by Hubert, a retired Chemist from Montreal. We chatted about the students' interests, jobs, and plans for the future. Jessica speaks excellent English and I told her she would make a good tour guide. She then said she had only been in Yangshuo one week (and didn�t know the area) which led to my telling them the story of Rebecca and the Hangzhou bus (sorry Rebecca!)

Hubert walked me over to Kelly�s Café (my home-away-from-home in Yangshuo town) and joined me for lunch. We started chatting with Jim (from Seattle), who is staying in Yangshuo for three months. Based on Jim�s assurance that it�s okay to eat �mayonnaise� at Kelly�s, I ordered a tuna sandwich, French Fries, and a Diet Coke. I put �mayonnaise� in quotation marks because it was the strangest tasting mayonnaise I�ve ever had. It was tasty, though, and it didn�t cause any ill effects.

After lunch I walked over to Dr. Lilly Li�s for my massage appointment. Dr. Lilly had a white lab coat on when I met her and she bills herself as �Dr. Lilly Li� but I don�t know what sort of credential she may have. I had asked Lilly Lu (our guide) for a recommendation and she brought me her friend, another Lilly (and told me there are five Lilly�s altogether in Yanghsuo that she knows of). Dr. Lilly gave me a choice of two types of massage � therapeutic and relaxing, and assigned �Ant� to do my massage. She noted that he doesn�t like his name (who would?) and off we went. I had an oil massage (after reading about some therapeutic massages (See Fried Eggs with Chopsticks, for example, I opted for the relaxing one), but throughout the massage I kept thinking that if this was the relaxing massage, the therapeutic one must be excruciating. As Ant pummeled me, I kept wondering if I�d have bruises (and if DH would notice) and if this massage would cure my plantar fasciitis (which would have made it worthwhile, but unfortunately it didn�t.) Would it cure the mild back pain I�d acquired from lugging my suitcases around? (No). Then he did some foot reflexology (which was actually easier� unless I�d just become inured to the pain by that time. At any rate, it was interesting and inexpensive.

When I came down, Dr. Lilly was working with a guy from Barcelona on her website. They asked me my opinion and I surprised him by speaking Spanish. He said he rarely finds anyone who can speak Spanish in China. He was especially surprised that I liked to eat at Cal Pep (which is one of my favorite places to eat in the whole world at the moment.)

I went out and returned to Kelly�s to meet Mr. Tang. He knew my massage would end at 3, but for some reason neither Lilly nor Mr. Tang factored in the market and the street closing. Lilly called me at Kelly�s to say Mr. Tang would pick me up at 4 instead and that was fine with me because I could spend a little time browsing the market in town. I ended up buying three silk scarves from two funny ladies and a baby outfit at another stall. Then back to Kelly�s, where my friend Molly, the waitress, forgot to mention that Lilly had called to say it would be 4:30 to make certain we could get through. Lilly Lu showed up at 4:20 and let me know why Mr. Tang hadn�t yet made an appearance. I didn�t mind� I was sitting there watching the world go by.

At 4:30 on the dot Mr. Tang showed up and off we went to the Li River Retreat. When I got back I read for a while and then went to talk to Ellen and Matthew about their travels. DH came down and we ate Spring Rolls, Stuffed Fried Eggplant, Stir Fried Broccoli, plus a Beer and a Coke for 94 RMB.

We were joined by our new best friends, Jasmine, Steve, and Summer. After dinner we had our last English lesson. Then Luna and I chatted about her plans to open a hotel some day and we both looked at reviews for several local hotels on Trip Advisor. We took some pictures, hugged Jasmine (who had to leave early in the morning to help Alf at the Buffalo Bar) and promised to keep in touch.

We had only spent four days at the Li River Retreat, but it had begun to feel like home. We were sad to say goodbye to our friends, but it was time to go and see the Longji Rice Terraces. We made plans for a 9 am pick-up by Lilly and Mr. Tang and went to bed early so we would be well rested for our climb up the mountain.

cloudeleven

wiselindag,

How early would you recommend checking in for a domestic flight in China? Do they close check-in an hour before departure?

wiselindag

Most often they seemed to close check-in half an hour before flight time, but if you read the whole report, you know that they closed earlier than that in Guangzhou. I would plan to be at the airport two hours before flight time. I would never have imagined that before I left, but based on our experiences sometimes you need the extra time either because lines for check-in are long or because security lines can be very long.

It's much better to be early and have to wait a while to check in or wait at the gate for the flight than to miss a flight! I learned that the hard way.

When you get to the airport, check for a big board listing flights. Often that's how you can find out where your line is for check-in. If there isn't a big board, look for a smaller board in the area of your airline counters.

You can also check with one of the "Information Ladies" sometimes posted near the entrance, but make sure she uses a computer to get the answer, and as we always say, then trust but verify. Our first "Information Lady" totally threw us off on where to go. Sometimes we also saw women walking around with sashes. Apparently they were also there to assist travelers.

Good luck!
Linda

rkkwan

Check-in for Chinese domestic flights in general open 90 minutes before flight time and officially closed 30 minutes before flight time. You don't need to be there 2 hours.

However, 30 minutes is really not enough. China has pretty strict security screening and the lines can be long at times. And then they often <b>close the flights early</b> because many flights don't leave from a jetway; rather the passengers have to bussed out. So, sometimes they will close the flight 15-20 minutes early to allow for the bus trip, though you will never get told.

wiselindag

RK, You are probably right and 60-90 minutes is enough most of the time, but if we'd had 90 minutes at Pudong I don't know if we would have made our flight. First we needed to change terminals; then we had a line for check-in; then the security lines were so long that it took at least half an hour to get through, and then it was a hike to the gate (which they changed, so we had to go to yet another place).

You are an experienced China traveler; we were not and as you know from the Trip Report, we had a series of adventures in airports, so I plan to continue to leave lots of extra time. One of the problems I had in missing the first flight was that I read many accounts by travelers saying how great and efficient Chinese airports are and how they were &quot;whisked&quot; through check-in. I just want to counter-balance that notion a little bit so no one else makes the same mistake I did.

Of course it also depends on when you fly - Fridays and holidays are busier and later in the day the security lines can build up. Your point about taking people to planes on buses is a good one -- I hadn't thought of that... another reason it can take longer and flights may close earlier than advertised.

Linda

cloudeleven

Linda,

How long was the walk from the end of the Yulong raft trip back to town? More than a mile? How long did it take?